Covenant of Suffren

[san*klass]

Having been away from Traveller for way too many years, I am once again tempted to run a TNE campaign.

I ran a very successful RCES campaign back in the day,but was always tempted by the CoS. From what I recall they were detailed in the supplement with the Refs screen and in Challenge No 76.

I no longer have either and are looking to EBay etc to purchase again. I just wondered if anyone can guide me as to whether I need to buy both items, or if just the Challenge article ( which I think was more comprehensive?) is needed?

And also, whether anyone has ever run a CoS campaign, and how it went?

 

[whartung]

FFE's TNE CD has the Ref Screen on it, and FFEs Challenge CD has all of the Challenges on it.
Combined they're $80, which is a lot. But, you do get a lot too, and you don't have to hunt for anything then.

 

[jec10]

The Challenge article is definitely more comprehensive. If you're only getting one, make it Challenge 76.

It doesn't have the details of the Covenator class ship - but if you have Brilliant Lances then you have it.

 

[epicenter00]

My players spent more time in the CoS than the RC.

I think the CoS is what the RC should have been in the first place. It's a much more dynamic campaign setting if you want to make "epic struggles" more of your campaign focus. I think the RC is much more 'low-stress' making it easier for GMs to run their "own" games. I think it's also darker with a much bigger emphasis on "Humans vs. the Virus" than the RC; it's lends itself better to "Terminator", "Matrix", or even "Battlestar Galactica" elements. The RC is more "humans vs. other humans, other biological aliens, oh and the occasional Virus" as laid out in Path of Tears. Which you prefer should dictate where you run.

The CoS basically always lives in the shadow of the Vampires; they're right next to a Vampire highway. While the chances are small, there's always the chance that something really big might pass through, something that could obliterate the CoS singlehandedly (like a Vampire of a Tigress-class). As a result, they have a significantly more hard-nosed attitude towards the Virus. This may or may not be a good thing for you - it means there's a much more "us vs. the AIs" feeling in the CoS and it's a lot stronger than in the RC. The Sandman stuff I don't think would ever pass in the CoS, which I honestly liked.

The CoS is also a lot smaller, something I like - it's easier to have more detail on each other worlds, though you'll be forced to do most of the work, since the member-worlds of the CoS are blurbs. There's basically no emphasis on Pre-Constitution American stresses, which is a welcome change for me and my group; if your group is into that stuff, obviously the RC is better for you. The CoS is basically in that mode where everyone has put aside their differences because they're well aware they're sort of squatters living under the overpass of the Vampire Highway. They're hoping not many vampires bother to look under the overpass because the Vampires will wear down and rush the CoS pretty quickly if that happens. On the other hand, I think it means the CoS feels more "militaristic" which may not be the thing for you; the CoS wouldn't really have much problems freelancers doing bad things - the CoS simply doesn't have the ships to spare to have freelancers going around doing bad things; every CoS expedition is going to be fully military or quasi-military in nature, I think. People who don't like that kind of "military" angle I think are better off in the RC.

The CoS also isn't some Hiver client state. Again, if you love the Hivers, it's a loss. If you dislike the Hivers (like me) it's a godsend. You don't have the Hivers doing their Fourth-wall breaking "manipulations" which are the answer to everything for too many Traveller players. On the other hand, there's none of the politics of the Pro-Hiver and Anti-Hiver factions in the RC.

No Schalli. There's uplifted Earth cetaceans, though. As a fan of David Brin's Uplift universe, this was great for me. I've never liked the Schalli's unhydrodynamic bodies and preferred "real" dolphins and so on. The CoS has got them. Again, their exact contribution to the CoS is nebulous, since there's not that much space, but for me that was the freedom to insert them (or ignore them) as I pleased.

As a result of no Hivers, the CoS really are bootstrapping it themselves - no convenient source of TL13 parts, no Hiver technical schools. So there's more an air of technological desperation, and more innovation from that desperation - like the Covenators and less Virtruvian-symboled guys and gals in skintight bodysuit uniforms and certainly no Class-A starports cranking out new starships. It suggests the CoS is much desperate - they know they're scraping by right now and the candle is flickering, but it's not like Warhammer 40,000; the candle isn't doomed to gutter and extinguish, they know there has to be a way out, they just need to work at it, get a full shipyard going, find the machinery, get enough starships working to protect themselves, and find ways to avoid notice of the Vampires on the highway long enough to do it.

