Ship Galleys

[Ex_Pendable]

How do you feed your crews on your ships or in the field? Do you have a ship's galley or kitchen? Or do you have a nutri-matic you stole from Douglas Adams that when you press a button dispenses something that is almost, but not quite, entirely unlike anything you'd actually want to eat?

I thought I'd borrow these definitions from the army:

A-Ration (Garrison Ration) - Fresh, refrigerated, or frozen food prepared in kitchen
B-Ration (Field Ration) - Canned, packaged, or preserved foods prepared in kitchen without refrigeration
C-Ration (Individual Ration) - Complete, pre-cooked, ready-to-eat individual meal (also known as MRE)

Adding to this list:

S-Ration (Survival Ration) - compact packaged food that can be stored for a long time, high in carbs and calories.
G-Ration (Geedunk Ration) - Cookies, candies, assorted snacks.

You need to feed your crews, so how do you do it?

 

[Quint]

Canonically, it's generally what you list as a B-Ration, perhaps (I can't immediately recall) with A-Rations for High Passengers. There's an actual size/space note from... Beltstrike?

Personally I like where you are going with this. Of course I'm the sort of guy who wants to put several different messes on my naval ships, a gunroom, a goat locker, a wardroom, a dirty shirt mess, and for big ships a senior wardroom...

Fundamentally I think you have to decide just how a ship operates in order to determine how the crews are fed. Merchant ships that hit a new port every week or so can eat pretty fresh. Naval ships that might be on patrol for weeks or months are going to be more limited - but that may also be a function of rank.

The bigger question?

Is there a rum ration?

;-)

D.

 

[flykiller]

You need to feed your crews, so how do you do it?

on the ICS Jefferson Davis there is the general passenger mess served by two robot/steward food prep stations, the high-social-status dining club served by a high-skill steward, the crew mess served by themselves, and the officers' wardroom served by a full kitchen and staff. in addition in noble country one of the suites can be replaced by a professional kitchen and staff.

 

[kilemall]

Depends greatly on the operations/business model the ship's design is predicated upon.

If it's designed for a lot of mid passengers and high passengers with privacy, most of the stateroom space would actually be in the staterooms with kitchenettes built in and only the high passengers having access to the full galley/steward cooked meals.

If it's small berths and large common facilities, the mid passengers would have access to their own galley/eating area and high passengers to the better food/galley/eating area.

Either way, a separate crew galley for security and emotional downtime from the passengers.

Long range exploration/trading/military vessels should probably go for a large berth short of a stateroom/large facility setup, with large kitchens staffed by stewards and one of the medics doing duty as a dietician. That way you keep up morale AND proper diet.

A large enough liner/warship, perhaps a steward and officer's mess.

Might consider differing capabilities of said galleys, using the MgT luxuries mechanic to apply to them to allow for readily created quality meals, along with bigger expenses to stock quality food (probably increased life support costs).

Conversely, possibly some INT or END hits for weeks on end of the space equivalent of g-rations, hardtack and coffee.

Or, NO coffee.

 

[Timerover51]

How do you feed your crews on your ships or in the field? Do you have a ship's galley or kitchen? Or do you have a nutri-matic you stole from Douglas Adams that when you press a button dispenses something that is almost, but not quite, entirely unlike anything you'd actually want to eat?

I thought I'd borrow these definitions from the army:

A-Ration (Garrison Ration) - Fresh, refrigerated, or frozen food prepared in kitchen
B-Ration (Field Ration) - Canned, packaged, or preserved foods prepared in kitchen without refrigeration
C-Ration (Individual Ration) - Complete, pre-cooked, ready-to-eat individual meal (also known as MRE)

Adding to this list:

S-Ration (Survival Ration) - compact packaged food that can be stored for a long time, high in carbs and calories.
G-Ration (Geedunk Ration) - Cookies, candies, assorted snacks.

You need to feed your crews, so how do you do it?

Being a former US Army Quartermaster officer, I use pretty much US Army and Navy standards with the A and B rations for the larger ships and crews. My galley is based on the one in the former Coast Guard buoy tender and icebreaker Bramble, for which I have pretty good deck plans and is about 15 feet by 15 feet for working space, or 3 decks squares by 3 deck squares, using the 1.5 meter deck square (with is almost exactly 5 feet). For quick meals, I use microwave dinners which are refrigerated. As my custom ships all have 3 watches, my crews are larger than called for by the rules, and I have a dedicated cook onboard. Then I also found online a nice aircraft galley used by the US Navy after WW2 for the long-endurance patrol planes that works nicely for smaller ships like your scouts. It fits into one deck square of 1.5 X 1.5 meters. Refrigeration and frozen food storage is based on the Bramble's storage for a 50 man crew, along with standard US Army food storage manuals. They call for 3 cubic feet of refrigerator and frozen food space per man per month.

