How to Improve the Kinunir?
- Thread starter MikeinBallard
- Start date
The kinuir job is easy, its a specialist patrol craft pirate hunter with the ability to stage planetary raids with its marines. From a CT point of view if fits nicely with the gazelle and fiery ships (J4, M4, good computer, Ag=1 ish). It can also acts a flotilla leader for a flight of gazelles. As a flotilla leader and big ship from a book 2 point of view it has extras the gazelles don't e.g. nuclear damper etc.
The troops give the Kinuir something that the gazelles, fer De lances etc. don't have. All the rest of the standard escorts can just blow up pirates and bomb bases. The patroll cruiser has 10 security troops - enough for a boarding but not for a raid.
The local Marches sector HQ could easily decide that the conventional strategy of just shooting raiders when they attacked was not enought and they had to strike at pirate bases etc. and nuking them from orbit is not politically acceptable - especially if pirates have establish a secret supply dump in the outback of a loyal imperial world. So you build a bigger escort with troops, but it must be able to hold its own in combat - hence the Kinuir
Once designed, you could imagine some INI official suggesting it would be a good testbed for the AI computer or the black globe for covert operations (troop landings, signals intel) and covert ops tends to need small ships.
Best place to hide this stuff - a minor anti-piracy vessel on a border sector. You could imagine the 3I admirality responding to a pirate problem in the marches by giving the local sector HQ a pot of money to build ships and lending them a bunch of standard escorts for a few years until the sector has built its own ships.
Why only 24 ships - 2 possible reasons both related to the 4FW. Either the money was diverted to rebuilding fleet elements after the 4FW or more likely combat experience from the war showed up some design flaws (limited capacitors on the BG, insufficient speed, a touchy computer etc.). Give the admirality 5 years to do the more important stuff and then do a study on the Kinuir performance, and hey presto 5 yrs after the war ends, the sector HQ decide that fixing the flaws is just too expensive and they cut short the production.
The Sydaki from the DGP is obviously the next version to come out of the admirality design office. Again designed for signals intelligence work, bigger troop raids and bigger pirates (vargr govt escorts part timing as raiders).
----
So what would they do to improve these handful of kiniurs - probably not much. They might have sorted out the dual laser problem. triple turrets could give them an extra F5 laser battery and 2 F4 sand batteries for very little cost, just need a couple of extra staterooms building in the hold for the extra gunners. Plus swapping the air/rafts for an APC. Both these mods could have been done post 1105 possibly in or immediately after the FFW
The troops give the Kinuir something that the gazelles, fer De lances etc. don't have. All the rest of the standard escorts can just blow up pirates and bomb bases. The patroll cruiser has 10 security troops - enough for a boarding but not for a raid.
The local Marches sector HQ could easily decide that the conventional strategy of just shooting raiders when they attacked was not enought and they had to strike at pirate bases etc. and nuking them from orbit is not politically acceptable - especially if pirates have establish a secret supply dump in the outback of a loyal imperial world. So you build a bigger escort with troops, but it must be able to hold its own in combat - hence the Kinuir
Once designed, you could imagine some INI official suggesting it would be a good testbed for the AI computer or the black globe for covert operations (troop landings, signals intel) and covert ops tends to need small ships.
Best place to hide this stuff - a minor anti-piracy vessel on a border sector. You could imagine the 3I admirality responding to a pirate problem in the marches by giving the local sector HQ a pot of money to build ships and lending them a bunch of standard escorts for a few years until the sector has built its own ships.
Why only 24 ships - 2 possible reasons both related to the 4FW. Either the money was diverted to rebuilding fleet elements after the 4FW or more likely combat experience from the war showed up some design flaws (limited capacitors on the BG, insufficient speed, a touchy computer etc.). Give the admirality 5 years to do the more important stuff and then do a study on the Kinuir performance, and hey presto 5 yrs after the war ends, the sector HQ decide that fixing the flaws is just too expensive and they cut short the production.
The Sydaki from the DGP is obviously the next version to come out of the admirality design office. Again designed for signals intelligence work, bigger troop raids and bigger pirates (vargr govt escorts part timing as raiders).
----
So what would they do to improve these handful of kiniurs - probably not much. They might have sorted out the dual laser problem. triple turrets could give them an extra F5 laser battery and 2 F4 sand batteries for very little cost, just need a couple of extra staterooms building in the hold for the extra gunners. Plus swapping the air/rafts for an APC. Both these mods could have been done post 1105 possibly in or immediately after the FFW
Hi,
Mongoose is silent about numbers, but states second hand models (plural) have been sold to colonial navies, distinct from naval patrols.
