[Mercenary] Broadsword versus Free Trader

[SgtHulka]

The Broadsword has a Troop Compliment of 31, 32 if you use the one passenger stateroom for the owner-aboard. The standard platoon is 3 squads of 8, a 3-man HQ team, and a 4-man Cutter team. For that it sets aside only 25 staterooms, but the adventure claims that it still accounted for 4 tons for each trooper. Without any weapons the Broadsword costs 476.4 million credits.

If you took a Type A Free Trader, ripped out its low berths, and convered its cargo capacity to staterooms, you'd have 92 divided by 4 equals 23 staterooms added to the 10 it already haves equals 33. Six of those are reserved for the crew (ignore the steward i.e. no passengers and provide one cabin each for the two turret gunners). That leaves it with 27 staterooms. Since you don't have a Cutter, you can get rid of the Cutter crew, reducing your platoon strength to 27 men...3 eight-man squads and a 3-man HQ team. The Free Trader costs 37.8 million credits, and the conversion work would cost an additional 22.5 million credits, 60.3 million credits total. Literally you could buy 8 converted Free Traders for the cost of one Broadsword.

Doesn't it make more sense to transport your Merc Squad via Free Trader than Broadsword? Even if you assume that you need the Broadsword's Cutters for close ground support, the Free Trader is streamlined and should be able to fulfill that role itself. The Broadsword has more and bigger guns, and is faster, but if you expect a Naval battle shouldn't you be refusing the offerred ticket in the first place? Repairs on damaged starships cost a lot. The Broadsword doesn't really act as a power-projector against planetary governments, insuring they honor the merc contract, because planetary meson guns will kill a Broadsword as easy as a Free Trader.

Granted, the Broadsword can take you places the Free Trader can't (Jump-3). And it has cargo, which maybe you need for your ATV's and G-Carriers. But in that case, maybe split your platoon in two and have two Free Traders with extra fuel for an extra jump and enough Cargo for the platoon's compliment of ATV's. Four Free Traders and now you've matched the Broadsword's weapons compliment -- 8 turrets. Though at this point you're seeing slightly diminished returns (24 crew for the four Free Traders versus 13 crew for the Broadsword).

It just seems like the Broadsword is an awful lot of ship for an awfully few troops.

I'm curious as to how badly the players would get worked by the Zho-boys if they tried to play Adventure 7 with the exact same troops, but with a Free Trader instead of a Broadsword.

 

[SgtHulka]

The Broadsword has a Troop Compliment of 31, 32 if you use the one passenger stateroom for the owner-aboard. The standard platoon is 3 squads of 8, a 3-man HQ team, and a 4-man Cutter team. For that it sets aside only 25 staterooms, but the adventure claims that it still accounted for 4 tons for each trooper. Without any weapons the Broadsword costs 476.4 million credits.

If you took a Type A Free Trader, ripped out its low berths, and convered its cargo capacity to staterooms, you'd have 92 divided by 4 equals 23 staterooms added to the 10 it already haves equals 33. Six of those are reserved for the crew (ignore the steward i.e. no passengers and provide one cabin each for the two turret gunners). That leaves it with 27 staterooms. Since you don't have a Cutter, you can get rid of the Cutter crew, reducing your platoon strength to 27 men...3 eight-man squads and a 3-man HQ team. The Free Trader costs 37.8 million credits, and the conversion work would cost an additional 22.5 million credits, 60.3 million credits total. Literally you could buy 8 converted Free Traders for the cost of one Broadsword.

Doesn't it make more sense to transport your Merc Squad via Free Trader than Broadsword? Even if you assume that you need the Broadsword's Cutters for close ground support, the Free Trader is streamlined and should be able to fulfill that role itself. The Broadsword has more and bigger guns, and is faster, but if you expect a Naval battle shouldn't you be refusing the offerred ticket in the first place? Repairs on damaged starships cost a lot. The Broadsword doesn't really act as a power-projector against planetary governments, insuring they honor the merc contract, because planetary meson guns will kill a Broadsword as easy as a Free Trader.

