Proto-Traveller

[Golan2072]

Originally posted by Flynn:
As a reminder, gentlemen, I'm looking for articles of one-eight pages each. I think it would be better to publish Oz's design rules separately, and then designs based on them could reference the article (a simple sentence would do: "These designs were created using design rules from the article '<insert title here>', by <insert Oz's full name here>, Stellar Reaches Issue #X.")

2-4601, if your article is going to take more than eight pages, I'll request that you break it down into logical chunks, for ease of integrating into the fanzine.

Thanks, All,
Flynn

Can I submit to articles (on related, yet different subjects) to the same Stellar Reaches issue? I have the Solar Triumvirate's overview (modified from my forum posts) in Word format, 7 pages, 4,422 words, which needs a few more hours of editing, re-clarifications and additions, to which I'll add the map/UWP of the Sol subsector of MTU (ready on graph paper); I also have many more weapons designed for CT (which I'll publish under the heading "The Solar Triumvirate's Marine Corps Armory"), written on draft paper and still in need of typing into Word. I wish to post both to the upcomming issue; the following one will probably get an overview of the Solar Triumvirate's Navy (probably about 8 pages, many CT ships), and one quadrant of the Solar Triumvirate's space along with UWPs (it's about 40% ready now).

EDIT:By the way, what is the deadline for Issue 3?

EDIT #2: I might also provide you with rendered 3D art of certain objects; I have a few examples of which (most rendered inside the Thief 2 or System Shock 2 computer game engines, but I can re-render them outside of these games): Stasis Tubes, SMG (Skorpion style), SMG (UZI style) and an ACR.
I also have a Galil/Kalachnikov-style Assault Rifle model, but I don't have the render online yet.

 

[Golan2072]

Ok, back to topic: one of the main issues with proto-CT is the total lack of vehicle/small craft/starship integration into the LBB1 personal combat system. While this thread discusses the subject, I wonder if any of you house rule gurus has ever come with a simple LBBs 1-8 vehicle system. I know, Striker is supposed to solve the issue, but it isn't Proto-Traveller...

 

[Flynn]

Originally posted by Employee 2-4601:
Can I submit to articles (on related, yet different subjects) to the same Stellar Reaches issue?

Yes, of course you can. Now, if I decide to save some for the next issue, then don't be too surprised. I don't want to put out an 80-page monster one issue and then go back to a 20-30 page issue next time.

I have the Solar Triumvirate's overview (modified from my forum posts) in Word format, 7 pages, 4,422 words, which needs a few more hours of editing, re-clarifications and additions, to which I'll add the map/UWP of the Sol subsector of MTU (ready on graph paper); I also have many more weapons designed for CT (which I'll publish under the heading "The Solar Triumvirate's Marine Corps Armory"), written on draft paper and still in need of typing into Word. I wish to post both to the upcomming issue; the following one will probably get an overview of the Solar Triumvirate's Navy (probably about 8 pages, many CT ships), and one quadrant of the Solar Triumvirate's space along with UWPs (it's about 40% ready now).

Sounds good. When you have them ready, send them over to me and I'll review them. If there are any edits that have to be made, I'll send you word on that, and let you tackle that at your convenience.

EDIT:By the way, what is the deadline for Issue 3?

Deadline for submissions for Issue #3 is July 31, 2005. That's the final submission, so if you are concerned about having to do any edits, I'd suggest sending it in a few weeks earlier, if you can. Thanks.

EDIT #2: I might also provide you with rendered 3D art of certain objects; I have a few examples of which (most rendered inside the Thief 2 or System Shock 2 computer game engines, but I can re-render them outside of these games): Stasis Tubes, SMG (Skorpion style), SMG (UZI style) and an ACR.
I also have a Galil/Kalachnikov-style Assault Rifle model, but I don't have the render online yet.

If you can, please render these images outside of the game engine you are using, as I don't have the legal right to use that system's rendered images, since they hold the copyright.