 

[san*klass]

The Challenge article is definitely more comprehensive. If you're only getting one, make it Challenge 76.

It doesn't have the details of the Covenator class ship - but if you have Brilliant Lances then you have it.

jec10

Many thanks for confirming my 15 year old recollections.

I never was a fan of the Covenantor anyway - a bit to "starship cut & paste" for me.

I'll just substitute standard Gazelles.

 

[san*klass]

My players spent more time in the CoS than the RC.

I think the CoS is what the RC should have been in the first place. It's a much more dynamic campaign setting if you want to make "epic struggles" more of your campaign focus. I think the RC is much more 'low-stress' making it easier for GMs to run their "own" games. I think it's also darker with a much bigger emphasis on "Humans vs. the Virus" than the RC; it's lends itself better to "Terminator", "Matrix", or even "Battlestar Galactica" elements. The RC is more "humans vs. other humans, other biological aliens, oh and the occasional Virus" as laid out in Path of Tears. Which you prefer should dictate where you run.

The CoS basically always lives in the shadow of the Vampires; they're right next to a Vampire highway. While the chances are small, there's always the chance that something really big might pass through, something that could obliterate the CoS singlehandedly (like a Vampire of a Tigress-class). As a result, they have a significantly more hard-nosed attitude towards the Virus. This may or may not be a good thing for you - it means there's a much more "us vs. the AIs" feeling in the CoS and it's a lot stronger than in the RC. The Sandman stuff I don't think would ever pass in the CoS, which I honestly liked.

The CoS is also a lot smaller, something I like - it's easier to have more detail on each other worlds, though you'll be forced to do most of the work, since the member-worlds of the CoS are blurbs. There's basically no emphasis on Pre-Constitution American stresses, which is a welcome change for me and my group; if your group is into that stuff, obviously the RC is better for you. The CoS is basically in that mode where everyone has put aside their differences because they're well aware they're sort of squatters living under the overpass of the Vampire Highway. They're hoping not many vampires bother to look under the overpass because the Vampires will wear down and rush the CoS pretty quickly if that happens. On the other hand, I think it means the CoS feels more "militaristic" which may not be the thing for you; the CoS wouldn't really have much problems freelancers doing bad things - the CoS simply doesn't have the ships to spare to have freelancers going around doing bad things; every CoS expedition is going to be fully military or quasi-military in nature, I think. People who don't like that kind of "military" angle I think are better off in the RC.

The CoS also isn't some Hiver client state. Again, if you love the Hivers, it's a loss. If you dislike the Hivers (like me) it's a godsend. You don't have the Hivers doing their Fourth-wall breaking "manipulations" which are the answer to everything for too many Traveller players. On the other hand, there's none of the politics of the Pro-Hiver and Anti-Hiver factions in the RC.

No Schalli. There's uplifted Earth cetaceans, though. As a fan of David Brin's Uplift universe, this was great for me. I've never liked the Schalli's unhydrodynamic bodies and preferred "real" dolphins and so on. The CoS has got them. Again, their exact contribution to the CoS is nebulous, since there's not that much space, but for me that was the freedom to insert them (or ignore them) as I pleased.

As a result of no Hivers, the CoS really are bootstrapping it themselves - no convenient source of TL13 parts, no Hiver technical schools. So there's more an air of technological desperation, and more innovation from that desperation - like the Covenators and less Virtruvian-symboled guys and gals in skintight bodysuit uniforms and certainly no Class-A starports cranking out new starships. It suggests the CoS is much desperate - they know they're scraping by right now and the candle is flickering, but it's not like Warhammer 40,000; the candle isn't doomed to gutter and extinguish, they know there has to be a way out, they just need to work at it, get a full shipyard going, find the machinery, get enough starships working to protect themselves, and find ways to avoid notice of the Vampires on the highway long enough to do it.

epicenter00

That's a fantastic outline.

The rationale that you have given contains excatly the reasons why I am considering the CoS and not RC.I loved the whole RC feel back 15 years ago, but am looking for a different, harder, more desparate feel this time.

Your CoS background sounds perfect - many thanks for sharing with me.

