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Prometheus
Guest
When you mean the M16A5/M4A2-3 are we talking the 6.8mm round? If so it is a much needed change.. 5.56mm is worthless.
Auto & Assualt Carbines
- Thread starter Sir Brad
- Start date
When you mean the M16A5/M4A2-3 are we talking the 6.8mm round? If so it is a much needed change.. 5.56mm is worthless.
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Prometheus
Guest
M16a5
Well that sounds like an armorer's/logistics nightmare. On the other hand after 11 years I imagine I loved my M4/M68A2. The 5.56mm round is terrible in the sandbox. I hope they move to a piston instead of the gas tube. The HK416 proved that arrangement was significantly combat reliable when compared to the colt design.
Well that sounds like an armorer's/logistics nightmare. On the other hand after 11 years I imagine I loved my M4/M68A2. The 5.56mm round is terrible in the sandbox. I hope they move to a piston instead of the gas tube. The HK416 proved that arrangement was significantly combat reliable when compared to the colt design.
shadowcat20
SOC-12
Could a M16 frame hold up to the pounding of a 7.61 X 51/308 Win?
There is a whole bunch of difference in that and the 5.56.
For me Carbine calibers are,
.45 ACP
9mm and all its variations
Any other pistol caliber
.30 Cal Carbine
5.56
6.8 SPC
5.45 X 39
7.62 x 39
8MM Kurtz maybe
And maybe 22LR or 22 Mag
I am sure I missed a few but my reloading books are down on my bench.
Lighter rounds with shorter barreled guns. They lack the barrel legnth to stabilize the round and get it up to full speed. They are also lighter so do not make as stable a firing platform as a heavier weapon.
They tried to have the best of both with bullpup designs pushing the receiver further back so the weapon was shorter but had full barrel length. Not sure I like the receiver next to my ear though, and it plays hell on leftys...:devil: Some can eject both ways though. The British IW is an example of one, as it the Styer Aug. Anything with a clip behind the pistolgrip is a bullpup.
And as far as I am concerned the whole U.S. military went to carbines when they dropped the M14......
There is a whole bunch of difference in that and the 5.56.
For me Carbine calibers are,
.45 ACP
9mm and all its variations
Any other pistol caliber
.30 Cal Carbine
5.56
6.8 SPC
5.45 X 39
7.62 x 39
8MM Kurtz maybe
And maybe 22LR or 22 Mag
I am sure I missed a few but my reloading books are down on my bench.
Lighter rounds with shorter barreled guns. They lack the barrel legnth to stabilize the round and get it up to full speed. They are also lighter so do not make as stable a firing platform as a heavier weapon.
They tried to have the best of both with bullpup designs pushing the receiver further back so the weapon was shorter but had full barrel length. Not sure I like the receiver next to my ear though, and it plays hell on leftys...:devil: Some can eject both ways though. The British IW is an example of one, as it the Styer Aug. Anything with a clip behind the pistolgrip is a bullpup.
And as far as I am concerned the whole U.S. military went to carbines when they dropped the M14......
P
Prometheus
Guest
Could a M16 frame hold up to the pounding of a 7.61 X 51/308 Win?
There is a whole bunch of difference in that and the 5.56.
For me Carbine calibers are,
.45 ACP
9mm and all its variations
Any other pistol caliber
.30 Cal Carbine
5.56
6.8 SPC
5.45 X 39
7.62 x 39
8MM Kurtz maybe
And maybe 22LR or 22 Mag
I am sure I missed a few but my reloading books are down on my bench.
Lighter rounds with shorter barreled guns. They lack the barrel legnth to stabilize the round and get it up to full speed. They are also lighter so do not make as stable a firing platform as a heavier weapon.
They tried to have the best of both with bullpup designs pushing the receiver further back so the weapon was shorter but had full barrel length. Not sure I like the receiver next to my ear though, and it plays hell on leftys...:devil: Some can eject both ways though. The British IW is an example of one, as it the Styer Aug. Anything with a clip behind the pistolgrip is a bullpup.
And as far as I am concerned the whole U.S. military went to carbines when they dropped the M14......
I have fired the 6.8 mm from the M4 (it has the needed knockdown and range) and the receiver does hold up.
