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How long is Stutterwarp Discharge exactly

foxx

SOC-8
Greetings,

In the Director's Guide, page 62, of 2300AD, it states that "The discharge must take place in a significant gravity well of at least 0.1 G, and it requires *about* 40 hours to complete."

I have ran into a campaign situation where that is not accurate enough. Are there any other references in the literature that better defines this? If not, does anyone have a good rule of thumb that they use?

I am thinking about 40 hours +/-1D10% to give a range of 36 ot 44 hours.

Also, any thoughts on an appropriate task to improve (reduce) the discharge time?
 
From the HIWG CD Rom... You might find it interesting...

Code:
HD# 142.11  v1.1: Stutterwarp in Traveller

Roger Myhre
Ammerudgrenda 168
0960 Oslo 9
Norway


In this document I will discuss how the Stutterwarp drive from 2300AD will 
affect the gaming universe of Traveller and Traveller the New Era. And 
how it will be used, as I see it.


GENCON 1992.
The GDW staff informed us that participated at the seminars about 
Traveller that they planned to introduce the Stutterwarp drive into 
Traveller. At the moment this is not for certain when the vote held at 
the seminar was a close tie. (Personally I think the Nay side won by a 
small margin, but that might be due to that Scott Olson and I voted 
heavily against.) The drive might not be taken up in the official gaming 
campaign, but the players may use it if they want to. It also ties in 
with a probable new support of the 2300AD.


MY OPINION OF STUTTERWARP IN TRAVELLER.
As mentioned earlier I oppose to Stutterwarp in Traveller. Not that I don't 
like the drive, it is certainly a beautiful piece of FTL technology. The 
reason is that I feel it is not Traveller. It's something else... The 
purpose of this document is not to make you write a letter to GDW and say 
"Do not use stutterwarp in Traveller or else...", but a way to make me and 
others used to the thought that we may see a new type of drive to travel 
between the stars.


STUTTERWARP THE BASICS.
For those of you (like me) that don't have 2300AD (I borrowed it from a 
friend) I will explain the basics about the drive.

The drive itself is not a FTL drive that propels the craft into C+ speeds 
(C = 300,000Km/s), but it somehow teleports the craft an distance average 
of 100 metres. The distance teleported varies with warp efficiency and 
weight of craft. This teleporting is repeated several hundred thousand 
times a second making the craft move between stars in matter of days.

The down side with the drive is that it start to radiate lethal radiation 
when a certain distance is reached. For most ships this is considered to 
be at a distance of 7.7 light years or about 2 parsecs. To prevent this 
the craft must shed charge residue by manoeuvring into a field of gravity 
at least 0.1G, primarily planets. At this gravity the stutterwarp won't 
function so some other types of drives is needed to maneuver here. At 
0.0001 the effect of stutterwarp is affected so much that it drops below C+ 
speeds.


AT WHAT TL SHOULD STUTTERWARP APPEAR?
At the seminar there was not mentioned at which TL it should appear. The 
GDW staff said that the stutterwarp technology could always have been 
there, but no one never found out or put any effort into developing and 
using it. If I don't remember wrong someone in the audience said 
something about TL 12 or thirteen.

I find it strange to believe that the Stutterwarp was never developed if it 
was available at TL 12 or fifteen. The Traveller universe is filled with 
inhabited systems. Many with their own science programs in many fields. 
There is also lots of different aliens.

My best suggestion is to introduce the stutterwarp at TL 16 as prototype 
thing that is used in system mainly. At TL 17 it becomes more developed 
and understood. The first uses for interstellar travel both commercial 
and military.

Some of you may think it contradicts the 2300AD universe. The universe of 
2300AD isn't so advanced as Traveller's universe. Why should then the 
stutterwarp appear later in Traveller than in 2300AD? The reason is that 
they are two different game universes. In Traveller there is developed 
grav technology, and TL 9 is less advanced than 2300AD, and 2300AD do not 
have grav technology. That's why.


stutterwarpS IN DESIGNS.
From what I see from the design rules the stutterwarp is the component in 
the craft that takes the most power in most designs. The drive is rather 
small. Even smaller than a jump - 2 drive. If the stutterwarp was to be 
introduced into Traveller the size and power output would have to be 
increased drastically.

With a new set of rules this will have to change one way or the other. In 
Traveller even the smallest ship uses several hundred MW of power. In 
2300AD the power usage figures looks somewhat more down to earth. Even a 
cruiser uses less power than a MT fighter.