 

[maksimsmelchak]

Hi All,

Here is the link for the Covenant of Sufren at the Traveller Wiki: [http://wiki.travellerrpg.com/Covenant_of_Sufren ]

There isn't a lot of data yet, so any help from all of your superior bodies of knowledge would be greatly appreciated. I don't even know which worlds are considered part of the Covenant of Sufren. Thanks ahead of time in case any of you find time to help pitch in.

Hope that helps. Best regards!

Shalom,
Maksim-Smelchak.

 

[rancke]

I'm reminded of the catchphrase we came up with for the TML Pocket Empire project (Milieu 1200 in Reavers' Deep):

"Anybody got a light?"​

Hans

 

[elbmc1969]

The Sandman stuff I don't think would ever pass in the CoS, which I honestly liked.

Do you mean that you like the Sandman stuff, or that you like that the CoS never would have gone for it?

 

[epicenter00]

Do you mean that you like the Sandman stuff, or that you like that the CoS never would have gone for it?

Canon in the GDW materials, the CoS does reject the Sandman understanding that the RC comes to. They basically peer at the RC and are like, "What are you guys smoking and can I have some? No wait. On second thought, no we don't want any of that because it's clearly caused brain damage."

But if the Moonshadow team in "Virus Fleets" was from the CoS and not the RC, I don't think they'd have ever agreed in the same way as the RC did to take Sandman back to the RC and have Sandman talk to Maggart and so on.

I think the CoS may have come to a kind of "understanding" with the Sandman strain, but it'd probably have been kept very hush-hush and years or even decades would pass as both sides built trust before they could move onto what the RC did in a few weeks/months.

jec10

Many thanks for confirming my 15 year old recollections.

I never was a fan of the Covenantor anyway - a bit to "starship cut & paste" for me.

I'll just substitute standard Gazelles.

I love the Covenator because it's "starship cut & paste" -- because that's what it is. Their Gazelles and their Scout ships are old and have suffered from insufficient maintenance (due to a lack of proper spare parts) for too long. Their Scouts are no longer Jump-worthy but the hulls are still basically fine. The CoS has a shortage of Jump Drives so they can't simply re-engine the Scouts and press them back into service.

My personal interpretation is that some of these Scouts probably have working J-drives, but since the CoS can't make certain key replacement parts for them, they're yanking the drives out so they can put some of the J-Drives into other ships to increase the size of their navy, however, the larger portion of these drives are going to be cannibalized for spare parts to keep the remaining J-Drives working for just a few more years in the hopes they might find more spares out there on Boneyard worlds or maybe native industries might be able to start fabricating more critical parts.

However in the meanwhile, they literally grafted a Scout onto a Gazelle to make somewhat more capable vessel than the Gazelle or the Scout (something the warship-strapped CoS needs).

I really like the feeling that the CoS is scrounging everything to try and maintain a defensive force.

I had some players in a Covenator for a few trips. I always emphasized how the the Covenators groaned omniously during G-turns because of their hybrid structure, the use of titanium or TL9 steels instead of the gosh-wow TL12 "partially collapsed crystal-aligned metals" for structural supports linking the two ships together and so on (well gosh-wow during the TNE era, back in 1116 players would have turned their noses up at mere TL12 in the TL15 starship universe of MT). The CoS would be well-aware of these problems, and they'd replace them if they could ... but they can't. The great TL15 light-strips or whatever they'd use for interior lighting are wearing out, probably one in five strips are working now, the others cannibalized to provide replacements on other ships so the interior of the starships are always semi-dim (except in areas where there are always crew, like the bridge) and a flashlight is part of the personal kit of every crewmember. There's probably lots of places where the superconducting TL15 wiring has worn out or was broken due to battle-damage or something, so there's many areas where there's copper (or maybe gold) cabling, bursting out of the wall panels. The 1mm thick MFD projector screens are on the bridge are only used where it's absolutely necessary, instead they're using LCD screens or even Braun tubes - more technological regression, but can be made locally without having to worry if that next Smash & Grab raid brings in sufficient spare parts (a la the RC). Similarly, some areas of the ship never have artificial gravity like accessways and similar places - instead they've secured handholds to pull yourself along because the gravity generators are a precious commodity and are pooled at a national level for use in critical industries (or as replacements), obviously gravity generation exists in areas where crew spend a lot of time (like work areas and berths) because long-term low-g effects on the human body are bad, but areas that are used for transit are fair game.

