The rules allow them. No one disputes that (We just wish they didn't
). That doesn't prove that the people of the OTU use them except in rare cases. What's your evidence that they are in widespread use in the Third Imperium setting?Hans
Commercial ship crewing
- Thread starter HG_B
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). That doesn't prove that the people of the OTU use them except in rare cases. What's your evidence that they are in widespread use in the Third Imperium setting?Hans
The rules allow them. No one disputes that (We just wish they didn't
Hans
Proof? Last time I was on Regina the ships docking at the Up port were crawling with them. Unless you want to call me a liar. In which case choose a time and place.
My guess (again, maybe I'm too traditional) is that for positions that treat with sophonts (stewards, medics, etc...) customers feel more comfortable with other sphponts (preferible their own race, probably) than with machines (as much capable as they can be).
As for other positions (pilot, engineer, etc) either the robots are self-aware (and will also ask for a pay and privileges, in one way or another) or they are too basic in their intelligence (so no true intelligence in the way of creative thought, so unreliable in unexpected situations) and too easy to hacker (if they are not self aware enough as to care for their safety, they may be used as suicide squads if hacked). While a sentient may also be a suicide, it's harder to find it in self-aware beings.
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Agreed!
Some mix of the breakdown excuse and the people-want-to-see-people-crew excuse.
That must have been the Regina in your TU. The last time I was on Regina, the ships docking at the upport had few or none. That's the Regina in my TU, of course, and no more evidence against than yours is evidence for. However, I can't recall any official adventure that mentions a robot crewman, let alone multiple robot crewmen.
Why would I call you a liar? In your TU you define the truth.Unless you want to call me a liar. In which case choose a time and place.
Hans
Joking.
That's the prob with the OTU. Every time an new edition changes something major the "history" doesn't match the technology. It happened with MT, T4 and probably with T5.
That HAD been my approach up until a few years ago and I looked at where tech is really taking us. The driver-less auto is what pushed me over. At that point I knew that people will be used to that type of automation within 100 years. Much less thousands of years from now.
mike wightman
SOC-14 10K
How do you feel about the crew of the ship staying on the ground and using remote control to fly the ship out to jump, at the far end it transmits its arrival and the landing crew take over.
While in jump space the robots look after stuff.
Traveller for the x-box generation... (by which I mean the in-universe crew are playing on their x-boxes/playstations to remotely pilot stuff - much like the US does with military drones these days)
While in jump space the robots look after stuff.
Traveller for the x-box generation... (by which I mean the in-universe crew are playing on their x-boxes/playstations to remotely pilot stuff - much like the US does with military drones these days
)
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I LONG ago intro'ed into MTU the need for a self-aware Bridge crew member to be present during Jump, a la Niven's universe. In addition I use MgT jump accuracy rules. That means that not infrequently. you jump in and are 1-6 days travel time from your intended destination. That increases the need for a sentient decision maker on board.
That's really quite clever. Fly by wire is normal now, so how much more in the future?
That sort of thing could be contracted to the Starport Control Tower's banks upon banks of computers/semi-organic brains/whatever.
I may not like it -- it may not be my particular brand of Space Opera -- but it makes a lot of sense.
How do you feel about the crew of the ship staying on the ground and using remote control to fly the ship out to jump, at the far end it transmits its arrival and the landing crew take over.
While in jump space the robots look after stuff.
Traveller for the x-box generation... (by which I mean the in-universe crew are playing on their x-boxes/playstations to remotely pilot stuff - much like the US does with military drones these days
But to make this feasible you need a mínimum starport at each end, making the systems without them even more isolated than they already are...
I am a bit surprised about how quickly driverless cars seem to be coming on.
My understanding (from commercial pilot acquaintances) is autopilot tech is at the stage where autopilot could handle an entire plane journey, apart from one thing: the human crew need to do technical checks on the plane before takeoff (I may be off here and am open to being corrected). The crew are likely to take the checks seriously because they will also be on the plane.
Which is kind of why I'd gone with the "people like to see people crew" argument. But you're right, driverless cars drive a coach and horses (so to speak) through it.
re. remote controlled ships out to jump limit - nice idea. There will be a bit of lightlag though - about 4 seconds at safe jump limit for a size 8 world. Might not matter too much?
From a technical standpoint it is MUCH simpler to auto pilot a starship out to 100D than it is to auto pilot a commercial airliner across the country. But, that being said I don't like automated jump ships. And you Droyne, get off my lawn.
I don't think people will accept (in my lifetime) pilot-less aircraft that they are flying on.
In MgT artificial self awareness doesn't exist by TL 15. (caveat: I don't own every minor MgT supp.)
That's ok, I wanted to know what the core rules say. I was expecting the answer you gave -- the rules are internally consistent. A supplement which says otherwise would still have to come to terms with the core rules about robots in minor crew positions.
Taken from another thread:
I know that can be arged, but IMHO most passenger crew (stewards, security, medical1) will fall into this cathegory.
I know that can be arged, but IMHO most passenger crew (stewards, security, medical1) will fall into this cathegory.
note 1: autodocs are defined in MgT (and IIRC in other Traveller versions too), but I'd put them in the cathegory of augmentation,but not replacement). While they can be enough for a small ship, a large ship with full (or nearly so) medical facilities should have sentient personnel too.
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For high paying passengers that require that kind of personal attention/interaction, most likely. On the thread you are pulling from I listed security (police) already as needing humans) Medical bots are expert systems used to diagnose and treat the body. For a psychologist, yes. Emergency medicine (like auto-doc's) no. You are confusing mechanical skill with emotional skill. A med bot is like an engineering bot.
Here is the post being referenced http://www.travellerrpg.com/CotI/Discuss/showthread.php?t=33520
I know you listed pólice/security as such, and I included it in the quote.
I agree emergency medicine could be cared by an autodoc, but for any other treatment, emotions are as important as temperature or blood presure for a good diagnostic. That's why I said an autodoc could do in a small ship, but not for large medical facilities.
As much as your body works with the predictability of a machine. Biology uses to be less predictable, and so a not small part of intuitive/creative reasoning (something I understand robots are not capable until true self-awareness is reached) is needed to discern among true symptoms and somatizing emotional states.
By clicking at the quote reference (the arrow in the quote) you'd also reach it, but thanks anyway.
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