Thanks a lot,
Flynn

 

[Golan2072]

Originally posted by Flynn:
If you can, please render these images outside of the game engine you are using, as I don't have the legal right to use that system's rendered images, since they hold the copyright.

Actually, only the statis tube ended up being rendered in Thief 2; the rest were rendered outside it.

 

[The Oz]

I always just winged it when shooting at vehicles, as I said in that thread you mentioned, but I can see that something more would be handy.

We do have the rule about blowing holes though the walls and bulkheads of starships, but I don't think that's of much use here, since that rule is for blasting through in a non-combat situation with repeated shots on the same spot, something that would be very hard to arrange in combat. So we need rules about what can be hit and how hard is it to damage it.

I'll think about it.

 

[aramis]

Striker is 1981. So it could be part of prototraveller. At least, my 5th printing copy says (c)1981.

Realistically, before I got AHL and Striker, I used the ATV rules, from ATBF (DA?) and with small arms, rolled against BD to hit, and required some conversion, I think it was 20 points or so, to generate a hit. per those laser canon rules.

I sometimes applied the "Tons per Hit" concepts from Bk2.

once I got striker, I used it.

 

[Golan2072]

Originally posted by The Oz:
To determine the acceleration of the small craft, divide the dtons of thrust produced by the drive system by the size (in dtons) of the small craft, rounding any fractions down. There is a maximum acceleration of 6Gs, if a drive system should produce more thrust than is needed to give a small craft 6Gs of acceleration, the drive system is considered to be automatically "downrated" to produce just enough thrust to push the small craft at 6Gs (find this "downrated" value by multiplying the craft size (in dtons) by 6). The fuel requirement for a "downrated" drive is reduced by the same proportion as the drive is downrated (as an example, if a drive producing 200 dtons of thrust is downrated to 180 tons of thrust, the fuel requirement for that drive is reduced from 2 dtons per week to 1.8 dtons per week).

Hmmm... If you stick to the cannon 6G being the max acceleration even for small craft, perhaps you could still use excess thrust for better manuverability - probably in a similar manner to HG Agility - to provide a DM against incoming fire...

Weapons - Hardpoints must be added if the craft is to mount weapons. A craft with a hardpoint may mount up to three weapons. Turrets are not needed to mount weapons, but if no turret is mounted all weapons mounted can only fire in one direction (forward or aft, side-mounted weapons are not allowed), although the weapons do not all have to fire in the same direction, so a small craft could have a laser pointed forward and a missile rack and sandcaster pointed aft for example. A single person (pilot or gunner) can only fire one kind of weapon pointed in one direction in one combat turn. Sandcasters are not included in this rule, a pilot or gunner can fire a sandcaster (pointed forward or aft) while also firing some other kind of weapon pointed in the other direction.

I suggest that if you're using Sigg Oddra's excellent Armor and Heavy Weapon rules, a "Heavy Weapon" (Plasma/Fusion) should take up two small craft "weapon slots" rather than just one. For armor, of course, use HG rules and Sigg Oddra's combat rules.

Also, I'd like to see information about the TL in which each component (engines especially) becomes available. I use HG computer/hull size/engine TLs, but what do you use?

 

[Golan2072]

Also, how long does it take to produce small craft? The times listed in LBB2/HG seem too long to me, as they are longer than those of standard-hull 100+ dton craft.

 

[The Oz]

Originally posted by Employee 2-4601:
Hmmm... If you stick to the cannon 6G being the max acceleration even for small craft, perhaps you could still use excess thrust for better manuverability - probably in a similar manner to HG Agility - to provide a DM against incoming fire...

Or you can use the extra thrust to push things around, as in my proposed "tug" design for the "Carrion" class salvage ship.

Or you can just toss the 6-G limit and let small craft accelerate faster. Whatever you want IYTU.