Granted, the Broadsword can take you places the Free Trader can't (Jump-3). And it has cargo, which maybe you need for your ATV's and G-Carriers. But in that case, maybe split your platoon in two and have two Free Traders with extra fuel for an extra jump and enough Cargo for the platoon's compliment of ATV's. Four Free Traders and now you've matched the Broadsword's weapons compliment -- 8 turrets. Though at this point you're seeing slightly diminished returns (24 crew for the four Free Traders versus 13 crew for the Broadsword).

It just seems like the Broadsword is an awful lot of ship for an awfully few troops.

I'm curious as to how badly the players would get worked by the Zho-boys if they tried to play Adventure 7 with the exact same troops, but with a Free Trader instead of a Broadsword.

 

[Supplement Four]

You're not considering operating costs. Compare how much it costs to operate 10 Type A's to one Merc Cruiser. If there's no where to skim fuel, your cost savings for going wiht the Type A's just went out the window.

Also, even if you can skim fuel, you're talking about a behemouth project--all 10 Type A's trying to get wilderness re-fueled. It wouldn't be expedient, and it'd cost you in the long run (the logistics costs, and just paying the crew for all the extra lag time when you skim fuel--it adds up quick).

Do this exercise: Take 10 Type A's and run them across a couple of subsectors. Anytime wilderness refuelling is possible, do it, but consider the time to do it at least three times as long as the time it takes the one Merc Cruiser.

Figure all the costs...and the time. Don't forget to figure how much more you will pay 10 pilots over any of the soldiers on the Merc Cruiser...stuff like that.

Then, run your Merc Cruiser along the same path, with it's Jump-3.

Add up the costs, and see which one is more.

You will see that the 10 Type A's cost a lot more than the one Merc Cruiser.

(Bad-assed question, btw, SgtHulka).

-S4

 

[Supplement Four]

You're not considering operating costs. Compare how much it costs to operate 10 Type A's to one Merc Cruiser. If there's no where to skim fuel, your cost savings for going wiht the Type A's just went out the window.

Also, even if you can skim fuel, you're talking about a behemouth project--all 10 Type A's trying to get wilderness re-fueled. It wouldn't be expedient, and it'd cost you in the long run (the logistics costs, and just paying the crew for all the extra lag time when you skim fuel--it adds up quick).

Do this exercise: Take 10 Type A's and run them across a couple of subsectors. Anytime wilderness refuelling is possible, do it, but consider the time to do it at least three times as long as the time it takes the one Merc Cruiser.

Figure all the costs...and the time. Don't forget to figure how much more you will pay 10 pilots over any of the soldiers on the Merc Cruiser...stuff like that.

Then, run your Merc Cruiser along the same path, with it's Jump-3.

Add up the costs, and see which one is more.

You will see that the 10 Type A's cost a lot more than the one Merc Cruiser.

(Bad-assed question, btw, SgtHulka).

-S4

 

[Ran Targas]

I presented this arguement but with 8 Suli's stripped, gutted, and reconfigured to support platoon level ground operations (figure the Scouts use them for infiltration and covert landings all the time, why not mercs).

It made sense to me, but not to that many others.

 

[Ran Targas]

I presented this arguement but with 8 Suli's stripped, gutted, and reconfigured to support platoon level ground operations (figure the Scouts use them for infiltration and covert landings all the time, why not mercs).

It made sense to me, but not to that many others.

 

[Golan2072]

Also, remember that a Broadsword, when armed, is far more fit for space combat on route to its destination than the Type-A, having 8 turrets instead of 1 or 2. Anyhow, I've cobbeled together a 400-dton merc cruiser in HGS (carrying a platoon of 4x 8-man squads plus a 2-man comabt engineering team and a 4-man command team):

Ship: Mercenary Cruiser
Class: Mercenary Cruiser
Type: Mercenary Cruiser
Architect: Omer Golan
Tech Level: 11

USP
C2-4623542-000000-30003-0 MCr 343.994 400 Tons
Bat Bear 1 1 Crew: 48
Bat 1 1 TL: 11

Cargo: 35 Fuel: 100 EP: 20 Agility: 3 Marines: 38 Pulse Lasers
Craft: 1 x 30T Ship's Boat
Fuel Treatment: Fuel Scoops and On Board Fuel Purification

