MGT Only: 300-ton stretched refitted Free Trader

[Redcap]

OK, this is a first design under MgT for me, so comments and constructive critique welcome

I was thinking that the usual 'bog-standard' ships that PCs tend to blunder about in fall into one of three main designs: Free trader, Far Trader, and Subsidised (Fat) Trader. That's not much choice, with nothing between the 200 and 400 ton options. There have been a few 300-ton jobs knocking around, but they never really took my attention, Then I got to thinking; if they can IRL make shortened and stretched versions of the Boeing 747, why not starships in Traveller?

"Ladies and gentlemen, we present to you the prototype of the Product-Improved Type AB-300 Free Trader. LSP has stretched the body to increase capability, improved performance with a Jump-2 capability, beefed up the crew and passenger complement, and still designed a ship that can be a decent workhorse in the Tramp Freight community, while incorporating all the new safety requirements that the Imperial Aerospace Authority requires on new-build starships (survival pods, in short!)"

Basically, it's a speculative cargo ship, slightly under-cargo, but still (I think) capable of turning a reasonably intelligent profit. For those places that are a bit out of the way and ever so slightly dodgy, the current (PC) owner has managed to upgrade the avionics to include a military package.

Comments, observations, and suggestions welcome

Stretched Free Trader, class AB-300
													Tons	Price (Cr)
Hull			300 tons		Hull 6								 13,200,000
			Streamlined		Structure 6
Armour			Crystaliron		8 points						 30	  5,280,000
Jump Drive C					Jump 2							 20	 30,000,000
Manoeuvre Drive C				Thrust 2						  5	 12,000,000
Power Plant C												 10	 24,000,000
Bridge													 20	  1,500,000
Computer		Model 3 bis/fib		Rating 15 (20 for Jump control)					  4,000,000

Electronics		Basic Military		DM +0							  2	    100,000

Weapons			Hardpoint #1		Triple Turret (Sandcaster/Particle Weapon/Missile Rack)	  1	  5,000,000
			Hardpoint #2		Triple Turret (Sandcaster/Particle Weapon/Missile Rack)	  1	  5,000,000
			Hardpoint #3		Triple Turret (Sandcaster/Particle Weapon/Missile Rack)	  1	  5,000,000

Fuel			36 tons, sufficient for one jump-2 and two weeks of operations			 36
Cargo 82 tons												 82

Staterooms etc
			8 x Crew staterooms,								 32	  4,000,000
			8 High/Mid passenger Staterooms							 32	  4,000,000
			10 x Low berths									  5	    500,000

Crew:			Pilot (Captain)
			Navigator (Astrogator)
			Engineer
			Gunner / Cargo Hand
			Gunner / Cargo Hand
			Gunner / Cargo Hand
			Medic
			Steward

Extras			2 x Fuel Processors								  2 	     10,000
			Escape Pods x 16								  8	  1,600,000
			Air/raft									  4	    275,000	
			Ship’s Locker										 
			Luxuries package x 3 (DM +3 steward for passenger purposes)			  3	    300,000
			ARSENAL - 36 x Smart Missiles (in 3 x Missile Rack reload crates) (1d6 damage)	  3	     90,000
			ARSENAL - 60 x Sandcaster reloads (in 3 x crates of 20 barrels)			  3	     30,000

Software		Manoeuvre / 0		Rating 0	 						  
			Library / 0		Rating 0	 						  
			Intellect		Rating 10	 						  1,000,000
			Jump Control / 2	Rating 10	 						    200,000
			Evade / 2		Rating 15	 						  2,000,000
			Fire Control / 3	Rating 10	 						  6,000,000
			Auto Repair / 1		Rating 10	 						  5,000,000

Maintenance Cost (Monthly)											    130,085
Life Support Cost (Monthly)											     33,000
Total tonnage and cost											300	130,085,000

 

[AnotherDilbert]

That looks almost paramilitary! Armour 8 is a heavy investment.

I would call it something else than a Free Trader with that heavy investment in arms & armour, say a Wilderness Trader or Blockade Runner?


Jump Fuel is for J-1, J-2 would require 60 dT.
Two weeks PP fuel is very tight.

Why a m3/bis? A m/2 or m/1bis is enough for jumping, a m/3 is as good for combat?

