Condottiere
SOC-14 5K
If you can't impeach an unfit noble, you have a regency, whether a single protector or by council, until majority, death, or rehabilitation.
Imperial Citizens
- Thread starter McPerth
- Start date
Spinward Flow
SOC-14 5K
Or is the non heir of a SOC 14-15 noble who has a honorific title with ho real meaning...
I've seen aldmirals with SOC 14 as PCs (the benefits table of the Navy may raise you the SOC beyond expectations)...
You seem to be making the assumption (as many also seem to do) that all nobles are "Landed" or "High" (in the proper usage of those terms), meaning that Noble Title is inextricably tied to a position of rulership and/or authority. This was not true even as far back as CT/MT, where there were Honor and Rank/Local Nobles represented among those titles as well (including their inheriting heirs and non-inheriting progeny, who did not inherit a position). Nobility is a social position and distinction, that may qualify a person to hold a certain position of authority, but in no way mandates or demands it. The Nobility structure of the 3I is modeled closer to continental Europe of the 18th-19th Century, not the Middle Ages. The fact that the ranks of Baron, Count, or Duke may qualify one to hold a position such as World-Representative, or Head of the IMoJ for a Subsector/Sector, or Subsector Governor, respectively, does not mean that that is in fact what he/she does, or necessarily that he/she has any authority or does anything at all other than economicaly develop his land-grants and manage his financial assets.
Even in T5 there are Nobles "of" a given world, vs. Nobles who simply have land-grants "on" a world and have their title associated with something else (perhaps simply their family name or an estate).
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Condottiere
SOC-14 5K
I wouldn't take this stuff too literally, since it looks made up as you go along, rather than having a concrete vision from the start.
You could look at it this way, that it made more sense at the start of the Imperium, and it's a mukbang built over a millenium, to reward and control Imperium citizens who could influence events or populations.
At some point, extra titles are shoehorned in, to more publicly display who's on the Emperor's nice list.
You could look at it this way, that it made more sense at the start of the Imperium, and it's a mukbang built over a millenium, to reward and control Imperium citizens who could influence events or populations.
At some point, extra titles are shoehorned in, to more publicly display who's on the Emperor's nice list.
The point is to have a version of Nobles that allows for characters created by CharGen that can be explained and are actually playable. SOC that is a mere social distinction that does not necessarily carry official (especially interstellar-level) responsibilities does that.
mike wightman
SOC-14 10K
A member of the nobility career is not a Traveller until they muster out...
Yes, but many become Nobles during CharGen without going thru the Nobles Career.
I can only speak about the British nobility (but imagine that other European nobility are similar). Usually the heir to a peerage would hold a subsidiary title, eg the heir of an Earl would be a Viscount. I was at university with the (then) Viscount Elveden, Edward "Ned" Guinness, who is now the Earl Iveagh (he was in the year below, but left college early as his father was gravely ill).
So, that heir/ess of the SOC 14 Count/ess would be a SOC13 Marquis/Marquess.
Spinward Flow
SOC-14 5K
Characters who do not enlist in the Noble Career are not "landed" nobles.
Characters who do enlist in the Noble Career are not "landed" nobles until they successfully roll for and receive Position.
Position does not change your Social unless you are starting at Social: A, in which case Position will increase your status to Social: B.
Position is what gets you "posted" as a Peer of the Realm ... an Imperial Noble representing the Emperor (through the feudal hierarchy down to you) to a specific world (such as the Knight Boughene, for example).
Promotions may "reassign" your posting to a new world, if the world you started at does not require an Imperial Noble of your (new) higher rank. So you could go from being the Knight Boughene to the Baron Yori (for example). Such "reassignments" of posting following a promotion in social standing would be doled out by nobles higher up the hierarchy (the Duke of Regina, in this case, for the Regina subsector) as a matter of administration.
When a character musters out of a Noble Career (for whatever reason), they relinquish their Imperial Noble responsibilities (representing the Emperor to a specific world) and hand their posting over to a successor, who assumes the post.
All other careers can yield Social: B+ results, but those are more a matter of recognition and honors for the work they have done in their lives. So these are "honorary" titles, rather than explicitly "ruling privilege" peerage type of social standing results.
So while a Noble and a Navy vet may both be Social: B+ after mustering out from their careers, what they respectively did to earn that social status are completely different paths to the same social standing (relatively speaking).
The Noble would have been the Emperor's representative to an entire world (if they achieved Position).
The Navy vet would have been in the naval service(s) and would have been responsive to fleet command ... a very different path.
Yes exactly. But both are still noble. And both hold the same Social Status.
Spinward Flow
SOC-14 5K
Yes, both hold the same social status.
But they're different KINDS of noble within that same social status.
Kind of like how anyone with a PhD can be called a Doctor (of something).
But a Medical Doctor is a different thing, requiring different training, skills and qualifications.
In other words, if you ask "Is there a doctor in the house?" for a medical emergency, you aren't looking for a Petroleum Engineer with a PhD to solve your problem(s).
And then there's the Doctor Who answer.
The Doctor: "And I'm the Doctor."
Anyone: "Oh? What are you a doctor of?"
The Doctor: "Practically everything!"
Correct. They could be Honor Nobles (or close relatives of substantive Nobles), or in the case of the Diplomat and Bureaucrat Careers, Rank/Administrators (Ceremonial Nobles) who have now mustered out and are now effectively Honor/Legacy Nobles.
Correct. They are either deliberate Dilettantes (if they choose NOT to roll for position), or are proteges seeking recognition to gain position (and in any event still fall under the "honor" category until they do).
Correct . These are "Proper" Landed Nobles and High Nobles.
Yes, that is exactly the point.
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Condottiere
SOC-14 5K
Instead of a fief, you could have a trust fund, which would differ from a stipend, as the government pays you directly.
Courtesy ranks for heirs would be one that was acquired by the family, but is immediately the next lower tier from the parent's; you might be able to tap into the income of any assets customarily assigned to it.
Courtesy ranks for heirs would be one that was acquired by the family, but is immediately the next lower tier from the parent's; you might be able to tap into the income of any assets customarily assigned to it.
mike wightman
SOC-14 10K
Which is an honourific for service rather than a place in the administration...
and I see that the follow up posts discussed this
Prince Harry fought in Afghanistan.
I imagine many of high social standing, but fewer actual responsibilities, would take the time to run off "adventuring".
Of course this is version dependent, as CT/MT only allow you in the Noble career is fyou are SOC A+, while MtT allow you with lower SOC.
Even so, I don't believe positioning means you're landed. For a noble that makes its career in other Imperial service (e.g. MOJ ro Diplomatic corps), Noble career would be the adecuate to represent it, but positioning don't mean being landed, just being in the proper position in this service.
And, IIRC, Price Andrew fought on Falkands, back in 1982...
mike wightman
SOC-14 10K
If you think either of those two were anywhere near actual fighting I have a bridge to sell you...
