Effects of missed shots by firearms in a starship

[laowai]

Melee weapons are commonly used on starships because firearms can damage the interior of the ship if they miss their target.

I have not been able to find a random table of deleterious effects of missed shots, so I started making my own. If anyone knows of such a pre-made table, please post a link. Also, any additions or suggestions are welcome.

Effects of missed shots by firearms in a starship
If a fired gun or energy weapon misses its target, there is a chance of the bullet(s) or energy blast causing damage to the interior or other passengers.
Throw 5+ to avoid a negative consequence of a missed shot. Modifiers: -DM = damage dice of firearm; -5 DM for high energy weapons
If failed, throw 2D and consult the "Missed shot hit location" table (see below)

Missed shot hit location (2D)
2-3. Ricochet or direct hit on another passenger (roll random)
4-11. Roll random hit location inside starship (see table below) For any equipment hit, throw 1D -- on a roll of 1, it is rendered inoperable.
12. Ricochet and hit the original target

Random hit location inside starship
(if the result is inappropriate for the location, modify it or roll again)
1. Airlock
2. Pipe, creating a jet of high pressure 1) steam/vapor, 2) water, 3) fuel, 4) coolant, 5) oil
3. Access panel
4. Light panel
5. Sliding door
6. Cargo bay door
7. Computer
8. Display screen
9. Data storage - chips, crystals, disks, etc.
10. Cooking or food processing equipment (in galley)
11. Medical equipment (in med bay)
12. Medical supplies (in med bay)
13. Scientific equipment (in science lab)
14. Recycling system (air)
15. Ships boat
16. Electric motors (automated door, robotic arm, etc)
17. Exercise equipment
18. Filter for life support system
19. Jump drive
20. Maneuver drive
21. Gravity generator
22. Hatch
23. Intercom system
24. Sensor equipment
25. Fuel storage
26. Laboratory equipment (in science lab or cargo)
27. Research equipment (in science lab or cargo)
28. Research samples (in science lab or cargo)
29. Cryo capsule
30. Passenger luggage
31. Communications equipment
32. Food supply
33. Water supply
34. Furniture
35. Knickknack
36. Memorabilia Item
37. Musical Instrument
38. Music Player
39. Personal Communicator
40. Medical Kit
41. Cargo Container
42. Vacc suit
43. Fire Extinguisher
44. Clothing
45. Solar Panel
46. Security Device (alarm, hidden video camera, sensor)

 

[Mår Ekkertsen]

Military vessels

Love the work so far. As I looked it over I had fun thinking of med bays, research ships, etc. Then I thought, hmm? What's missing?

What about arms and explosives stored on military and naval vessels. I guess that could be a new chart of possibilities.

 

[laowai]

Yeah, definitely need to add "powder kegs"... Maybe a cargo of fireworks for the local Duke's birthday party

 

[Fovean]

Cool idea!

 

[Timerover51]

A lot of the effects of misses when firing are going to depend on how thick the bulkheads on the ship are. Are the partitions intended to maintain pressure in case of a hull rupture, or are they simply to wall off one area from another?

 

[Condottiere]

Like castles, some spacecraft designs might be concentric.

 

[coliver988]

A lot of the effects of misses when firing are going to depend on how thick the bulkheads on the ship are. Are the partitions intended to maintain pressure in case of a hull rupture, or are they simply to wall off one area from another?

If I recall, most of the interior bulkheads are more partition than bulkheads, other than those between major sections such as engineering and the bridge. But heck if I can find that so it may be just the way we played. Coulda sworn there was the ability to adjust the staterooms.

 

[whulorigan]

If I recall, most of the interior bulkheads are more partition than bulkheads, other than those between major sections such as engineering and the bridge. But heck if I can find that so it may be just the way we played. Coulda sworn there was the ability to adjust the staterooms.

I am fairly certain that the bulkheads are what separate and constitute "compartments" aboard the ship, which under CT: Book 2 (i.e. "Adventure Class" ships) would be the Main and Engineering sections.^* Everything within those compartments would be separated by simple partition unless otherwise specified or required by design considerations. Bulkhead compartments should be airtight, and thus separated from one another by iris valves and/or hatches. Partition walls and sliding doors are explicitly stated not to be airtight (don't remember the location of the reference).

