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Air/rafts again...

infojunky

SOC-14 1K
Peer of the Realm
Wandering through CT, the 1st edition specifically, The original description of the Air/raft is it weighs 4 tons, and can carry 4 tons including passengers/crew. with 4 Null/Gravity modules.

Or effectively it weighs 8 tons fully laden.

Further note all the vehicles in that edition are rated by mass not volume.
 
The best bit - the Price. CR 6,000,000 thankyouverymuch.

Interesting that not only did the price drop by a factor of ten in the '81 edition (as did the price of all other vehicles except the Submersible), but 'CR' became 'Cr'.
 
But it can’t float to orbit.
Well, true but ...

On a size 4 world with a thin atmosphere, Low Orbit (above the atmosphere) is only about 100 km up.
If I did the math correctly, then the Isuzu NPR 400 Flatbed Truck traveling at 100 kph up a 45 degree ramp will reach a peak height of over 1000 km above the surface on a world with 0.35 G surface gravity (size 4). So it may not reach the orbital velocity needed to STAY in orbit, but it can REACH orbit (and probably parachute safely back to the surface.) :ROFLMAO:

Just saying. :cool:

[Respect for FEDEX just went up considerably!]
 
castaway5.png


Unpowered air/raft.

Going by High Guard, capable of planetary soft landing, at gravitational acceleration factor/zero.
 
Truck's probably faster...
More to the point, the truck isn't affected by atmospheric conditions (wind, turbulence, etc.). Pretty sure that weather susceptibility was intended as a significant constraint on the operation of Air/rafts as they were originally conceived. For example, note that the Type Y Yacht is equipped with both an Air/raft and an All Terrain Vehicle. One would think that a GCarrier would support both roles... except that grav vehicles (in 1st Edition) couldn't handle rough weather unless wildly over-engined (see the Speeder, which while fast, is still incapable of supersonic airspeed*).

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* To be clear, this refers to actual airspeed within an atmosphere. Get out of the mesosphere (above ~100km msl on Earth), and aerodynamic drag becomes pretty much irrelevant even for an Air/raft -- the limiting factor to top speed then is orbital velocity and then escape velocity.... (If you're going fast enough at very very high altitude, you can turn off the antigravity because you've achieved orbit and won't fall down immediately -- though down at Low Earth Orbit, trace atmospheric drag will add up over time. Go significantly faster than that, and you won't fall down at all, you'll just keep going up. Oops.)
 
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Upon loss of buoyancy, it will gently drift down to the bottom of the body of water.
Well, yes. Once it gets to the water, I agree. But from orbit, loss of buoyancy in air will be immediate, and the subsequent 100km plunge to the water will be full of exceitement. Such debris as remains will then, as you say, gently drift down from the top of the water to the bottom of the water.
 
For a rough guide by size, the Alvin Stalwart is approx 4 d tons. Instead of the often shown flying jeep, it's size suggests that is more a sort of flying light truck/forklift that most traders carry to assist with loading and unloading of cargo and passengers.

I tend to go with the idea that the quoted example in the LBBs are just that, single examples of each of the technologies, with many more variants actually available. A quick rule i use to is divide or multiply the size and cost of the LBB example to allow Air/Rafts of different sizes, from the 4 ton 200kCr, to 1 ton 50kcr family cars, to 20 ton 1MCr sized Air/trucks. With over 11,000 star systems, each with different environments, technological bases and histories, there will be A LOT of variation from the one example in the LBB.
 

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Instead of the often shown flying jeep, it's size suggests that is more a sort of flying light truck/forklift that most traders carry to assist with loading and unloading of cargo and passengers.
This is my interpretation as well.

When you're playing "new design buyer" you look at the tonnage allocation for vehicles and often think of it as dead weight/wasted tonnage. The 4 tons spent on an air/raft could have been used for another (high passenger) stateroom or +4 tons of cargo hold capacity, both of which can generate revenue when used (unlike a vehicle berth). So from a min/max perspective, vehicles are a "loss" for the bottom line of mercantile profitability.

Flip that around into playing "end user operator" and the perspective changes. Having berths for your own vehicle(s) onboard your starship makes it possible to operate in locations other than a starport. If you don't have the infrastructure of a starport to assist with the loading/unloading of passengers, cargo and freight ... because you're doing that somewhere with limited infrastructure support ... you're going to need to "bring your own" means of mechanized assistance (otherwise, you're doing everything "by hand" so to speak). In this regard, having an air/raft is VERY HELPFUL for the marshaling of cargoes during loading and unloading.

Are there "rules" to this effect? :unsure:
No ... there aren't.

Does this kind of conclusion become obvious when you think about it for even a minute (or few)? :rolleyes:
Yes ... yes it does. :oops:

Vehicle berths are what make a starship "expeditionary" to austere locations, away from starports. Without an organic vehicle support component to assist with the marshaling of passengers and cargoes, starships become entirely dependent upon starport infrastructure just to be able to organize the loading and unloading of those same passengers and cargoes. Kind of like how airplanes which don't have fold down doors with steps built into the fuselage will need ground services at an airport to provide a way for passengers to embark/disembark along with services to load/unload the cargo hold of an aircraft. Whether that's a gate tunnel or a ladder cart (for passengers) or a conveyor belt ramp and cargo/luggage carts, those ground support services are provided by the infrastructure of the airport.

Now think in terms of a Boeing 737 or Airbus 320 NEO (or whatever) needing to make an emergency landing (on the ground) ... somewhere ... other than an airport. A place where there is NO ground infrastructure to simplify and speed up loading and unloading.