Architects Fee: MCr 3.280 Cost in Quantity: MCr 278.395


Detailed Description
(High Guard Design)

HULL
400.000 tons standard, 5,600.000 cubic meters, Flattened Sphere Configuration

CREW
Pilot, Navigator, 3 Engineers, Medic, 2 Gunners, 2 Flight Crew, 38 Marines

ENGINEERING
Jump-2, 3G Manuever, Power plant-5, 20.000 EP, Agility 3

AVIONICS
Bridge, Model/4 Computer

HARDPOINTS
4 Hardpoints

ARMAMENT
2 Triple Missile Turrets organised into 1 Battery (Factor-3), 2 Triple Pulse Laser Turrets organised into 1 Battery (Factor-3)

DEFENCES
None

CRAFT
1 30.000 ton Ship's Boat (Crew of 2, Cost of MCr 16.000)

FUEL
100 Tons Fuel (2 parsecs jump and 28 days endurance)
On Board Fuel Scoops, On Board Fuel Purification Plant

MISCELLANEOUS
24 Staterooms, 35 Tons Cargo

COST
MCr 331.274 Singly (incl. Architects fees of MCr 3.280), MCr 262.395 in Quantity, plus MCr 16.000 of Carried Craft

CONSTRUCTION TIME
82 Weeks Singly, 65 Weeks in Quantity

 

[Golan2072]

Also, remember that a Broadsword, when armed, is far more fit for space combat on route to its destination than the Type-A, having 8 turrets instead of 1 or 2. Anyhow, I've cobbeled together a 400-dton merc cruiser in HGS (carrying a platoon of 4x 8-man squads plus a 2-man comabt engineering team and a 4-man command team):

Ship: Mercenary Cruiser
Class: Mercenary Cruiser
Type: Mercenary Cruiser
Architect: Omer Golan
Tech Level: 11

USP
C2-4623542-000000-30003-0 MCr 343.994 400 Tons
Bat Bear 1 1 Crew: 48
Bat 1 1 TL: 11

Cargo: 35 Fuel: 100 EP: 20 Agility: 3 Marines: 38 Pulse Lasers
Craft: 1 x 30T Ship's Boat
Fuel Treatment: Fuel Scoops and On Board Fuel Purification

Architects Fee: MCr 3.280 Cost in Quantity: MCr 278.395


Detailed Description
(High Guard Design)

HULL
400.000 tons standard, 5,600.000 cubic meters, Flattened Sphere Configuration

CREW
Pilot, Navigator, 3 Engineers, Medic, 2 Gunners, 2 Flight Crew, 38 Marines

ENGINEERING
Jump-2, 3G Manuever, Power plant-5, 20.000 EP, Agility 3

AVIONICS
Bridge, Model/4 Computer

HARDPOINTS
4 Hardpoints

ARMAMENT
2 Triple Missile Turrets organised into 1 Battery (Factor-3), 2 Triple Pulse Laser Turrets organised into 1 Battery (Factor-3)

DEFENCES
None

CRAFT
1 30.000 ton Ship's Boat (Crew of 2, Cost of MCr 16.000)

FUEL
100 Tons Fuel (2 parsecs jump and 28 days endurance)
On Board Fuel Scoops, On Board Fuel Purification Plant

MISCELLANEOUS
24 Staterooms, 35 Tons Cargo

COST
MCr 331.274 Singly (incl. Architects fees of MCr 3.280), MCr 262.395 in Quantity, plus MCr 16.000 of Carried Craft

CONSTRUCTION TIME
82 Weeks Singly, 65 Weeks in Quantity

 

[mbrinkhues]

I suggest taking a look at good old Vigilanty from the MT/Hard Times supplement "Assignment: Vigilanty".

Viggy is a Merchant-Military-Conversion (MMC) of the old TTL 13 "Stellar" class 600to Liner to a convoi escort/pocket carrier. The conversion was done when she was little more than the basic frame so it is rather extensive. She has decend legs (J3), some weapons (IIRC 4 or 6 turrets) and a rather large set of fighters and landing ships (IIRC 4+2, all > 10to)

=================

Question: Where did you get the rather small platoons? Leg Infantry IIIRC is 1+10 (NCO+Soldiers) per Squad, 3-4 squads + command per platoon. Mech Infantry has 1+8 or 1+9 (with 6-7 dismounts) again 3-4 squads + command per platoon. So I get 33+HQ or 27+HQ. And that is without my maintenance or hv. weapons slice.