It should be fairly easy to determine what are bulkhead walls and what are partition walls by tracing out sections of the ship that are separated by airtight passageways (i.e. iris valves, pressure hatches, and/or airlocks). Everything within those compartments is simple partition wall. This also makes it easy to figure out the extent of depressurization should an exterior bulkhead suffer a breach.

^* - Note that this is also why the Book 2 "Standard Hulls" require certain components to be installed in certain compartments which are fixed in size - it is easy to rearrange partitions within a compartment; it is a naval architecture re-engineering task to shift bulkhead walls.

 

[bookwyrm]

in the T20 THB, there is a couple of Damage Location Charts. one for Vehicles/Robots, and one for Space/Star Ships. I think some of the other Rule Sets might have something similar?

for a battle within a Space/Star Ship, you could just go random with any missed shots, or random/specific based on which part of the ship the battle is taking place, and what direction the weapons are being fired.

because Space/Star Ships are built very hardy to withstand the rigors of space, hand carried weapons probably shouldn't do much interior damage except on a Critical Hit. this way, most weapons fire would only do minor damage, and the Crit Hits would do things like busted pipes, wiring, critical ship systems, fill in the blank...

cool ideas for the consequences of ship board combat. if a crew is prepared to cause some minor damage for a trap or ambush against enemy boarders, or enemy boarders are prepared to cause lots of damage to force the crew to surrender...

 

[Fovean]

Bulkhead compartments should be airtight, and thus separated from one another by iris valves and/or hatches. Partition walls and sliding doors are explicitly stated not to be airtight (don't remember the location of the reference).

Supp 7 Traders and Gunboats has mapping symbols for partition walls and bulkheads, a discussion of the differences between the two - partitions are weak and not airtight, bulkheads are airtight and as you mention, divide the ship into compartments for damage control and life support considerations.

All decks are considered bulkheads.

It also gives the number of hit points one needed to inflict to create a "man-sized hole." 100 for partitions, 1000 for bulkheads. And then blithely notes that bullet-firing weapons are ineffective against bulkheads.

Which I guess is where we get the ricochets in the OP from

 

[Nathan Brazil]

CT Azhanti High Lightning rulebook (p20) has rules on the structure points that bulkheads iris valves, common doors , etc. have and what it takes to lose vacuum integrity or create a passable breach.

 

[infojunky]

CT Azhanti High Lightning rulebook (p20) has rules on the structure points that bulkheads iris valves, common doors , etc. have and what it takes to lose vacuum integrity or create a passable breach.

Not to forget color coded equipment and pipes that could explode if hit.

 

[Diveguy]

Love the work so far. As I looked it over I had fun thinking of med bays, research ships, etc. Then I thought, hmm? What's missing?

What about arms and explosives stored on military and naval vessels. I guess that could be a new chart of possibilities.

You can *generally* expect arms and explosives to be stored in a magazine which will provide improved protection over the "standard" ship's interior. This is done for both security, as well as to minimize the effects of accidents turning catastrophic.

IMTU I would also expect most shipboard combats to involve frangible rounds or similar tech, so as to minimize the collateral damage to systems on the inevitable miss. Purely from a cost/benefit ratio of wanting to save that valuable vessel.

 

[Enoki]

One thing that probably should be added and I doubt it's in any of the rules, is the use of explosives in a confined space, like a compartment. First, the blast effect of such things like a grenade or whatever, would be doubled to tripled due to confinement by the space itself. It has nowhere to vent really so it stays there until it can be dissipated by 'stuff.'
Second, if the space is relatively small, everything in it is going to be affected by the explosion and blast to one degree or another. So, if player 1 fires a grenade at player 2 in a ship's compartment they both suffer for it and probably pretty equally.
Sure, fragmentation won't go through much stuff in the compartment so you could be safe from that hiding behind something relatively solid, but the blast is still going to find you...

This is in comparison to being outdoors where blast dissipates fairly quickly and is only really effective at very short range. Confined, it's a whole new and very potentially deadly thing.

For maximum deadliness, the combo would be blast grenades (with little fragmentation) and shotguns using things like beanbags, or frangible loads that won't damage equipment much. A couple of grenades into the compartment to stun or even outright kill everyone in it from blast then march in and shoot everything that still moves with shotguns. No need for much precision doing that...