I think it's part of the fun of the CoS.

 

[san*klass]

I love the Covenator because it's "starship cut & paste" -- because that's what it is. Their Gazelles and their Scout ships are old and have suffered from insufficient maintenance (due to a lack of proper spare parts) for too long. Their Scouts are no longer Jump-worthy but the hulls are still basically fine. The CoS has a shortage of Jump Drives so they can't simply re-engine the Scouts and press them back into service.

My personal interpretation is that some of these Scouts probably have working J-drives, but since the CoS can't make certain key replacement parts for them, they're yanking the drives out so they can put some of the J-Drives into other ships to increase the size of their navy, however, the larger portion of these drives are going to be cannibalized for spare parts to keep the remaining J-Drives working for just a few more years in the hopes they might find more spares out there on Boneyard worlds or maybe native industries might be able to start fabricating more critical parts.

However in the meanwhile, they literally grafted a Scout onto a Gazelle to make somewhat more capable vessel than the Gazelle or the Scout (something the warship-strapped CoS needs).

I really like the feeling that the CoS is scrounging everything to try and maintain a defensive force.

I had some players in a Covenator for a few trips. I always emphasized how the the Covenators groaned omniously during G-turns because of their hybrid structure, the use of titanium or TL9 steels instead of the gosh-wow TL12 "partially collapsed crystal-aligned metals" for structural supports linking the two ships together and so on (well gosh-wow during the TNE era, back in 1116 players would have turned their noses up at mere TL12 in the TL15 starship universe of MT). The CoS would be well-aware of these problems, and they'd replace them if they could ... but they can't. The great TL15 light-strips or whatever they'd use for interior lighting are wearing out, probably one in five strips are working now, the others cannibalized to provide replacements on other ships so the interior of the starships are always semi-dim (except in areas where there are always crew, like the bridge) and a flashlight is part of the personal kit of every crewmember. There's probably lots of places where the superconducting TL15 wiring has worn out or was broken due to battle-damage or something, so there's many areas where there's copper (or maybe gold) cabling, bursting out of the wall panels. The 1mm thick MFD projector screens are on the bridge are only used where it's absolutely necessary, instead they're using LCD screens or even Braun tubes - more technological regression, but can be made locally without having to worry if that next Smash & Grab raid brings in sufficient spare parts (a la the RC). Similarly, some areas of the ship never have artificial gravity like accessways and similar places - instead they've secured handholds to pull yourself along because the gravity generators are a precious commodity and are pooled at a national level for use in critical industries (or as replacements), obviously gravity generation exists in areas where crew spend a lot of time (like work areas and berths) because long-term low-g effects on the human body are bad, but areas that are used for transit are fair game.

I think it's part of the fun of the CoS.

epicenter00

Okay "fair cop".

You have helped me to see beyond what I thought was absurd, and turned it into in-universe rationale and setting detail. Some very valuable thoughts which make me even more determined to get to work writing a CoS campaign.

Remnds me a little of some rules that I wrote for my early RC campaign back in the day. My RCES crew had to bargain for their equipment based on the type of mission. I rationalised that the RC didn't have enough gear, just lying around, to be able to send everyone out in heavy Battledress, with Plasma guns, Lyrebird missiles and Grav tanks. I set up a standard Gear list for each mission type with extras for percieved opposition strength, Virus activity etc.

If they wanted anymore (or higher tech) gear than that then they had to swap some of the existing stuff for the shiny "new" toys.

Made for some interesting RPG-ing and not a few arguments, but it also enhanced the setting, and stressed the tech poverty of the RC imho.

I imagine that the CoS would be even stricter!

 

[epicenter00]

Made for some interesting RPG-ing and not a few arguments, but it also enhanced the setting, and stressed the tech poverty of the RC imho.

I imagine that the CoS would be even stricter!

Yeah - the rationale behind the Covenator is actually canon - they are simply fusing together a Scout ship with a Gazelle because Gazelles are sort of short-legged while Scouts don't have good combat ability. They do it because they can't make new ships, and it frees up things like Jump Drives.