 

[mbrinkhues]

I suggest taking a look at good old Vigilanty from the MT/Hard Times supplement "Assignment: Vigilanty".

Viggy is a Merchant-Military-Conversion (MMC) of the old TTL 13 "Stellar" class 600to Liner to a convoi escort/pocket carrier. The conversion was done when she was little more than the basic frame so it is rather extensive. She has decend legs (J3), some weapons (IIRC 4 or 6 turrets) and a rather large set of fighters and landing ships (IIRC 4+2, all > 10to)

=================

Question: Where did you get the rather small platoons? Leg Infantry IIIRC is 1+10 (NCO+Soldiers) per Squad, 3-4 squads + command per platoon. Mech Infantry has 1+8 or 1+9 (with 6-7 dismounts) again 3-4 squads + command per platoon. So I get 33+HQ or 27+HQ. And that is without my maintenance or hv. weapons slice.

 

[atpollard]

I agree that the broadsword is too weak in High Guard combat for a real space battle and too expensive for a taxi. The Free Trader would be a little better, but a mercenary force would probably do better transporting support vehicles in the hold of a chartered merchant ship and sleeping in the passenger quarters (perhaps by hot bunking with 2 per room).

If the merc unit needed it's own ship, then a battle-rider type of design would be better. Keep the big expensive starship out of harm's way and let the smaller, combat support craft fly into the war zone. The "ship" could refuel while the small craft were on the mission.

 

[atpollard]

I agree that the broadsword is too weak in High Guard combat for a real space battle and too expensive for a taxi. The Free Trader would be a little better, but a mercenary force would probably do better transporting support vehicles in the hold of a chartered merchant ship and sleeping in the passenger quarters (perhaps by hot bunking with 2 per room).

If the merc unit needed it's own ship, then a battle-rider type of design would be better. Keep the big expensive starship out of harm's way and let the smaller, combat support craft fly into the war zone. The "ship" could refuel while the small craft were on the mission.

 

[SgtHulka]

Originally posted by atpollard:
I agree that the broadsword is too weak in High Guard combat for a real space battle and too expensive for a taxi. The Free Trader would be a little better, but a mercenary force would probably do better transporting support vehicles in the hold of a chartered merchant ship and sleeping in the passenger quarters (perhaps by hot bunking with 2 per room).

Well, this is another interesting idea I've been toying with. You're probably right that a subsidized liner is the best option. I only disagree in forcing double-occupancy. These are private contractors you're talking about, not marine grunts. I don't think they'd be too keen on double-bunking, and it might be bad for morale. I'd keep them single-bunked. I think this is a flaw of the Broadsword design -- I suspect some "cheating" going on with the purchase of 32 staterooms (since it only has 25 real ones). I haven't run the math yet to see my suspicion is correct, though.

As for owning, instead of chartering, the subsidized liner isn't streamlined and so can't support ground operations. But we're mostly talking about chartering right now anyway, so I concede you're probably right.

That said, here's what I was thinking of:

Instead of buying a starship, buy two cargo modules that have 12 staterooms each, for 12mCr. Each of these Cargo Modules have a 12-man capacity. Re-organize your platoon of three eight man squads into a platoon of two twelve man squads (retaining the smaller unit of a total of six fire teams). This way you can assign a single squad to a single Cargo module and retain squad cohesiveness (though this probably wouldn't work with the A7 Adventure platoon, because humans wouldn't want to serve with Vargr, but in general it shouldn't be a problem). When loaded onto a Free Trader, the Cargo Module requires 48 Tons. That leaves room for the Squad's native dirtside transport -- let's say an ATV for 10 tons, since that's what the platoon in A7 uses. That leaves 24 tons in the cargo hold. Use 20 of it for extra fuel, and 4 tons for miscellaneous cargo like tac missiles or other military equipment.

