Vent-Rant MegaTraveller what I hate about it.

[nobby-w]

On MT and TNE

MT did attempt to tidy up CT, High Guard and Striker, but the editorial work was rough and it and didn't quite do the job. I ended up sticking with Striker, using MT character generation and High Guard ships with a fiddled version of the HG system. A CT/MT hybrid works quite well.

The rebellion was a bit meh and I think the Virus was quite naff. Actually, I think the fall of the second imperium is a much better apocalyptic setting than the Virus, and they had it staring them in the face all the time. Guess what I did IMTU - as long as you don't mind a TL10-12 universe it works just fine.

 

[aramis]

MT did attempt to tidy up CT, High Guard and Striker, but the editorial work was rough and it and didn't quite do the job. I ended up sticking with Striker, using MT character generation and High Guard ships with a fiddled version of the HG system. A CT/MT hybrid works quite well.

Part of the problem was the method of transfer. GDW had JUST switched to PCs (from Apple II's), and MT was actually written by DGP on early Macintoshes.

Which means that a large portion of the book was simply retyped into the layout system. DGP's own work shows almost no such issues. Essentially, it looks like much of the errata issue falls squarely upon GDW and whomever was doing layout. (Most likely Loren.)

Also note that DGP proofed everything up to the point it went to GDW. GDW proofed what they had typed - most of the issues are in the tables, which implies that GDW didn't have DGP's printouts.

 

[nobby-w]

Part of the problem was the method of transfer. GDW had JUST switched to PCs (from Apple II's), and MT was actually written by DGP on early Macintoshes.
...

I also got the impression that there may have been a bit of hack and slash on the content to fit it into the format they wanted. The bits that I really noted as a bit obscure was the character generation - figuring out some items like basic training on the character generation had me looking back at Book4/5 and guessing that it probably worked much the same.

 

[Murph]

That would explain some of it, I really liked the Task System, and thought it should become a standard feature of traveller.

Part of the problem was the method of transfer. GDW had JUST switched to PCs (from Apple II's), and MT was actually written by DGP on early Macintoshes.

Which means that a large portion of the book was simply retyped into the layout system. DGP's own work shows almost no such issues. Essentially, it looks like much of the errata issue falls squarely upon GDW and whomever was doing layout. (Most likely Loren.)

Also note that DGP proofed everything up to the point it went to GDW. GDW proofed what they had typed - most of the issues are in the tables, which implies that GDW didn't have DGP's printouts.

 

[aramis]

That would explain some of it, I really liked the Task System, and thought it should become a standard feature of traveller.

It did. The task system was used for CT first (in DGP as 3rd party), then in 2300, then in MT.

 

[Supplement Four]

It did. The task system was used for CT first (in DGP as 3rd party), then in 2300, then in MT.

2300 came out before MT? My memory is the reverse--MT before Traveller 2300, but my memory is not that reliable, either.

 

[Murph]

You are right, I misremembered the DGP mods for Classic Traveller. I thought 2300 came AFTER MT came out? I clumsily worded my post, I meant I wish that the Task System had been original to the CT rules. As for ship and vehicle design, I wish they had kept it simple rather than attempting to make it strikeresque in design. High Guard, while not "realistic" was at least quick and dirty. Another issue that started with Trillion Credit Squadron was the use of Min/Max designs where the 19,999 ton cruiser, and the 74,999 battleship were the ultimate ships in the known universe. Really nothing below the 19,999 cruiser worked well since the cruiser had a Meson J, and the 74,999 ton battleship had a Meson T mount. My players stuck to the rules, and I rued the day that came out, and it seemed to carry over to Mega Traveller as well.

It did. The task system was used for CT first (in DGP as 3rd party), then in 2300, then in MT.

 

[aramis]

You are right, I misremembered the DGP mods for Classic Traveller. I thought 2300 came AFTER MT came out?

Nope. MT was late summer or fall of '87 (it wasn't out before I left for basic), Traveller:2300 was 1986 (and fairly early, IIRC, because I remember playing it with people who graduated in spring 86, and left for college in fall of 86).
If you have the CD's, you can check the copyright dates, too.

The sequence was
Traveller 2300 (1986)
MegaTraveller (1987)
2300AD (1988)

And that second printing may be where the confusion originates. 2300 AD is Traveller:2300 second edition...

 

[Murph]

You are right, I got it mixed up since I returned from Germany and got out of the Army in 1986 and did not immediately get back into Traveller till 1988.

Nope. MT was late summer or fall of '87 (it wasn't out before I left for basic), Traveller:2300 was 1986 (and fairly early, IIRC, because I remember playing it with people who graduated in spring 86, and left for college in fall of 86).
If you have the CD's, you can check the copyright dates, too.

The sequence was
Traveller 2300 (1986)
MegaTraveller (1987)
2300AD (1988)

And that second printing may be where the confusion originates. 2300 AD is Traveller:2300 second edition...

 

[calmar11]

Hi !

Hello,

MegaTraveller I most of the time played, and a bit CT with other settings ( like Bladerunner as an example... )
I have all supplements of MT , even Aslan & Solomani rare , and non issued ones like 101 robots I copied.
I really love the game , my favorite SF rpg, except SPI's Universe ( which IS a some kind of a version of Traveller anyway... )

But I also hate , surely , a lot of things !
- I hated the useless spaceship combat system...some of you used High Guard either, but I think the problem is the same : nearly impossible to destroy any ship...it isn't any space opera like system at all ! I long used Star Warriors for fighter-type ships, and alas never bigger ones than free-trader. I also tried Mayday! but never liked it...
- Errata !!! I found errata after we stopped playing a long time ago, alas.. It's really usefull , and extremely dense. The game, I think , never was re-read before released...there are to much errors...a shame...
- I really hate this thing : a new "deluxe" version of Traveller could have been enhanced : I mean , character creation was extensively ameliorated for mercenary, etc... why not Doctors, Pirates , etc ??? Everything found in CT ameliorations are here, but nothing more like civilians, etc.. such characters must be created with classic basic version of CT...