How do the passengers and crew exit the aircraft?
Emergency inflatable ramps (that are designed to be used one way), clambering down off the wings (again, intentionally one way) and maybe ... maybe ... a fold down stairway at the aft of the aircraft (which might be used for two way access).

How is the cargo extracted from the cargo hold?
Short answer, without mechanical assistance ... SLOWLY AND PAINFULLY ... by hand. Depending on how the cargo hold is "packed" (and with what) this could be potentially dangerous (especially if the cargo "shifted" at any point). Most commercial passenger aircraft do not carry a (skilled) supercargo crew member onboard, since all of the cargo operation skills are "outsourced" to ground crews at airports (part of the airport infrastructure) rather than being organic to the cabin crew. The basic idea is that a supercargo "skilled" member of a ground crew can service a LOT of planes in a day, while a supercargo "skilled" member of a cabin crew can only service 1 plane at a time ... so in terms of skilled crew utilization, it makes a lot more sense to "outsource" that skill from the cabin crew to the ground crew(s) at airports. It creates a dependency on those ground crews and their associated airport infrastructure, but in commercial passenger airline services that are only doing point to point travel between airports, that's not a detriment to operational organization.

As soon as you switch over to more of a "bush pilot" type operation, where airplanes are flying in and out of austere locations with little to no supporting infrastructure ... being able to load/unload your aircraft "by yourself" without ground support infrastructure takes on a whole new meaning. Think of a seaplane that pulls up to a jetty onto water for loading/unloading (the equivalent of a type E starport, in starship terms). If there isn't even a jetty onto the water for a seaplane to pull up to, you're looking at the equivalent of a type X starport (in starship terms) for loading/unloading.

To broaden the analogy back out to the starship operator end user experience, having an air/raft on board ... in effect, allows you to bring some minimal amount of ground support infrastructure services "wherever you go" with your starship. An air/raft is "environmentally agnostic" (gravity, atmospheric composition usually aren't issues) in operation and can be used as a "sky crane" for lifting loads that would be inconvenient/hazardous to do by hand. An air/raft can be used to ferry passengers (and crew) to/fro outside the starship without having to "worry" about walking or elevation/access issues. So there are a LOT of "local logistics challenges" that an air/raft can "trivialize" when a starship is "parked" at an austere location (away from starport infrastructure).

From a Traveller gameplay perspective (Player and Referee), an air/raft (or equivalent) could be almost invaluable as part of a smuggling operation. You don't need to take the starship proper to a smuggling exchange, only the air/raft (particularly in the "Small Package Trade" business when smuggling less than 1 ton). The use of an air/raft reduces risk to the starship crew and is better for "on the down low" exchanges of goods, due to the smaller signature of the air/raft (relative to that of a starship). For larger cargoes/passenger transfers, an air/raft can provide a variety of support services and options that otherwise wouldn't be available/practical due to marshaling and logistics concerns.



So while from a purely min/max "revenue tonnage" perspective, a vehicle like an air/raft is just "wasted tonnage" on an interstellar merchant starship that ONLY goes to starports (go figure, eh? :rolleyes:) ... as soon as an operator wants to "pick up and deliver" to more locations than JUST type A-D starports (where local vehicle rentals usually aren't a problem), that is when "bringing your own air/raft WITH you" everywhere you go starts looking like an attractive option.

Therefore, if it helps ... think of having an air/raft berth on a starship as a sign that such a starship is (intentionally) designed to be operated in a "bush pilot" fashion, where starports aren't the ONLY possible destination(s).
  • Type-S Scout/Courier ... has an air/raft berth standard. Pretty explicitly intended for "austere" operations.
  • Type-A2 Far Trader ... has an air/raft berth standard. Very likely intended to be "still serviceable" when deployed to "austere" locations.
 
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It's pretty obvious that there would be variations on a theme.

But, you need to know the design rules in order to believably tweak them.
I agree, but it's difficult to do that when the original LBBs didnt have vehicle design rules, hence the 'rule of thumb' of just using fractions of the example vehicles we used at the time. Striker, JTAS, Mega, FFS, etc later came out with various rules for vehicle design, but they also involved the game screeching to a halt every time a player asked the in-game sales person how much say, a three ton air/raft or ATV would cost. When playing an RPG, you sometimes have to balance crunch with playability and sometimes make up a general rule yourself. :)
 
Truck's probably faster...
That might depend on how you view gravatics? If going by thrust alone, if a 4 ton air/raft can lift itself AND another 4 tons, it should be capable of at least 8 tons of thrust. Unladen, a 4 ton Air/Raft should be really fast, capable of accelerating at around 2G. Open topped ones would be very uncomfortable at these high speeds, so the speed limit makes sense, but enclosed and streamlined ones should be able to reach modern fighter jet speeds in an atmosphere.

Then again, some like to go by the idea that gravitics effect only a set AREA, no matter the weight, so a 4 dton air raft (56 cubic metres) with its additional 4 dtons (112 cubic metres in total) is capable of only moving along at 100kph no matter what it has enclosed in it's gravity field effect.
 
Then again, some like to go by the idea that gravitics effect only a set AREA, no matter the weight, so a 4 dton air raft (56 cubic metres) with its additional 4 dtons (112 cubic metres in total) is capable of only moving along at 100kph no matter what it has enclosed in it's gravity field effect.
And some go by what it says in the book. 100kph cruise, tops out at 120kph. The thing's a slug.
 
Once you have gravitational motors commercially available, the transportation industry changes.

A necessity on frontier worlds, but also a luxury.

Required registration on civilized planets, and pilots need to be licensed.
 
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