Particle weapons can only be placed one alone in turrets, errata to High Guard.

 

[Redcap]

That looks almost paramilitary! Armour 8 is a heavy investment.

I would call it something else than a Free Trader with that heavy investment in arms & armour, say a Wilderness Trader or Blockade Runner?


Jump Fuel is for J-1, J-2 would require 60 dT.
Two weeks PP fuel is very tight.

Why a m3/bis? A m/2 or m/1bis is enough for jumping, a m/3 is as good for combat?

Particle weapons can only be placed one alone in turrets, errata to High Guard.

Hmm. I like the "Wilderness Trader" label Yeah, I was thinking of the times where a fully-kitted-up weapons and armour fitting would have helped players survive encounters with, for example, Pirates (coreward areas of the Spinward Marches and other salubrious places), hence the armour and weapons.

Noted on the particle mounts. I've not got that errata - is there a link to it somewhere? In any case, fair enough, I can always swap those for beam lasers.

Re Jump fuel - darn. Missed that, thanks.

Re computer - I was thinking jump bonus, to be frank, but given the cost, I reckon I'll drop it to an m/2 fib/bis instead.

Regards the armouring. And don't think I missed that horrible pun you dropped in there - I'm still groaning I suspect I'll have to drop that back to 5% instead of the current 10%, purely on cargo space grounds alone, given the extra fuel the ship'll have to carry.

There's no point in dropping the number of gunners, the space gained is hardly worth it (4 tons), although the computer program could cover one gunner at a push. Something else to think about, I guess.

I'll have a look at this later today to re-jig the numbers.

Thanks again

Anyone else?

 

[McPerth]

Aside from agreeing in most AnotherDilbers comments, some more:

Crew:

1 steward for 8 high passengers would require him to have skill level 3, something not common in MgT. Also, there is no need for Cargo Handlers in MgT.

So, I'll use Gunner/steward as positions. 3 of them would allow to handle 8 stweards as long as at least one has skill level 1 and the others 0, as well as properly maning the turrets. As a personal comment, I always have thought stewards should be ble to cover 3 shifts, if the passengers are to be kept happy.

This would also free another stateroom (as you no longer need the specific steward) for passengers (and, as long as 2 of the stewards have skill 1 and the other one 0, it's fine). Or better yet, add another Engineer. With MgT rules, a single Engineer, unless it has skill level 5 shared among all specialties, will leave many specialties at skill level 0...

About the 3 bis computer, I fully agree with AnotherDilbert. Why to have a computer specialized in jump (so that you can control up to J4) if your ship is J2?

 

[AnotherDilbert]

Hmm. I like the "Wilderness Trader" label Yeah, I was thinking of the times where a fully-kitted-up weapons and armour fitting would have helped players survive encounters with, for example, Pirates (coreward areas of the Spinward Marches and other salubrious places), hence the armour and weapons.

The ship would be a rather good pirate itself...


www.mongoosepublishing.com/pdf/travhighguarderrata.pdf


4 dT for each gunner is significant for a freighter.

Each gunner costs kCr 4.8 in lost revenue (freight), kCr 0.5 in salary, kCr 1 in life support, and kCr 1 mortgage every jump, for a total of kCr 7.3 per jump or kCr ~175 per year. On the margin that is nothing to sneeze at.

If you instead use the stateroom for a High passenger it's kCr 12 in lost revenue and kCr 0.5 salary every jump, or kCr ~300 per year. (If you could sell a high passage every jump).

If you are used to higher profits from speculative trading that may seem insignificant.

 

[AnotherDilbert]

1 steward for 8 high passengers would require him to have skill level 3, something not common in MgT. Also, there is no need for Cargo Handlers in MgT.

So, I'll use Gunner/steward as positions.

Each dT of Luxuries counts as a Steward level, so one Steward should be enough.

I agree the Gunners can generally double up for other duties.

 

[McPerth]

Each dT of Luxuries counts as a Steward level, so one Steward should be enough.

I agree the Gunners can generally double up for other duties.

It seems I skipped the luxuries when Reading the ship ...

In any case, I keep with my statement about my opinion for it, but that's not rules (at most house tules): a single steward might have little sleep if there's any pesky passenger.