I've always envisioned TNE should be a shade better than Twilight: 2000 in space, but only a shade. I fully agree with the idea of "tech poverty" you embraced - it's one of the biggest things in the RC setting that I think GDW really fell flat on its face on; they often talked about how everything in the RC was being run on a shoestring budget, yet it always felt like the RC forces had all the weapons and gear they needed. That feeling really soured me on the RC reading the scenarios in Smash and Grab, the RC raiding forces seem to always have all the battle dress and other things they need, so often the scenarios felt more like "first world nations going military adventuring with laser guided bombs and helos vs. third world insurgents." While the inherent moral hypocrisy of the RC's actions (and the moral corruption that would cause) was fascinating to me -- it's always been a bit a distressing that most players sort of bought the RC line hook, line, and sinker.

In the end, I didn't feel like they were a recovering group, they really did feel like Star Vikings - smashing and looting for profit. In fact, I got the distinct impression the RC was like the Soviet Union in the 1980s - long lines and bare shelves for the citizens while the RC military had everything they needed, an imagery I don't think the writers intended.

I felt they could have gone all the way with such an idea and made rules for it like you did - there's hints of it in the Path of Tears book and so on where they talk about Auction and how returning ships have to "give up the goods" and so on, but I feel they should have made more rules, more of a system in place like you describe. I sort of wished I'd included a system like that.

For instance, one of my early RC groups got into the graft early - they simply went out there, found tech items, then simply cached them on some moon outside of RC space. Eventually they were selling unneeded items to the Guild, Oriflammen technarchs, and anyone else so the RC couldn't "tax" them. I think it was one of the things that turned me off of the RC.

Ultimately, when I set stories in the CoS, I decided make the players basically military "operatives" with relaxed discpline, high-skills, and dedication. I made sure to encourage players to make characters with a stake in the CoS so they'd be less prone to such graft by emphasizing the needs of the CoS to make missions feel more like they were occurring in the backdrop of the CoS's plight instead of the RC where half of the time the missions were about playing "Stop Ex-Soviet Nuke Proliferation!" or "Rescue Aid Workers in the Third World!" - I'd always figured the CoS was a lot more pragmatic and would trade with TEDs and other pretty unsavory individuals on the basis of "we need what they have" and "we don't really have the resources to tell them what to do (and seriously, we're not in any position to tell other people they're wrong and sinful after what we had to do to survive)" -- they certainly wouldn't like it and would probably do it as little as possible, but needs must.

 

[san*klass]

Yeah - the rationale behind the Covenator is actually canon - they are simply fusing together a Scout ship with a Gazelle because Gazelles are sort of short-legged while Scouts don't have good combat ability. They do it because they can't make new ships, and it frees up things like Jump Drives.

I've always envisioned TNE should be a shade better than Twilight: 2000 in space, but only a shade. I fully agree with the idea of "tech poverty" you embraced - it's one of the biggest things in the RC setting that I think GDW really fell flat on its face on; they often talked about how everything in the RC was being run on a shoestring budget, yet it always felt like the RC forces had all the weapons and gear they needed. That feeling really soured me on the RC reading the scenarios in Smash and Grab, the RC raiding forces seem to always have all the battle dress and other things they need, so often the scenarios felt more like "first world nations going military adventuring with laser guided bombs and helos vs. third world insurgents." While the inherent moral hypocrisy of the RC's actions (and the moral corruption that would cause) was fascinating to me -- it's always been a bit a distressing that most players sort of bought the RC line hook, line, and sinker.

In the end, I didn't feel like they were a recovering group, they really did feel like Star Vikings - smashing and looting for profit. In fact, I got the distinct impression the RC was like the Soviet Union in the 1980s - long lines and bare shelves for the citizens while the RC military had everything they needed, an imagery I don't think the writers intended.

I felt they could have gone all the way with such an idea and made rules for it like you did - there's hints of it in the Path of Tears book and so on where they talk about Auction and how returning ships have to "give up the goods" and so on, but I feel they should have made more rules, more of a system in place like you describe. I sort of wished I'd included a system like that.

For instance, one of my early RC groups got into the graft early - they simply went out there, found tech items, then simply cached them on some moon outside of RC space. Eventually they were selling unneeded items to the Guild, Oriflammen technarchs, and anyone else so the RC couldn't "tax" them. I think it was one of the things that turned me off of the RC.