Now, all you need to do to transport your platoon to the nearest backwater dirtball in need of mercs is to charter two Free Traders. Each Free Trader now has 17 free staterooms (10 native and 12 in the cargo module), 34 total. One squad bunks in each cargo module and the HQ Team bunks in the native staterooms, as do any mission-specific specialists (after bunking the full platoon you still have 7 free staterooms). Heck, technically you could transport a company of three platoons this way, bunking the three HQ teams in the native staterooms (9 staterooms), the elite platoon in the cargo modules (24 staterooms), and the recruits in cold storage (40 low births). Well, not quite...you'd need 48 low births...but pretty close.

Anyway, here's your hard costs:

One-time Costs:
5,000,000 mCr 12-Sateroom Cargo Modules x2

Per-Mission Cost (within Jump-2):
727,200 Cr Charter of 2 Free Traders, 4 Weeks Each

Advantages:
1) Free Traders are everywhere. It should be fairly simple to hire two of them. Any more than two and maybe you'd start to have trouble.
2) Free Traders are everywhere. They wouldn't attract much attention jumping in-system.
3) Since your merc company doesn't have native starships, you save on bank payments and birthing costs during "downtime".

Disadvantages:
1) Because the starships aren't native to your merc company, you can't expect to trust them. It limits the type of ticket your merc company will accept -- you don't want to get stuck dirtside while your taxis have buggered off.
2) No aerospace support. You can't expect a Free Trader captain that you've chartered to risk his ship in ground-support operations. This is the biggest advantage the Platoon in Adventure 7 has over the Free-Trader Charter Platoon. The Adventure 7 Platoon has two Cutters to call on for ground support.
3) If you're stuck on a truely backwater planet, it's possible you might not even find two Free Traders to charter.

Now, if you live in a Traveller Universe where a Broadsword is readily available for charter, that's likely a better deal. It only costs 780,200 credits to Charter a Broadsword for a four-week period (and that includes the cost of its Cutters).

After looking at the above math, I've come to the conclusion you're probably better off owning your transport. It's far more reliable.

 

[SgtHulka]

Originally posted by atpollard:
I agree that the broadsword is too weak in High Guard combat for a real space battle and too expensive for a taxi. The Free Trader would be a little better, but a mercenary force would probably do better transporting support vehicles in the hold of a chartered merchant ship and sleeping in the passenger quarters (perhaps by hot bunking with 2 per room).

Well, this is another interesting idea I've been toying with. You're probably right that a subsidized liner is the best option. I only disagree in forcing double-occupancy. These are private contractors you're talking about, not marine grunts. I don't think they'd be too keen on double-bunking, and it might be bad for morale. I'd keep them single-bunked. I think this is a flaw of the Broadsword design -- I suspect some "cheating" going on with the purchase of 32 staterooms (since it only has 25 real ones). I haven't run the math yet to see my suspicion is correct, though.

As for owning, instead of chartering, the subsidized liner isn't streamlined and so can't support ground operations. But we're mostly talking about chartering right now anyway, so I concede you're probably right.

That said, here's what I was thinking of:

Instead of buying a starship, buy two cargo modules that have 12 staterooms each, for 12mCr. Each of these Cargo Modules have a 12-man capacity. Re-organize your platoon of three eight man squads into a platoon of two twelve man squads (retaining the smaller unit of a total of six fire teams). This way you can assign a single squad to a single Cargo module and retain squad cohesiveness (though this probably wouldn't work with the A7 Adventure platoon, because humans wouldn't want to serve with Vargr, but in general it shouldn't be a problem). When loaded onto a Free Trader, the Cargo Module requires 48 Tons. That leaves room for the Squad's native dirtside transport -- let's say an ATV for 10 tons, since that's what the platoon in A7 uses. That leaves 24 tons in the cargo hold. Use 20 of it for extra fuel, and 4 tons for miscellaneous cargo like tac missiles or other military equipment.