See also that for this rule as written in MgT, no ship would use stewards. Just having luxuries should be enough, and it ws you who calculated the cost for another crewmember (BTW, assuming 2 jumps a month, the salary part should be kCr 1/jump, not 0.5, as, unlike in CT, in MgT the gunners are paid 2000 Cr/month). So, I've never allowed for luxuries to represent more tan half the steward skills, but that's again house rule....

 

[AnotherDilbert]

See also that for this rule as written in MgT, no ship would use stewards.

I agree this is strange. It might be automation and bots?

(BTW, assuming 2 jumps a month, the salary part should be kCr 1/jump, not 0.5, as, unlike in CT, in MgT the gunners are paid 2000 Cr/month).

Thanks, I did not check the MgT cost.

 

[Redcap]

Aside from agreeing in most AnotherDilbers comments, some more:

Crew:

1 steward for 8 high passengers would require him to have skill level 3, something not common in MgT. Also, there is no need for Cargo Handlers in MgT.

Had to give them some form of 'second hat', but yeah, point taken. Gunner/Steward and Gunner/Medic roles, then?

So, I'll use Gunner/steward as positions. 3 of them would allow to handle 8 stweards as long as at least one has skill level 1 and the others 0, as well as properly maning the turrets. As a personal comment, I always have thought stewards should be ble to cover 3 shifts, if the passengers are to be kept happy.

Hmm. Two or three shifts, but yeah, also see notes regarding the Luxuries package for out-of-hours service...!

This would also free another stateroom (as you no longer need the specific steward) for passengers (and, as long as 2 of the stewards have skill 1 and the other one 0, it's fine). Or better yet, add another Engineer. With MgT rules, a single Engineer, unless it has skill level 5 shared among all specialties, will leave many specialties at skill level 0...

Hmm. Freeing up a stateroom for high/mid pax is a good move.
So, Steward/Gunner, Medic/Gunner, Second Eng/Gunner, tends to sound a bit more workable.

About the 3 bis computer, I fully agree with AnotherDilbert. Why to have a computer specialized in jump (so that you can control up to J4) if your ship is J2?

Core rules, pp108:

OPTIONS

Jump Control Specialisation ( bis): A computer’s rating can be increased by 5 for the purposes of running Jump Control programs only. This increases the computer’s cost by 50%.

Hardened Systems ( fib): A computer and its connections can be hardened against attack by electromagnetic pulse weapons. A hardened system is immune to EMP, but costs 50% more.

Both options can be applied to the same computer by doubling its cost (+100%).

How does a BIS system affect jump number? Have I missed something?

The ship would be a rather good pirate itself...

Ooo, now there's a truly evil thought :devil:

www.mongoosepublishing.com/pdf/travhighguarderrata.pdf

Thanks for that

4 dT for each gunner is significant for a freighter.

Each gunner costs kCr 4.8 in lost revenue (freight), kCr 0.5 in salary, kCr 1 in life support, and kCr 1 mortgage every jump, for a total of kCr 7.3 per jump or kCr ~175 per year. On the margin that is nothing to sneeze at.

If you instead use the stateroom for a High passenger it's kCr 12 in lost revenue and kCr 0.5 salary every jump, or kCr ~300 per year. (If you could sell a high passage every jump).

If you are used to higher profits from speculative trading that may seem insignificant.

Good and valid points, thanks; I suspect the gunners are definitely going to be double-hatting their roles, the above being the case.

Each dT of Luxuries counts as a Steward level, so one Steward should be enough.

This I'd noticed, hence their inclusion; the gunners doubling as stewards (there's an amusing mental picture!) should take care of that, when combined with the Luxuries packs

I agree the Gunners can generally double up for other duties.

Good to know, thanks

It seems I skipped the luxuries when Reading the ship ...

heh

In any case, I keep with my statement about my opinion for it, but that's not rules (at most house tules): a single steward might have little sleep if there's any pesky passenger.

Good points, and see above

See also that for this rule as written in MgT, no ship would use stewards. Just having luxuries should be enough, and it ws you who calculated the cost for another crewmember (BTW, assuming 2 jumps a month, the salary part should be kCr 1/jump, not 0.5, as, unlike in CT, in MgT the gunners are paid 2000 Cr/month). So, I've never allowed for luxuries to represent more tan half the steward skills, but that's again house rule....