But I love a great lot of things :
- Commerce system ! I played a lot , even solo ! Excellent !
- Ships & vehicles creation : with habits, I created a lot of that stuff, and loved it. I agree , it's really complicated for nothing but pleasure if you like this. Ships are easier to create than vehicles, but you can do nearly what your imagination need to design...
- I don't agree about criticism about the setting of MT : I like the Shattered Imperium story and Rebellion, it reminds me of a bit of Star Wars... It complicated a lot and made possible more political thrilling scenarii...
- I REALLY love supplements, a lot are excellent : Vargr & Vilani , Aslan & Solomani , Starship Operator's Manual ( a must have ! ) , nearly all of these !
Excellent campaigns ( Knightfall, The Flaming Eye )...
- Rebellion is a greatly detailed setting, I think , with a little Dune flavor someway....

There is a lot more to say , I think , but I am a lover of Megatraveller, nevertheless , when I could play again , I think I would use a personal High Guard version of starship combat other than MT's.

 

[calmar11]

Virus ?

Euh... There is nothing in MT about any virus... I never knew about it...
Maybe in Hard Times but don't remember something about it...
It seems it's in TNE , but I lost interest in anything after MT...

 

[aramis]

Euh... There is nothing in MT about any virus... I never knew about it...
Maybe in Hard Times but don't remember something about it...
It seems it's in TNE , but I lost interest in anything after MT...

Technically, Survival Margin was advertized as an MT product, but was actually the first TNE product (both in product number and in trade dress). Internally, tho' the layout was neither and yet both.

 

[Murph]

I always counted it as a MT product, but I noticed that a similar issue to Mongoose, in that the artwork really seemed to go downhill in TNE. TNE killed Traveller for me, it just go too weird, and too contrived. Aftermath/Morrow Project in Space.

Technically, Survival Margin was advertized as an MT product, but was actually the first TNE product (both in product number and in trade dress). Internally, tho' the layout was neither and yet both.

 

[calmar11]

yeah

I just read about virus in TNE today. Effectively , it's really weird... I don't like the system too.

Hey , Aftermath is great ! Unplayable, but great !
I love Morrow Project ! Great system ! It's a little more deadly than Traveller

 

[Murph]

A buddy ran a Morrow Project then Aftermath series of games. The setting was too dark for me, but Aftermath was darn near unplayable without some serious hacks. IIRC my character was seriously unbalanced, and a walking danger zone.

On another note, I seem to think that the whole level of artwork declined in quality as GDW started flailing about in the mid-late 1980's.

I just read about virus in TNE today. Effectively , it's really weird... I don't like the system too.

Hey , Aftermath is great ! Unplayable, but great !
I love Morrow Project ! Great system ! It's a little more deadly than Traveller

 

[mike wightman]

Aftermath is one of my favourite rule systems. Daredevils and Bushido were based on it. My Aftermath in Space campaign was basically Traveller - the long night.

But the reason for posting.

The thing with hindsight that disappoints me most about MT is the total lack of anything for players to do.

There were two adventures published - Knightfall and Flaming Eye - before they finally got round to producing the setting in which PCs could function - Hard Times.

Prior to Hard Times any group of PCs are spectators to socio-political and military changes over which they have no control.

Then we got three folio adventures...

Compare with the number of adventures published for CT or even T2300.

 

[Murph]

Truth.

Aftermath is one of my favourite rule systems. Daredevils and Bushido were based on it. My Aftermath in Space campaign was basically Traveller - the long night.

But the reason for posting.

The thing with hindsight that disappoints me most about MT is the total lack of anything for players to do.

There were two adventures published - Knightfall and Flaming Eye - before they finally got round to producing the setting in which PCs could function - Hard Times.

Prior to Hard Times any group of PCs are spectators to socio-political and military changes over which they have no control.

Then we got three folio adventures...

Compare with the number of adventures published for CT or even T2300.

 

[nobby-w]

I just read about virus in TNE today. Effectively , it's really weird... I don't like the system too.

Hey , Aftermath is great ! Unplayable, but great !
I love Morrow Project ! Great system ! It's a little more deadly than Traveller

It's the only game I've ever seen where the publishers felt the combat system needed a flowchart to explain it. Really, that should have told them something ...

 

[warwizard]

The whole rebellion thing just did not wash with me, so it was ignored and I looked at the ship design rules, ditto for TNE and T4. While I still bought every product I did not play any of the setting given, preferring to remain with the CT setting. So now I use T4 FF&S in a CT Traveller setting, and am quite happy thank you.

None of it happened, there was no plot, no breakup of the imperium, no virus, just a flat NO! for me the only thing 1248 might bring is a 7th frontier war between the Zhodani and the Imperium.

This whole rebellion and the virus was just an enormous jumping of the shark by GDW, it fractured the community and hurt the game as a whole.

The ability to create sub 100dt starships never really caught on, and indeed it went away with the next rule set.

 

[Vargas]

Then we got three folio adventures...

The folios were an attempt to bring back affordable adventures but they weren't profitable and so they got dropped.