Now, all you need to do to transport your platoon to the nearest backwater dirtball in need of mercs is to charter two Free Traders. Each Free Trader now has 17 free staterooms (10 native and 12 in the cargo module), 34 total. One squad bunks in each cargo module and the HQ Team bunks in the native staterooms, as do any mission-specific specialists (after bunking the full platoon you still have 7 free staterooms). Heck, technically you could transport a company of three platoons this way, bunking the three HQ teams in the native staterooms (9 staterooms), the elite platoon in the cargo modules (24 staterooms), and the recruits in cold storage (40 low births). Well, not quite...you'd need 48 low births...but pretty close.

Anyway, here's your hard costs:

One-time Costs:
5,000,000 mCr 12-Sateroom Cargo Modules x2

Per-Mission Cost (within Jump-2):
727,200 Cr Charter of 2 Free Traders, 4 Weeks Each

Advantages:
1) Free Traders are everywhere. It should be fairly simple to hire two of them. Any more than two and maybe you'd start to have trouble.
2) Free Traders are everywhere. They wouldn't attract much attention jumping in-system.
3) Since your merc company doesn't have native starships, you save on bank payments and birthing costs during "downtime".

Disadvantages:
1) Because the starships aren't native to your merc company, you can't expect to trust them. It limits the type of ticket your merc company will accept -- you don't want to get stuck dirtside while your taxis have buggered off.
2) No aerospace support. You can't expect a Free Trader captain that you've chartered to risk his ship in ground-support operations. This is the biggest advantage the Platoon in Adventure 7 has over the Free-Trader Charter Platoon. The Adventure 7 Platoon has two Cutters to call on for ground support.
3) If you're stuck on a truely backwater planet, it's possible you might not even find two Free Traders to charter.

Now, if you live in a Traveller Universe where a Broadsword is readily available for charter, that's likely a better deal. It only costs 780,200 credits to Charter a Broadsword for a four-week period (and that includes the cost of its Cutters).

After looking at the above math, I've come to the conclusion you're probably better off owning your transport. It's far more reliable.

 

[Golan2072]

Question: Where did you get the rather small platoons?[/QB]

LBB4: Mercenary

 

[Golan2072]

Question: Where did you get the rather small platoons?[/QB]

LBB4: Mercenary

 

[The Shaman]

I've done exactly what you describe, Sarge.

A free trader attracts a lot less attention than a merc cruiser, so a few are outfitted as covert assault ships. I don't use them as replacements for merc cruisers, but rather for different missions where they are more effective than a Javelin.

 

[The Shaman]

I've done exactly what you describe, Sarge.

A free trader attracts a lot less attention than a merc cruiser, so a few are outfitted as covert assault ships. I don't use them as replacements for merc cruisers, but rather for different missions where they are more effective than a Javelin.

 

[SgtHulka]

Originally posted by Employee 2-4601:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Question: Where did you get the rather small platoons?

LBB4: Mercenary

[/QB]</font>[/QUOTE]Actually, my edition of Mercenary has a 41-man Platoon. I think it's supposed to be 4 squads of 8 and a 9-man HQ squad that includes the Platoon Leader.

I got the small platoon from Adventure 7: Broadsword. It consists of three eight-man squads, a three-man HQ team, two Cutter Pilots and two Cutter Gunners.

In Striker, a Platoon is defined as two to five squads plus a command group of one to six men. Squads, in turn, are defined as one to three four-man teams. In Striker terms, then, the smallest Platoon possible is nine men: two squads, each consisting of one four-man team, and a single-based leader. The largest Platoon possible is 66 men: five squads of three four-man teams and a 6-man command group.

 

[SgtHulka]

Originally posted by Employee 2-4601:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Question: Where did you get the rather small platoons?

LBB4: Mercenary

[/QB]</font>[/QUOTE]Actually, my edition of Mercenary has a 41-man Platoon. I think it's supposed to be 4 squads of 8 and a 9-man HQ squad that includes the Platoon Leader.

I got the small platoon from Adventure 7: Broadsword. It consists of three eight-man squads, a three-man HQ team, two Cutter Pilots and two Cutter Gunners.

In Striker, a Platoon is defined as two to five squads plus a command group of one to six men. Squads, in turn, are defined as one to three four-man teams. In Striker terms, then, the smallest Platoon possible is nine men: two squads, each consisting of one four-man team, and a single-based leader. The largest Platoon possible is 66 men: five squads of three four-man teams and a 6-man command group.