Read the whole thread. Whew.
I'm glad to hear that Dave and Martin might get together. It would be nice to rehabilitate some of the old guard. I mean, as much as Mr. Sanger may be consigned to special infernal regions, some of the DGP folks too were really good people, and of course so too is Marc. For me, when I think of DGP, I think of the art in the Traveller's Digest of the time... the covers were rather amazing, and the technical drawings in Starship Operator's Manual were excellent as well. And some of the nugget layouts were fantastic too.
In listening to the discussion about Dave Nilsen's writing style, I'm struck by a couple of things:
People talk about CT as concretist. Hmmmm. Dave alludes to things Marc left ambiguous or nuanced. I see many more of them, mostly from TNS entries. I mean, most of the time you got a TNS, you got a glimmer of the story, but no detail. If it had a military context, a lot of time you got 'No really, there is no story here. None at all. Carry on with the days training.' which is enough to setoff anyone's "BS" detector - making you wonder what was the REAL story.
Then you have the Alien modules.... are the Zhos stinking Orwellian Mind Benders, or people who are thoughtful and actually trying to live harmoniously but in a way we just don't quite think of as normal? Are they actually *smarter* than we are to want to help their deviants be more self actualized? Or are they Huxley's greatest fear? And the Solomani - are they raving racist b*st*rds or are they the true Human heritage, a heritage of pride, industry, and achievement? I think the CT world was *full* of nuanced views. The answer to most of these is not "IT WAS A" or "IT WAS B" rather "It was a little from column A, a little from column B, and a little of the admixture of A and B".
I think when I look at MT, I would call the writing style sort of high level and not very personal (Dave's had a more personal style in that he delved more into the characters). But I don't think MT was lacking in nuanced and multi-faceted truths. I mean, was Strephon a clone? Did Norris do some shenanigans with the Warrant? What really happened with Varian and Lucan? Was Margaret a slave owner? etc.
Here's how I differentiate the eras:
CT: Big Imperium. Static. Backdrop for games, not something to be actively influenced. Lots of small tidbits (via TNS and library data) about mysteries and oddities. The details are left to the local GM to flesh out. It seem concretist, until you look under the hood. It has just as many mysteries and potential alternate views, you just need to do some looking.
MT: Smashed Imperium. Changing. Not just a backdrop, but a part of the games designed to be influenced at least a bit by player missions and choices if they involve themselves with a faction. Full of nuanced views of who is right and wrong. Full of a lot of people caught in the middle. Written in a high-level style, but again with plenty of mysteries to explore.
TNE: Fragments rebuilding. Changing. Not just a backdrop, but a place where players can have large impacts on the fates of systems and perhaps even an entire polity. Full of nuanced views of history, but presented in a first-person style with a very immediate sense. Mysteries are presented by individual perspectives, rather than oblique hints or cold characterizations which leave unaswered questions.
TNE differed from MT and CT in the sort of personalization of the factionalism and of the alternative truths. CT and MT had them, they just lived as divorced entities you could ignore or you could delve into, like peeling the proverbial onion. TNE put them right there in front of you for you to see and it was harder to just look past them. And you maybe didn't have the same sense of an overview because of that style, but at the same time, the overview was there.
In MT and CT, you can miss the trees for the forest because you see the forest from so high up. The trees are all there and different, but you had to look and read between the lines. In TNE, you might miss the forest for the trees, because you see the trees individually. The forest is still there, but you have to look for the common strand a little more carefully.
On H&I, I found the 'designers notes' really annoyed me at the time. Oddly, the presentation in this forum of the same perspective in different words smacks very differently and much more sympathetically. I'm not sure if it is word choice, the years between or the changes to my own person that have happened in that interval. But however it comes about, I understand what Dave was trying to say now about 'Humans in Funny Suits'. But I really can see why other players of the time felt it as a jab at the other Alien modules, which I thought so highly of as well. It wasn't, but it may have seemed that way. New Gaurd taking a poke at Old Gaurd. On the outside, we players probably wouldn't have known about any of the interpersonal politics, so we may have assumed the worst too.
I have to say one last thing, even though I never shut up:
Please, Dave, take it easy. You've paid a lot for the beloved effort before, we don't want you to do so again. Maybe a lot of us are older now too and not so impatient as we were a decade ago, maybe we all understand the human side being a few more years under the bridge ourselves, but I think no one here wants you to push yourself back into this at cost to your life outside. I think the community will welcome you back, will make a place for you, and will let you offer what you want or feel compelled to on your own time. I'm glad to see the raprochement and perhaps some of us can help to make up for some of the abuse you've taken in the past. Even though I'm not likely to become a TNE convert, and may disagree with some particular choices, I can separate the choices made in a game from the intent and passion of the author and from the man himself. And even in disagreement, I would hope to be civil to the man and respectful of his efforts.
It is good to see you back, and I was very happy to see posts from Joe Fugate, Loren and to occasionally here a peep from Marc.
Whether we carp on each individually about some little pedantic thing we don't like (Dear God, Piracy? or How Could You Break The Empire? or Virus!?! or The UWP Of Xanadu Is Broken! or You Don't Have A Fully Scientifically Accurate Climatological Simulation In Your Game!.....), the one thing you have built (along with Hunter and MJD and all the others) is a community of like minded people with a shared passion.
You've also built a legacy of work which has given many of us a pleasant (and sometimes apoplectic) hour thinking about, discussing, tinkering with, and generally enriched our experience.
The whole lot of you are owed one darn big round of drinks by the fan base. Full Stop.
So, do what you have to at work (you're not the only one who has bogged off some time for this thread!), do what you should do for your own life, and we'll be happy to hear from you when and if you can spare the time.
It is no duty on your part - it is a gift for all of us and like Christmas (no, don't go all canonically religious on me anyone!), we can wait a wee while longer to open the presents. The suspense will do us good. The imagination and the creation in our minds roiling away as we wait should be something treasured....
Tom B
Merry Ho Ho!
PS - The comment about a 'Kafer Moment' made me chuckle. Maybe you just need somebody at work to start firing paperclips with a rubber band at you - the threat might sharpen you up into a lean, mean machine!