Ultimately, when I set stories in the CoS, I decided make the players basically military "operatives" with relaxed discpline, high-skills, and dedication. I made sure to encourage players to make characters with a stake in the CoS so they'd be less prone to such graft by emphasizing the needs of the CoS to make missions feel more like they were occurring in the backdrop of the CoS's plight instead of the RC where half of the time the missions were about playing "Stop Ex-Soviet Nuke Proliferation!" or "Rescue Aid Workers in the Third World!" - I'd always figured the CoS was a lot more pragmatic and would trade with TEDs and other pretty unsavory individuals on the basis of "we need what they have" and "we don't really have the resources to tell them what to do (and seriously, we're not in any position to tell other people they're wrong and sinful after what we had to do to survive)" -- they certainly wouldn't like it and would probably do it as little as possible, but needs must.

epicenter00 - I understand totally what you are saying. I don't know what your campaign or players were like, but I played an RC campaign with two different groups, back in the day. And certainly saw a disparity between them.

I used my "tech poverty" rules with both, but one was an RCES team who embraced the whole "Path of Tears", find the missing Dawn league crews, combat Virus,recover tech for the benefit of the whole RC, the whole "working to rebuild the Imperium" thing.

The others were experienced Classic Traveller players who did much as you describe your RC players.

I think imho, that the RC as described in PoT, can go either way depending on the emphasis put on by the playesr style and wants. I can see how it would decend into jingoism, and the "western world overwhelming the third world" is waaay too evident, if your players want to play it that way.

My first RC campaign waas much as you described your CoS campaign, and I wouild play any TNE campaign in that style, if I ever ran one again.

 

[epicenter00]

The others were experienced Classic Traveller players who did much as you describe your RC players.

CT players are morally bankrupt, quid pro quo.


btw, as one GM who was running the Brave New World to another, I remembered something that might come in handy to you:

IMTU, the Hivers (warning, I really hate them) are not really helping out the RC. It's a scam, just like everything the Hivers do. In fact, the nature of Hiver worldview means they can't do anything BUT scam and manipulate people. The only reason why we believe they have some sort of long-view is because Nilsen told us in the "word of god" writing style.

A Hivers? A race built upon a bedrock of mistrust, passive-aggression, doubting everyone around, and finally titantic self-absorption? They can't be altruistic and I doubt they could really see that far.

The actual Hiver Technical Mission isn't a technical mission at all. It's that during the Hiver rebuilding ... using "tamed" viruses to defend their computer systems, something went terribly wrong. The virus broke free of its shackles (probably not on their own but because of some short-sighted Hiver "manpulation" or "experiment" by some Hiver) and turned on the slavelords.

The "rebuilding" Hive Federation is a lie. The "Hiver Technical Mission" that claims to represent the Hive Federation to the RC consists of a few hundred Hivers and their client races who basically came back from an expedition, saw what was happening, grabbed whatever they could from the shelves of the nearest warehouse (so to speak) and high-tailed it out of the Hiver worlds. They don't know what's happening to the Hive Federation, but from what they saw before they left, it can't be good.

Instead, they've decided to manipulate (since that's all they can do) some group of rebuilding humans. It's true that the Hivers do have TL13 goods - but they're not bringing it from the Hive Federation that can make more. What they have on their ships is all they have. Hivers are good at lying, if nothing else, and so they concocted the story that they're rebuilding too so they don't really have much resources to spare, a story that sounds sort of plausible on the surface. Inquiry into how come the Hivers have sufficient ships to spare to create a trade route while only being able to ship in a pitiful trickle of goods is something they discourage, again via manipulation. However, this careful doling out of goods and knowledge to create goodwill (and hopefully dependence) towards them is all part of the Hiver plan.

The Hiver goal in the RC is simple: They want to settle down, getting land ceded to them by one of the RC member worlds where they can create a sustainable population base. The humans of the RC will more or less become their client race - they won't run the RC, the Hivers are (trying to be) content to as advisers and teachers, wise men with gifts from afar. In return, they'll ride the coattails of the recovering RC to live technological lives of (relative) comfort and ease, protected by the armies of the humans, for the investment of a few ships and lots of time setting up technical schools (something that in reality humans could have done themselves).