HOW TO BEAT THE 7.7 BARRIER EASILY.
As mentioned earlier the max range of the stutterwarp was 7.7ly. Longer 
range is possible, but that depends on components, technology etc. In 
Traveller the stutterwarp has to be gravity shielded or else the drive 
won't work. remember that it can't activate at 0.1g or more. Most ships 
in Traveller is under gravity, either through grav plates or through 
acceleration from the drives. And here is the key to success or rather 
the key for longer trips. A ship could have two stutterwarps installed. One 
put in a gravitic field, the other running free. When the active drive is 
closing to its 7.7ly limit the other drive is put online by removing the 
gravity it is put under, and the other drive is put into the gravitic 
field. This way the craft can run in excess of 6 parsecs if the ships 
supplies allows it. And that faster than a jump - 6 craft.


WHAT WILL THIS DO TO THE KNOWN SPACE IN TRAVELLER?
If stutterwarps had been introduced earlier than TL 16 or seventeen the 
Imperium would have been totally different. Hell, maybe we wouldn't have 
had any Imperium. Warships able to move 6+ parsecs faster than jumpdrives 
would beat the living daylight out of the enemy. Why is it so?
   Because:
     Faster communication, which leads to
     Faster mobilization of forces, and
     Faster reinforcements.
     Faster in system travel which is at C+ speeds, until the crafts 
       reach a gravity field of 0.0001G, which is just a spitting 
       distance away compared to the scales in space. 0.0001G field 
       reaches out to 600,000Km on Earth. The remaining distance will be 
       crossed in matter of minutes if not seconds anyway. Protecting a 
       planet from massive bombardment from enemies at these speeds is 
       nearly impossible.

There is also other things that come into play. A navigator that botch 
his navigation roll might fly the craft right into a sun or a planet. No 
one will notice before it is too late. How so? Doesn't stutterwarps stop at 
0.1G? It won't when it is grav shielded. Thus the warp efficiency won't 
be affected when the craft approach a planet or a star. When the craft 
can keep C+ speeds at any time space combat will disappear. How do you 
track a target that moves faster than your radar beam? Even passive 
detection is futile. When you receive the electromagnetic signature from 
the craft it has passed you several minutes ago.

How do we then get space combat into Traveller, when all the ships use 
grav shielded stutterwarps? The answer is we can't. Unless we make 
stutterwarps more inefficient in Traveller than in 2300AD. My proposal is 
then that stutterwarps can only be placed in ships of 100ton or less, 
making them excellent courier crafts. The power and space consumption 
should be too large to allow for weapons.

An interstellar empire that uses stutterwarps will manage to grow larger 
than the defunct Third Imperium. Just because of the communication 
speeds. 

For TNE this can lead to lots of different things depending on who 
develops the stutterwarp first. If DoD develops it first, which is most 
likely, when they haven't been so badly pounded as rest of the Imperium. 
Neither have they been bothered too much by the Virus, could then expand 
into the power vacuum that is left in the shattered Empire. Neither do 
they need to cross corridor, but go right through the "claw". Militarily 
they can keep Vargr corsairs at bay.

If Vargr develops it first, no one is safe when the most aggressive vargr 
factions start to use it. Then there is no one to stop them when they 
first come rolling. K'kree would likely use it to hunt down all the meat 
eaters in the universe. So being a Vargr or Aslan would be very unsafe. 
The Hivers would put up galaxy wide trade routes. Zhodani would go 
through the galaxy core and travel to some other remote point in the 
universe. Solomani would lock it up as an military secret and never show 
it to anyone, and executing anyone that even mentions it. and so on. No 
matter who discovers it first, that faction will have a lot of power to 
play with.

Ultimately I feel that stutterwarps should not be a part of the official 
Traveller universe. It should introduced as an variation for those who 
want to play outside the official Traveller campaign. By introducing it, 

I think many old timers among the Traveller players will feel that GDW is 
putting too much into the food blender without regard for taste. When 
something starts to taste wrong people will start to talk, and that won't 
be nice words. The worst thing that can happen is not old timers leaving 
the game, but old timers who tells other that want to give the game a 
shot, that the game stinks, and that the developers of the game has made 
a terrible mess of an old and beautiful game by importing too much 
foreign seasoning. That will hurt sales.