I suggest that if you're using Sigg Oddra's excellent Armor and Heavy Weapon rules, a "Heavy Weapon" (Plasma/Fusion) should take up two small craft "weapon slots" rather than just one. For armor, of course, use HG rules and Sigg Oddra's combat rules.

Also, I'd like to see information about the TL in which each component (engines especially) becomes available. I use HG computer/hull size/engine TLs, but what do you use?

I would agree that heavy weapons need two "slots" in a hardpoint mount, so you could have a fusion gun and a missile rack, for example.

As for TLs, since this is a Book 2 system, I'd say the TLs come from the TL chart in Book 3, which would make all the drives available at TL9. All the other new components would also be available at TL9 as well. Heck, in HG you can reach 6-G accel at TL9 anyway, so it's only a problem for TL7 and TL8 small craft anyway.

 

[Golan2072]

Originally posted by The Oz:
Or you can just toss the 6-G limit and let small craft accelerate faster. Whatever you want IYTU.

Will it grossly imbalance the game or radically change naval doctrine? (bear in mind that MTU is fighter-friendly already as it's LBB2 improved, without dampers yet).

 

[The Oz]

I don't think allowing high-G small craft would affect an LBB-based game that much: as you say, fighters are already very effective in such a universe. About the only trouble I can see is people asking why bigger ships can't pull more G's as well.

 

[endersig]

Originally posted by The Oz:
I don't think allowing high-G small craft would affect an LBB-based game that much: as you say, fighters are already very effective in such a universe. About the only trouble I can see is people asking why bigger ships can't pull more G's as well.

Aha!! It has been done. A long while ago, I suggested a higher-G limit for fighters. If you want, I can repost my High-G 12-G fighter. It also had agility 12... I know, overboard.

On a completely different note, a thought occured to me as I designed a TL 10 Colonial Navy for a Proto Traveller Game. How does book 2 limit lasers on ships? What is to prevent a 400 ton fat trader from loading up 12 beam lasers and a computer 7? Was there even limits?

 

[mike wightman]

Nope, nothing to stop a 400t ship with four hardpoints from having four triple laser turrets, and it can have any model of computer up to and including the model 7.

What book 2 failed to do was provide rules for military grade engines - are they really exactly the same as the civilian engines in the charts (hmm, brainwave forming...)? - military grade sensors - again, how do they differ from civilian models in terms of cost etc.?

 

[aramis]

I've been thinking... this could get dangerous...

If we go with a 1.5secotor Solomani Confed (trimming about 1 sector's worth) and the 8 sector imperium of the (page 3 of this topic) map, that means the Solomani are not just significant... they've been cut in half (not by a quarter), and it is clearly then a MAJOR threat. It also means the Aslan Hierate is actually adjacent (for a very small bit) to the Imperium. This tightens up the confed to match the sup 10 LD, without breaking things for us, and means that the neighboring sector spin of the SR should be Dark Nebula... And a hotbed.

 

[aramis]

Hmmm.. Military Grade Engines...

All we know for certain is that
1) they exist
2) Military Jump Drives don't take penalties for unrefined fuel, even without FPP's.

Maybe, say. Military Maneuver drives can be overthrust up to double, but each extra G over rating results in 2 uncompensated G's on the crew....

Military PP: ???

Say, maybey, they cost 25% more.

Perhaps the multi-drive rules only work with military drives...

 

[robject]

I'd say double the cost (it's the military, eh?)

 

[endersig]

so has anyone actually managed to get a sesion of this in?

 

[endersig]

so has anyone actually managed to get a sesion of this in?

 

[mike wightman]

You mean since this back to basics idea was started?

If so, the answer is no.

But MTU is pretty firmly based on proto-Traveller assumptions.

 

[mike wightman]

Back to the military drives.

How about if all TL15 (V-Z) drives are considered military, as well as the drive letter type that gives the last same number?

An example of the latter - a 400t ship with B drives has a performance of 1 across the board, as does a 400t ship with type C drives, but the type C drives could be considered to be "military".

I'm not sure how to fit the type S scout into this though...