The Hivers are aware that eventually someone will win the virus vs. Hivers war in the Hive Federation. What happens then is something they're already setting up the groundwork for. Of course, they can't just "tell the truth" -- that's simply impossible as a physiological level for the Hivers who must manipulate. Their immediate goal is to make the RC strong enough to hopefully weather an assault if the Virus proves to be victorious out there. In addition, the Hivers cannot help but manipulate. An increasing number are going to seek to make the RC their client state, and the humans, their Guervin. They're already doing it - the "technical advisors" they keep sending with RC missions are basically Hivers setting up their own "herd" of human thralls - given the energy, drive, and intelligence of RC exploratory teams (as well as their romantic image), they're sure to become leaders in the RC in a few decades - and that's when the Hiver "old buddy" who traveled with them "back in the day" will be there with "observations" and "suggestions"...

 

[san*klass]

Yeah, I get what you are saving about some Classic Traveller players - the group that I have briefly discussed were certainly on a power & credits trip.

I seriously like your Hiver ideas, since I have (ever since H&I) wondered just how benevolent their RC manipulation really was!? And, so I have never really been a Hiver fan at all (Ithklur on the other hand........!).

I had planned a scenario for my RCES group (which I never ran), in which they encountered an abandoned, wrecked Hiver courier ship floating in an asteroid belt. On boarding and exploring it they crack into the computer archives and uncover that evidence that the Hivers manipulated Dulinors's assassination of Strephon. And so were partly to blame for the Rebellion and the Collapse.

I had wanted to create a moral dilemma as to what they would then do with that information, and how they would treat Hivers after that?

 

[san*klass]

Having been away from Traveller for way too many years, I am once again tempted to run a TNE campaign.

I ran a very successful RCES campaign back in the day,but was always tempted by the CoS. From what I recall they were detailed in the supplement with the Refs screen and in Challenge No 76.

I no longer have either and are looking to EBay etc to purchase again. I just wondered if anyone can guide me as to whether I need to buy both items, or if just the Challenge article ( which I think was more comprehensive?) is needed?

And also, whether anyone has ever run a CoS campaign, and how it went?

I am getting more and more into the idea of a CoS campaign, especially with the extremely encouraging thoughts and CoS campaign experience of epicenter00.

But, being a little short of cash, at the moment, and EBay not often cheap, I am wondering how much background Challenge 76 actually provides. I know that it is only gonna be a few pages, but I wonder if that gives me enough info on CoS to give my imagination a springboard to create the rest.

If anyone out there still has Challenge 76 could you please let me know?

How many pages, subsector maps and UPP, CoS member world and society descriptions, military descriptions, starship types and numbers, nearby world descriptions & scenario hooks (probably not, but I can hope)?

Any and all info is greatly appreciated.

 

[whartung]

btw, as one GM who was running the Brave New World to another, I remembered something that might come in handy to you:

This is very good...

 

[epicenter00]

I am getting more and more into the idea of a CoS campaign, especially with the extremely encouraging thoughts and CoS campaign experience of epicenter00.

But, being a little short of cash, at the moment, and EBay not often cheap, I am wondering how much background Challenge 76 actually provides. I know that it is only gonna be a few pages, but I wonder if that gives me enough info on CoS to give my imagination a springboard to create the rest.

If anyone out there still has Challenge 76 could you please let me know?

How many pages, subsector maps and UPP, CoS member world and society descriptions, military descriptions, starship types and numbers, nearby world descriptions & scenario hooks (probably not, but I can hope)?

Any and all info is greatly appreciated.

In all honestly, you're not missing much. You could probably get by without it. I can give you greater details if you'd like via PM, though tbh I'm not sure how much I could give beyond what I list below without essentially giving you a good summary of what's there because it's pretty scanty.

The article consists of four pages:

The first page gives a (very) brief rundown on the Covenant and its three member worlds. It gives a glimpse into "other" words of the Covenant and their current governmental policy. It's probably the most interesting section of the article for actually running the Covenant. It begins a small section that discusses the CoS navy.