It works for me, besides, a Steward isn't just for housekeeping and making the passengers happy (ish), the job's also there as a first line in internal security... "Cap'n, there's something odd about this punter I thought I ought to mention to you..."

I agree this is strange. It might be automation and bots?

Thanks, I did not check the MgT cost.

Automation I'll accept (vending machines, etc), bots would be yet another cost on top, surely?

Thanks for the observations and comments, folks, Keep 'em coming, please!

 

[McPerth]

Had to give them some form of 'second hat', but yeah, point taken. Gunner/Steward and Gunner/Medic roles, then?

Hmm. Freeing up a stateroom for high/mid pax is a good move.
So, Steward/Gunner, Medic/Gunner, Second Eng/Gunner, tends to sound a bit more workable.

I would not make a gunner to doublé as Medic or Engineer, as those are quite likely to be needed in combat (just when the gunner is needed).

Stewards, OTOH, are not so needed in combat, so are a good choice to doublé as gunners. Maybe you'll find this thread interesting in this regard...

How does a BIS system affect jump number? Have I missed something?

Bis (jump specialization) adds 5 rating to computer for Jump Control programs (only). So, a computer 1(bis) has rating 5, but is treated as rating 10 for jump control programs, allowing it to control a J2.

It works for me, besides, a Steward isn't just for housekeeping and making the passengers happy (ish), the job's also there as a first line in internal security... "Cap'n, there's something odd about this punter I thought I ought to mention to you..."

Also, remember your passengers pay top money for their ship, and expect top service too...

Automation I'll accept (vending machines, etc), bots would be yet another cost on top, surely?

I've always believed that most people would like to have a sentient in those personal attention Jobs, feeling more comfortable with someone that can empathize with them. But then, this may have changed with the centuries to have robots arround...

 

[kilemall]

I guess my issue would be, why not go 400 tons and get 70+ more tons for greater speculation capability, more staterooms?

Guess that would make it an M2, Far Merchant?

Don't know what the speculation rules are for MgT2E, but it can be very profitable to tote around cheap buys for a couple jumps down the road, or carrying extra cargo for pirate dump/appeasement.

 

[Redcap]

OK, the crewing issues are taking top priority now, as they directly affect tonnage available to cargo, revenue, and so on. So...

I would not make a gunner to doublé as Medic or Engineer, as those are quite likely to be needed in combat (just when the gunner is needed).

Makes sense.

Stewards, OTOH, are not so needed in combat, so are a good choice to double as gunners. Maybe you'll find this thread interesting in this regard...

"Interesting" ... wow... that word doesn't even come close enough Very good reading - thanks for the heads-up on that.

Bis (jump specialization) adds 5 rating to computer for Jump Control programs (only). So, a computer 1(bis) has rating 5, but is treated as rating 10 for jump control programs, allowing it to control a J2.

So I could easily get away - I mean "justify" of course - with specifying a 1 bis/fib for a 300-ton J-2 ship?

Also, remember your passengers pay top money for their ship, and expect top service too...

That's a given, really

I've always believed that most people would like to have a sentient in those personal attention Jobs, feeling more comfortable with someone that can empathize with them. But then, this may have changed with the centuries to have robots arround...

Maybe, but why mention Steward as a skill, if robots rule the roost? Stewards it is, I think

So, this leaves us as follows, as near as I can see it: The ship requires a Pilot, and preferably an Astrogator (computers can fail), definitely an Engineer, a medic, three (OK, maybe just two) gunners, and a steward or two. Into the mix, it could likely use a purser as well, but that'll be a second hat requirement. Current thinking is therefore as follows:

• Pilot (Captain) / Chief Purser
• Navigator (Astrogator) / Second Purser
• Chief Engineer (Skills req Jump, Power, & Life Support engineering)
• Second Engineer (Skills req Manoeuvre & Electrics engineering, & Computer)
• Medic
• Chief Steward / Gunner
• Second Steward / Gunner

That's an increase in crew, and a decrease in pax staterooms, by one each way. That can't be good.

 

[Redcap]

I guess my issue would be, why not go 400 tons and get 70+ more tons for greater speculation capability, more staterooms?