SOURCES:
Challenge 30
2300AD Director's Guide
 
The optimal purge time is 40 hours for a 100% depth of discharge. This is probably has a built-in safety margin and is overkill.

Allow partial, incomplete discharges if the players are in a hurry (this limits range).
A 20-hour discharge reduces range to 3.85 light years (plus any range they have remaining when they start discharging). This shouldn't require special skill, the pilot just lays in a new course makes an early departure from the discharge point.

Push the envelope with this -

To hasten stutterwarp discharge (Hazardous): Difficult. Ship Drive Engineering. 10 minutes.
Referee: A successful force-purge completes the discharge process. This only applies to a single warp discharge. Superficial Damage reduces warp efficiency by three percent. A Minor Mishap results in minor damage (efficiency is reduced by 1D10 percent); a Major Mishap results in major damage (the drive is inoperable), and a Total Mishap results in the drive’s destruction.
 
A fully discharged drive that travels 7.7 light-years is fully contaminated and requires a full discharge.

If it only travels 3.85 light-years, it is *half* contaminated and 20 hours of discharging will fully refresh it.

Instead of foolishly frittering away 40 hours after each leg, the optimal discharge time = sum(leg_distances_travelled) / 7.7 × 40
 
Instead of foolishly frittering away 40 hours after each leg, the optimal discharge time = sum(leg_distances_travelled) / 7.7 × 40

That is a simple and perfectly good answer but if I may interject an idea just for the purpose of making things interesting :devil:

The rules imply that the real limit on stutterwarp range (and it's discharge time) is not 7.7 light-years but rather the amount of gravitc charge the drive builds up. If this 'gravic charge' is related to the strength of the local gravity field then a ship which starts out in a 0.1g field, goes to a station around the same planet where the g is 0.03, cuts across the eclipitic to another station at where the field is 0.08 AND THEN goes onto another star would have a range of something LESS than 7.7 ly, say 5.1ly. The 7.7ly limit only applies if you directly leave a 0.1 field, cross empty space (see paragraph below) then decend directly into another 0.1 field. I like this idea becasue it introduces the limit of 'loiter time' to players, making them have to think very carefully about exactly where they want to go in a system before they have to seek some downtime.

And just how 'empty' is 'empty space'? Does it count as 0.00001 g or 0.0000000000001g? Maybe in traversing through some parts of empty space you build up more gravic charge than others? This could make a good navigator and good navigation data really important as finding exactly the right route suddenly become crucial. Maybe the secret to a pirate's treasure is that it is only approachable along a specific route ( ...Arrrgh an I'll ah sell ya the map for a mere 100Lv! What da ya say matey?), all others fry their drives. Things could get really interesting if you take that favorite Star Trek plot device the 'subspace anomaly'....

Sorry for the bandwidth, not much to do with the original post, I blame the latest panel in the 'Crimson Dark' * comic for this idea.

*FYI, this is a comic series that has a very '2300AD' universe feel to it.
 
The rules imply that the real limit on stutterwarp range (and it's discharge time) is not 7.7 light-years but rather the amount of gravitc charge the drive builds up.

Correct. With the right mojo, a tech can delay discharge and squeeze an additional 24 cruise hours out of a drive. Also correct because even deactivated drives accumulate charge.


If this 'gravic charge' is related to the strength of the local gravity field then a ship which starts out in a 0.1g field, goes to a station around the same planet where the g is 0.03, cuts across the eclipitic to another station at where the field is 0.08 AND THEN goes onto another star would have a range of something LESS than 7.7 ly, say 5.1ly.

No thanks. Too much bookkeeping, even for me.

And just how 'empty' is 'empty space'? Does it count as 0.00001 g or 0.0000000000001g? Maybe in traversing through some parts of empty space you build up more gravic charge than others? This could make a good navigator and good navigation data really important as finding exactly the right route suddenly become crucial.

My inference is that you accumulate charge at a uniform rate during any FTL ops, until the drive is destroyed or discharged.

1st Edition warp rules make more sense and are much less constraining. In the 2nd Edition, all sorts of stupid (IMO) drive limitations were introduced, apparently to preserve the 'Arms' concept.
 
No thanks. Too much bookkeeping, even for me.

Unless you have access to a complete 3D gravity map of every system that you can integrate the path over there cannot be any bookkeeping. Maybe I should be more specific: Make the max range of 7.7 be modified by a task roll, roll modified by Navigation skill; Difficulty decided by the GM based on available nav data&ship sensors&ship agility&pulling a number out of thin air; failure reduces the max range by X amount.