I like the bullpup config I worked with the French SOF in Afghanistan.. the FAMAS is robust and the accuracy isn't bad. The ejection port switches to accommodate either hand. You can fire it one handed and the muzzle climb and control is surprising. Magazine changes take some muscle memory training. The rifles grenades are a surprise... if you ever fire one wear eye protection and have a firm grip our you will end up with a bloody nose and an indention in your forehead.
shadowcat20
SOC-12
Never had a chance to play with the fun stuff. I just collect WWII rifles and reload for them. Newest I have is a HK G3 Semi auto brass tosser. Those things wing the 308 brass a mite....
shadowcat20
SOC-12
Hmm...this brings us back to the game...imagine a fire fight aboard ship with brass flying all over the place and bouncing off walls...or running down a corridor and slipping on the the little rolly things all over the deck. Some of the ammo could be less than smokeless and cloud up the corridors if the party bought it cheap at a lower tech planet. All sorts of fun stuff.
P
Prometheus
Guest
At Tech level 10-11 it would probably be caseless ammo... in a vacuum environment or Zero-G those weapons would be worthless
shadowcat20
SOC-12
You could have oxidizer in the powder if it is not already. I think it is though. Recoil and flying cases would be an issue and you would still get recoil from caseless just no brass. I suspect with the number of lower tech worlds out there they would stick to the lowest common denominator. Powder and lead are easy, if they can make primers than jacketed stuff would be no problem either.
Maybe Tech 8 to 9 caseless comes into play for the military. Some may even go the liquid propulsion route. I think the USSR may have played with that idea for their Arty. Rather than powder you squirt in a liquid booster. Slam in the warhead, give it a squirt and electricaly fire it. Cut down on weight per round but major danger of having the go juice tank go off if something unfriendly lands nearby.
Getting back to caseless, that is electricaly fired. what happens if the ship gets hit with a Nuke EMP burst? It may fry the firing circuit in the gun and it would not work. I guess it depends on if there is a chip in it.
Maybe Tech 8 to 9 caseless comes into play for the military. Some may even go the liquid propulsion route. I think the USSR may have played with that idea for their Arty. Rather than powder you squirt in a liquid booster. Slam in the warhead, give it a squirt and electricaly fire it. Cut down on weight per round but major danger of having the go juice tank go off if something unfriendly lands nearby.
Getting back to caseless, that is electricaly fired. what happens if the ship gets hit with a Nuke EMP burst? It may fry the firing circuit in the gun and it would not work. I guess it depends on if there is a chip in it.
mike wightman
SOC-14 10K
Ammo does contain it's own oxidiser - has done ever since we moved on from black powder.
If an emp knocks out your sidearm firing mechanism it's goint to affect the majority of sidearms - lasers, gauss weapons etc.
Out with the boarding axe...
If an emp knocks out your sidearm firing mechanism it's goint to affect the majority of sidearms - lasers, gauss weapons etc.
Out with the boarding axe...
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Prometheus
Guest
And who said Traveller couldn't be hack and slash
I'm still waiting for caseless weapons. Come back H&K G11, we miss you!
(Wow, you guys sure know your guns. A lot more than me.)
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Prometheus
Guest
If memory serves me correctly the P90 is caseless.. I know for a fact that Dutch SF uses them... at least they did when I saw them in KAF.
Sorry but the P90 does not use a caseless cartridge. The 5.7X28mm has a case.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FN_P90#Ammunition
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Prometheus
Guest
Sorry but the P90 does not use a caseless cartridge. The 5.7X28mm has a case.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FN_P90#Ammunition
I stand corrected....
BlackBat242
SOC-14 1K
The AR-10 was the predecessor to the AR-15.
When the weapon was re-designed for the smaller, weaker round the action was shortened.
You can't up-calibre the AR-15/M-16/M-4 to the .308, you would need to go back to the AR-10 itself (or a modern equivalent).
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M16_rifle
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P
Prometheus
Guest
There is always the .50 Cal. Beowolf Round, punched through the 1/4" steel plate... Low tech solution to battledress
shadowcat20
SOC-12
I forgot about the AR 10. About 10 years ago you could still buy them.
The G 11 had a 4.7 mm Caseless round if I remember right. From what I had read you could get 3 rounds out the barrel before feeling the recoil of the first.
As for the EMP, any older weapon using springs and primer to fire off the round would not be affected. So a Gauss, laser, or Accelerator rifle might be useles, but the old 1911 .45 would work fine.
That could be the justification for older weapons in the game system. That and ship corridors are about right for a semi auto 12 gauge with buck.
The G 11 had a 4.7 mm Caseless round if I remember right. From what I had read you could get 3 rounds out the barrel before feeling the recoil of the first.
As for the EMP, any older weapon using springs and primer to fire off the round would not be affected. So a Gauss, laser, or Accelerator rifle might be useles, but the old 1911 .45 would work fine.
That could be the justification for older weapons in the game system. That and ship corridors are about right for a semi auto 12 gauge with buck.