Guess that would make it an M2, Far Merchant?

Don't know what the speculation rules are for MgT2E, but it can be very profitable to tote around cheap buys for a couple jumps down the road, or carrying extra cargo for pirate dump/appeasement.

You posted as I was replying just now. Oh well

Yeah, I'm beginning to think along those lines as well. I just like the idea of having an unusual ship in the game, I guess.

 

[AnotherDilbert]

I guess my issue would be, why not go 400 tons and get 70+ more tons for greater speculation capability, more staterooms?

Yeah, I'm beginning to think along those lines as well. I just like the idea of having an unusual ship in the game, I guess.

A 400 dT ship is more expensive and it's bigger hold is more difficult to fill with freight.

If we have a 400 dT ship we can just as well use a 600 dT ship with the same logic?

 

[Brandon C]

I would build a base commercial version, first.

Drop armor to 4. Lower M-Drive to 1G. Drop the /fib from the computer. Don't bother with particle beams in the turrets. Increase fuel to correct number.

I would also drop the escape pods and air/raft and replace with a 20 ton launch.

 

[Redcap]

Hmm.

Good points as well.

So much so, that I've just splurged for the MgT 2^ed Core rules and HG (£40 of PDF, half the price of the dead tree versions). With 8 or so years between editions, it's likely a sensible move.

Anyhow, the thinking behind a 300-ton merch ship was that it was a bridge between a 300-ton "too-damn-cramped-for-six" and a 400-ton "bit-too-big-for-six" freighter, thus providing a bit more flexibility to the players. That it had the potential to be somewhat more mission-capable was an added bonus, I thought.

Turns out there are apparently just as many - perhaps more - compromises to be made in the design process.

Time, I think, to start from scratch at 300 tons again...

Meh. :toast: :coffeegulp:

 

[GypsyComet]

The commerce rules and assumed reality, being aimed specifically at PCs, are optimized for small ships. The Type R and Type M are "Subsidized" for a reason.

The 100, 200, 400 progression is traditional, having been enshrined since 1977. Several editions have allowed other options to be efficient, and you need to look at those to keep a 300 tons hull from being counted as a 400 ton hull that can't use a quarter of its volume. Most editions that skip the odd hundreds are going to penalize the players for being mavericks.

 

[AnotherDilbert]

So I could easily get away - I mean "justify" of course - with specifying a 1 bis/fib for a 300-ton J-2 ship?

Yes. But given the investment in arms you probably want some Fire Control...

• Pilot (Captain) / Chief Purser
• Navigator (Astrogator) / Second Purser
• Chief Engineer (Skills req Jump, Power, & Life Support engineering)
• Second Engineer (Skills req Manoeuvre & Electrics engineering, & Computer)
• Medic
• Chief Steward / Gunner
• Second Steward / Gunner

This isn't the airforce, nothing says the pilot has to be boss. This is a ship, and any rating can be helmsman. I agree that the Purser is most likely to be boss, but that can be anyone.

Small ships are crewed by people and you need a team with the right collection of skills. On a Trader Broker skill is probably the most valuable.

Which crew positions can be combined depends on which people with specific skill combinations you can hire (or have in the party).

 

[kilemall]

A 400 dT ship is more expensive and it's bigger hold is more difficult to fill with freight.

If we have a 400 dT ship we can just as well use a 600 dT ship with the same logic?

It's not a good starter ship, but an M2 could hit the spot for an owner who can fill the typical A cargo hold regularly and has the capital and therefore the need for another similar hold size for speculation.

But then again I allow for 2-3 destination prebooking to fill holds and staterooms, which makes for making payments but missing opportunities.

If MgT2E lettered drives work like CT, the type C drives are leaving capacity on the table, and cargo hold/hull is cheap. Drop a couple turrets of weapons and it's more then paid for.

More staterooms also give it a secondary 'cheap' Type C merc ops option, which the higher model computer and intended armament strongly suggests.

At 400 tons I would tend to think about going maneuver 3. Pacing most pirates or outrunning cheap Type S could be worth more then the turrets or armor.

 

[AnotherDilbert]

If MgT2E lettered drives work like CT, ...

MgT2 has no lettered drives, only percentage drives. A 350 dT ship works just as well as a 400 dT ship.