My inference is that you accumulate charge at a uniform rate during any FTL ops, until the drive is destroyed or discharged.

Oh I agree, my point is it would be a lot cooler if it was NOT at a uniform rate.
 
Oh I agree, my point is it would be a lot cooler if it was NOT at a uniform rate.

ISTR discussion long ago on the old 2300ad list where we discussed the cause of the charge, and concluded it was due to the density of the space being warped through (it was an annialation (sp?) event of a hydrogen atom appearing in the field and being destroyed). Thus there are areas that produce slightly more charge, especially insystem (which does accumulate charge as well by this model...)
 
This brings up an interesting point - I've always figured both 7.7 and 40 hours are both engineer's safety limits (and that 7.7 is easy to remember).

I've always played it that due uncontrollable variances in manufacturing (even by 2300's manufacturing techniques) that Stutterwarp Coils actually are routinely good for like 7.75 - 7.9 light years of charge before saturation and breakdown occurs as described, and with very well calibrated drives, you can even extend that further. However, the 7.7 number is presented as a "working" number for stutterwarps actually in use, which takes into account things like less-than-perfect maintainability which occurs in actual use and is the kind of thing that Engineers say when they get into their Cliff Claven moments ("Well, actually a Stutterwarp lasts higher than that, I've heard that they've found materials that have even better performance, but it's actually a cartel of Pentapods, Tantallum-producing countries, and drive manufacturers that want to keep us under control so keep us with the ones we have now!")

More important to the discussion at hand is that Stutterwarp discharges are actually played out sooner than 40 hours - that's just a constant that would be drummed into you if you were training as a bridge officer or engineer of a Stutterwarp starship, and again takes into account "real use" equipment and coil radiator equipment. I've always played that the stutterwarp discharge always takes about 40 hours no matter how long you travel once you're in a position where you can start discharging the static buildup due to fact that Stutterwarp discharge is based around a diminishing returns equ. A starship that's traveled 0.1 ly takes just as long to as a ship that's gone 7.7 ly to fully discharge - the 7.7 coil is radiating more static, but both take the same period to discharge fully - an amount of time that varies by the coil, the drive, and a number of other factors, but on a given trip an experienced engineer could tell you it'd take 2400 - (6d10) minutes to fully discharge. Assuming a 40 hour cycle, around 30 hours left, there's actually only about 66% of the charge remaining. At 20 hours there's 50%. At 10 hours there's still 33%. At 5 hours there's 15%. 1 hour out there's still about 5%.
 
No thanks. Too much bookkeeping, even for me.

It would give something for the nav to do, but I'd guess a simple roll to determine slight alterations in charge accumulated.

What it would really do is take Nebulas etc. off limits.

It so happens that Sol is in an area of extremely low density space (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Local_Bubble ), and that implies that even moderate deep range missions may be problematic. However, we're in the local fluff (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Local_Interstellar_Cloud ), which is denser.

This would imply a region towards the frontier where stutterwarp charge accumulated per ly is going to be less....
 
I've always played that the stutterwarp discharge always takes about 40 hours no matter how long you travel once you're in a position where you can start discharging the static buildup due to fact that Stutterwarp discharge is based around a diminishing returns equ. A starship that's traveled 0.1 ly takes just as long to as a ship that's gone 7.7 ly to fully discharge - the 7.7 coil is radiating more static, but both take the same period to discharge fully - an amount of time that varies by the coil, the drive, and a number of other factors, but on a given trip an experienced engineer could tell you it'd take 2400 - (6d10) minutes to fully discharge. Assuming a 40 hour cycle, around 30 hours left, there's actually only about 66% of the charge remaining. At 20 hours there's 50%. At 10 hours there's still 33%. At 5 hours there's 15%. 1 hour out there's still about 5%.

I have also always assumed a standard 40 hours, regardless of distance traveled. This hasn't been an issue, but I'm building a campaign centered on a merchant crew that specializes in expedited cargo shipments. Here, the discharge time becomes important as it provides an "edge", when combined with using the shortcut routes in an Arm (those routes that go through uncolonized systems). Without the edge, it boils down to more of a comparison of who has the better warp efficiency - a showing of horsepower. And getting there first due to having the higher warp efficiency isn't as fun from a role-playing standpoint as knowing the shortcuts and how to trim time by only having to do a partial discharge.
 
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