 

[BackworldTraveller]

Add to that the downgrade between D and DD damage in Mongoose, and a number of weapons have the opportunity to find exciting ways to hole things.

n.b. My definition of "exciting" may differ from that which others may perceive

 

[Condottiere]

There's this thing called overpenetration, where ordnance goes through all barriers, before exploding.

 

[Diveguy]

One thing that probably should be added and I doubt it's in any of the rules, is the use of explosives in a confined space, like a compartment. First, the blast effect of such things like a grenade or whatever, would be doubled to tripled due to confinement by the space itself. It has nowhere to vent really so it stays there until it can be dissipated by 'stuff.'
Second, if the space is relatively small, everything in it is going to be affected by the explosion and blast to one degree or another. So, if player 1 fires a grenade at player 2 in a ship's compartment they both suffer for it and probably pretty equally.
Sure, fragmentation won't go through much stuff in the compartment so you could be safe from that hiding behind something relatively solid, but the blast is still going to find you...

This is in comparison to being outdoors where blast dissipates fairly quickly and is only really effective at very short range. Confined, it's a whole new and very potentially deadly thing.

For maximum deadliness, the combo would be blast grenades (with little fragmentation) and shotguns using things like beanbags, or frangible loads that won't damage equipment much. A couple of grenades into the compartment to stun or even outright kill everyone in it from blast then march in and shoot everything that still moves with shotguns. No need for much precision doing that...

Not a bad point to bring up - blast overpressure does *funny* things in confined spaces, and despite some rough attempts to do so, is difficult to accurately model. You start throwing in too many variables with charge location, reflective surfaces, reinforcing and cancelling wave fronts, etc etc.

Not that I've had many worries about players cooking off grenades in a ship's hull, but your idea of 2-3x damage to all parties may be a simple solution.

 

[Enoki]

Not a bad point to bring up - blast overpressure does *funny* things in confined spaces, and despite some rough attempts to do so, is difficult to accurately model. You start throwing in too many variables with charge location, reflective surfaces, reinforcing and cancelling wave fronts, etc etc.

Not that I've had many worries about players cooking off grenades in a ship's hull, but your idea of 2-3x damage to all parties may be a simple solution.

It works quite accurately that on most ships tripling the effect of blast in a confined space and applying that to everyone in it. A doubling might be accurate if you are in an adjoining space through an open hatch, but that's far more problematic.

So, firing or throwing a grenade into another space with the baddies is a good idea, but it's a really terrible one if you are in there with them or if they decide to toss one your way...

I actually did a study on this at one point, and probably have it somewhere in a file, that shows this to be the case.

 

[whartung]

It works quite accurately that on most ships tripling the effect of blast in a confined space and applying that to everyone in it. A doubling might be accurate if you are in an adjoining space through an open hatch, but that's far more problematic.

Well I guess this is where T5 might come in to play, as I think it distinguishes between explosive pressure affects and shrapnel affects.

I wouldn't want to be in a small walk in freezer with a hand grenade, for example, but outside of my ears, I don't know if the concussive power of the grenade would be that damaging (even reflected in the confined space) compared to what, naturally, the fragments would do to me.

Flash bangs I'm sure rely on the room size to improve their effectiveness, but, again, we're talking short term effects here vs lasting trauma.

Simply, I think in play, I'm not sure how much play or game value a confined space bonus would have for most situations.

 

[Diveguy]

Well I guess this is where T5 might come in to play, as I think it distinguishes between explosive pressure affects and shrapnel affects.

I wouldn't want to be in a small walk in freezer with a hand grenade, for example, but outside of my ears, I don't know if the concussive power of the grenade would be that damaging (even reflected in the confined space) compared to what, naturally, the fragments would do to me.

Flash bangs I'm sure rely on the room size to improve their effectiveness, but, again, we're talking short term effects here vs lasting trauma.

Simply, I think in play, I'm not sure how much play or game value a confined space bonus would have for most situations.

Flash bangs actually don't put out much overpressure compared to a concussion grenade (or simply a raw explosive charge).

And, real world, at close ranges blast overpressure is FAR more lethal than fragmentation (provided no vital organs are struck). However, thanks to the inverse square property and physics, the effects diminish more rapidly compared to the distances frag can travel.

But, I can also say (after 3 decades working around this stuff) - explosives and explosions can do funny things, even in 2021. So, what is going on in 54xx??? Who knows how the tech may surprise us?