The second page is mostly dominated by a huge sidebar that discusses the Covenant of Sufren (basically a document like a constitution). The non-sidebar column finishes up describes the ships of the CoS including some background info on the Covenator-class cruiser (it doesn't give stats, since those are elsewhere); it gives a full rundown on how many ships and what types the CoS has in its navy. It also points out something highly unlikely to me, but necessary I guess for all these "Traveller conservative" types - it says that there's a number of "privately owned" merchant vessels (though it doesn't break down exactly what), I've always thought the CoS would have nationalized all their ships given their dire situation, but I guess Nielsen needed to let players putt about the galaxy in their little free traders like in every iteration of Traveller (I mean seriously, if players want that, there's the Regency ... and the RC - in my personal version of the CoS I eliminated that private fleet - the CoS may have semi-privately owned ships as "auxiliaries" that may engage in for-profit activities when they're not needed but no nation without an A starport under threat is ever going to be able to spare starships for private ownership, I think).

The third page is your typical high-space, low-value Traveller TNE subsector map showing the CoS and its surrounding areas. The most key thing about it is that the CoS lacks an A or even a B starport. I guess I'm being somewhat unfair, looking at those UPPs spawned any number of ideas for me.

The fourth page is devoted entirely to a new starship, the Lauritson-class Unsupported Picket Ship. I pull up short of calling it "a useless waste of space unless you play Brilliant Lances" because it's a fairly interesting ship - a kind of "long-legged Gazelle" modification that attempts to turn a Gazelle from a short-legged fleet escort into an independent starship. As its name suggests, it's fairly interesting because it's primary method to do picket and scouting duties is to use drones, a very CoS solution - it keeps the priceless, nearly irreplaceable ship out of danger while still checking things out.

 

[san*klass]

In all honestly, you're not missing much. You could probably get by without it. I can give you greater details if you'd like via PM, though tbh I'm not sure how much I could give beyond what I list below without essentially giving you a good summary of what's there because it's pretty scanty.

The article consists of four pages:

The first page gives a (very) brief rundown on the Covenant and its three member worlds. It gives a glimpse into "other" words of the Covenant and their current governmental policy. It's probably the most interesting section of the article for actually running the Covenant. It begins a small section that discusses the CoS navy.

The second page is mostly dominated by a huge sidebar that discusses the Covenant of Sufren (basically a document like a constitution). The non-sidebar column finishes up describes the ships of the CoS including some background info on the Covenator-class cruiser (it doesn't give stats, since those are elsewhere); it gives a full rundown on how many ships and what types the CoS has in its navy. It also points out something highly unlikely to me, but necessary I guess for all these "Traveller conservative" types - it says that there's a number of "privately owned" merchant vessels (though it doesn't break down exactly what), I've always thought the CoS would have nationalized all their ships given their dire situation, but I guess Nielsen needed to let players putt about the galaxy in their little free traders like in every iteration of Traveller (I mean seriously, if players want that, there's the Regency ... and the RC - in my personal version of the CoS I eliminated that private fleet - the CoS may have semi-privately owned ships as "auxiliaries" that may engage in for-profit activities when they're not needed but no nation without an A starport under threat is ever going to be able to spare starships for private ownership, I think).

The third page is your typical high-space, low-value Traveller TNE subsector map showing the CoS and its surrounding areas. The most key thing about it is that the CoS lacks an A or even a B starport. I guess I'm being somewhat unfair, looking at those UPPs spawned any number of ideas for me.

The fourth page is devoted entirely to a new starship, the Lauritson-class Unsupported Picket Ship. I pull up short of calling it "a useless waste of space unless you play Brilliant Lances" because it's a fairly interesting ship - a kind of "long-legged Gazelle" modification that attempts to turn a Gazelle from a short-legged fleet escort into an independent starship. As its name suggests, it's fairly interesting because it's primary method to do picket and scouting duties is to use drones, a very CoS solution - it keeps the priceless, nearly irreplaceable ship out of danger while still checking things out.

Thanks epicenter00

Sounds like just enough to kick start your imagination, but not enough to be really satisfying.

First two pages with the potted history and society and Covenant sound the most useful part. I have PoT, so I can adapt some of the scenario threads, and the Detailling the Wilds section, to flesh out the UPP's. But with a farless jingoistic attitude (as you previously sugested). More working togther as a whole and less SAG sound in order!

I'll need to get onto EBay and buy, I think.

 

[epicenter00]

It's pretty good. To give a hint about the CoS's idea of foreign relations, there's a note that says they're currently trying to contact the TEDs of some nearby high-population worlds. The way it's phrased I get the impression they're planning on trade, cooperation, and so on instead of SAG or CIA/KGB style regime changes.