It also mentions 2 variants the heavily armoured Sidikur class detached cruiser & the Missile Frigate. It then states advanced technology variants exist
commissioned by wealthy governments and corporations, so this type is certainly a hot bed of r&d,
Regards
David
Well said, this reasoning makes total sense, with each domain or mega-corp putting out their own variants of similar base types.
Kind Regards
David
Yes. Hans your stating the obvious. The thread intends on improving the ship. I've offered some thoughts, I used in doing that.
In other words, they've completely changed the background of the Sydkai from the original version?
Why am I not surprised? If you have a better idea than your predecessors had, it's obviously much better to contradict previously published material than to make your new version a different class. All that would accomplish would be to avoid invalidating earlier canon, and what possible good would that do?
:nonono::nonono::nonono::nonono:
Hans
I must introduce you to Avenger Enterprises Project Steel commencing on 016 - 1105 and featuring the Imperial colonisation of .... a certain Sword Worlds planet, that will really make your day ;-)
Sorry Hans, too much to resist
Kind Regards
David
I'm well aware on the hatchet job1 that was done on the Steel that Paul Drye and I had worked so hard on. It still saddens me to think of the waste, but as for upsetting me, that ship sailed years ago.
1 Hatchet job in the sense that our version was destroyed. Being so obviously biased, I'm not expressing any opinion on the quality of the material that replaced it.
Which version did Mongoose go with, BTW?
Hans
Possibly both:
Steel E655000-0
Population 4,300 captive rule manufacturing tech level 8
Ecology & history seem to be lifted straight from your work, there is a reference to Maruni. I'm not sure this is where the 4,300 people are coming from, or the AE product, or even somewhere else, perhaps it's deliberately vague.
Interestingly although the Mongoose SW is supposed to be pre 5FW, the entries on Sacnoth etc seem to be lifted from your treatment of the Border Worlds down to calling them Border Worlds.
Regards
David
Yes, the author used a lot of stuff from GT:Sword Worlds (of which, I hasten to add, I thoroughly approve -- that's what working in a shared universe is all about). Unfortunately, there was some sort of mixup with the first draft and it was published before he could regress the material (if that's the word I want) from 1120 to 1105.
Now that I think about it, since the changes Paul and I introduced to Steel began during the 5FW, there's no need for Mongoose's 1105 writeup to make a choice. The divergence between our Steel and Avenger's doesn't begin until 15 days later.
Hans
As a lowly commoner I respectfully petition that we will in due time be informed about the decision you august nobles arrive at, so that we can metaphorically touch our forelocks and express our humble assent to your lordly edict.
I remain, Sir, your obedient servant,
Hans the Commoner
(Sorry. Frog in my throat.)
Yes yes yes. :nonono:
mike wightman
SOC-14 10K
I won't be as humorous.
What you decide in the moot will not affect MTU or MgT authors or T5 authors. Nor will the retcon police do a Minority Report and smash up my home to write in my books.
If you want to hide stuff like this behind a paywall fine - but you will lose a lot of contributors.
What you decide in the moot will not affect MTU or MgT authors or T5 authors. Nor will the retcon police do a Minority Report and smash up my home to write in my books.
If you want to hide stuff like this behind a paywall fine - but you will lose a lot of contributors.
GypsyComet
SOC-14 1K
"COTI Canon"? How amusing.
LeperColony
Traveller Card Game Dev Team
Meanwhile in the actual canon, it remains a curiosity colonial cruiser.
Vladika
SOC-14 1K
Agreed!
While a member entitled to vote, I still think this is a poor idea. "CotI" Conon?:rofl: WTF we exclude MOST of the membership from the process and still pretend this is now "agreed" upon?
I think the OPs heart was in the right place and see some point to encourage Moot membership, but "CotI Canon"?:nonono:
Mike and Vladika,
I expected more from you than this personal attack and swearing. "Poor idea.":rofl: That is your opinion only. Do whatever you want in YTU. That is why it's YTU. :rofl::rofl:
This is one of a number of efforts to build camaraderie and support the board. As mentioned COTI canon is not original canon. Simply, a vote by member of what we think might be the possible solution to various questions discussed for topics discussed for 15 years. People seem to forget previous discussions.
I'm disappointed in those that shoot first and never ask questions. The only thing ridiculous is that behavior.
mike wightman
SOC-14 10K
I'll vote in an open pole, I'll contribute in an open forum.
Hide this away in the moot and i can't do either.
Hide this away in the moot and i can't do either.