Looking for a Traveller spread sheet

[waxman80014]

Hi I am looking for a Traveller spread sheet to use wt the "new" version of the game from Moongoose games. Anyone know of a good one to use?

 

[Andrew Boulton]

Mongoose are (or were) a bit touchy when it comes to software aids. You're best off asking in the dedicated MGT section.

 

[waxman80014]

Not sure why, you need the book to use the spread sheet for most role playing games.

 

[aramis]

Mongoose can enforce that in some jurisdictions; in the US, not so much, since US copyright doesn't protect formulae, nor tabular representations of real world data, nor tabular representations of formulae.

 

[Andrew Boulton]

I've just checked the Traveller Developers' Pack, and it specifically prohibits software.

 

[aramis]

I've just checked the Traveller Developers' Pack, and it specifically prohibits software.

Which merely means you can't use the TLL. In the US, the design systems and the processes are NOT PROTECTED AS A MATTER OF LAW.

See the recent decision in Oracle vs Google.... Anything formulaically derived is exempt from copyright under US law, and Mongoose hasn't applied for patents (not that they'd be given, anyway).

So the only thing they could possibly enforce would be the Trademark. So you can't use the Pointy-arrow compatibility logo, nor the Traveller name.

They can't legally enforce that "no software" provision in any other way.
The ship design system is formulaic, hence not protected in the US.
The vehicle design system is formulaic, hence not protected in the US.
If Gareth used my numbers for prices of goods (which the few I've spot-checked, he did), they're sweat of the brow researched data, not protectable, as they're 1976 market prices in 1976US$. Mostly found on the internet.

All that leaves is CGen and World Design -
World Design is a process - not protectable
CGen makes too much use of the data within the tables, and some of that's prose, it's not real world... so it's the one area that looks copyright protected.

So, Mongoose's "no software" pretty much only precludes Character Gen, and blocks use of the Traveller Logo License and Traveller name.

 

[Andrew Boulton]

<shrug>

Whether they're sensible or enforceable isn't ours to decide. I'm just telling you what Mongoose want.

 

[aramis]

<shrug>

Whether they're sensible or enforceable isn't ours to decide. I'm just telling you what Mongoose want.

What they can enforce is quite important... I really don't care what a company wants. All that matters is what I can legally do.

 

[Kyle Aaron]

They can't legally enforce that "no software" provision in any other way.

They can bitch and moan and get other people to enforce it for them, as has happened before.

So, Mongoose's "no software" pretty much only precludes Character Gen

How so? Character generation is a method which is not patented, and the various terms like "strength" can't be copyrighted at all.

Whether they're sensible or enforceable isn't ours to decide. I'm just telling you what Mongoose want.

Whether they're enforceable is yours to decide. If someone makes a spreadsheet to do character generation, starship creation or the like, loads it up on or links to it on this forum, would you leave it be, or delete it?

If you delete it, then you've decided you're enforcing their policy.

 

[Andrew Boulton]

Whether they're enforceable is yours to decide. If someone makes a spreadsheet to do character generation, starship creation or the like, loads it up on or links to it on this forum, would you leave it be, or delete it?

If you delete it, then you've decided you're enforcing their policy.

I would, yes, because this is an official site, so I have to obey the rules.

Note that this restriction only applies to MGT. Other editions? Knock yourself out.

 

[aramis]

I would, yes, because this is an official site, so I have to obey the rules.

Note that this restriction only applies to MGT. Other editions? Knock yourself out.

And I'd give Andrew grief over enforcing unlawful clauses.

I don't think we should delete such, because doing so without active complaint from Mongoose is, to me, unreasonable (especially since Mongoose doesn't own the boards; MWM does).

I'll note also: no one seems to be beating a path to their door to provide software support, either.

That said, there are a couple spreadsheets out in the wilds...

 

[Andrew Boulton]

I'm not going to go hunting for things to delete, so unless someone points out something "illegal" I'd probably miss it...