One ton of Class B rations, 2240 pounds or about 370 man-days, takes up just under 100 cubic feet, so you can store 5 tons of food per 1 Traveller Displacement Ton of 14 cubic meters or 13.5 cubic meters. As that is based on the men consuming 4000 calories per day, a ton of Class B rations is good for a bit longer for sedentary crew. Class A rations take up about the same amount of space, but you have to allow for refrigeration in there. Remember too that perishable foods do have a limited shelf life, so would be replaced after each jump. Some of the preserved food is good for 5 years.

I also posted my version of the Emergency or Survival Ration in the Ship's Locker it you want to look at that. I based it on the WW2 D Ration, for which I have the recipe, with additional vitamins packed with it.

I am working up a recipe for my version of Ex-Tee Three using the US Army WW1 iron or emergency ration, a mixture of pemmican, parched and ground wheat, fats, and sugar. The Army included a small bar of chocolate with that as well.

 

[kilemall]

Oh ya, and the Rossomatic, the dishwasher built to Andromeda Strain autoclave standards.

Named after a big germophobe we all know.

 

[BwapTED]

RE Rum ration:

Maybe it is given out after Jump is initiated and successful entry into Jumpspace has been made?

I imagine that week in J-space includes maintenance tasks, but there's no flying to do, right?

 

[Condottiere]

 

[elbmc1969]

Sopping wet from the rain and freezing, we went into a 7-Eleven in semi-rural Japan and found ...

The funny thing was, the label was all in English! No Japanese at all on the one we picked up.

Oh, and there was also a heated, padded toilet seat with built-in bidet in the bathroom. The Japanese are light-years ahead of us in toilet technology.

 

[Condottiere]

As I recall, they invented, or innovated it for all those sarariman and office ladies who were really in a hurry.

And that's what you want in a starship, a toilet that's light years ahead.

It is missing one thing, a coffee enema.

 

[Nightwind1]

Being a former US Army Quartermaster officer, I use pretty much US Army and Navy standards with the A and B rations for the larger ships and crews. My galley is based on the one in the former Coast Guard buoy tender and icebreaker Bramble, for which is have pretty good deck plans and is about 15 feet by 15 feet for working space, or 3 decks squares by 3 deck squares, using the 1.5 meter deck square (with is almost exactly 5 feet).

Funny enough, I was a Subsistence Specialist (Cook) on a 180" buoy-tender, sister-ship to Bramble (USCGC Sundew, WLB-404). The galley was primarily prep and cooking space, with a reefer and freezer about the size of home fridges. We kept the majority of frozen and reefered stores below-decks in larger walk-in reefer and freezer. Dry stores were kept in their own storage compartment just off of the forward berthing.

For food prep, the small galley had a fryer, a flattop, a six-burner stove and two ovens (under the flattop and stove). The space also included a sink, a couple of counters, a steamline for serving, a couple of cupboards and a large-ish stand mixer.

Try cooking for a crew of 65 in 12-foot seas on a 180" cutter sometime!

 

[whartung]

B-Ration (Field Ration) - Canned, packaged, or preserved foods prepared in kitchen without refrigeration

Canonically, it's generally what you list as a B-Ration, perhaps (I can't immediately recall) with A-Rations for High Passengers. There's an actual size/space note from... Beltstrike?

Funny you'd think of all the problems on a starship, refrigeration wouldn't be one of them.

 

[kilemall]

The BeltStrike standard is for total life support including food- each life support week is 1000 Cr, you can fit 150 life support weeks into one ton.

So 150,000 Cr per ton.

Obviously if you are talking about planetside and no life support needs, I'd probably go with a 150,000 Cr per ton mechanism for bulk and figure out how many days/weeks that is based on the CT cuisine quality/cost rules.

 

[BwapTED]

Yeah, I'd place food under 'life support', along with atmospheric-recyclers, cooling for pressurized sections, and all that stuff.

I mean, under life support costs in Book 2 generation. I don't mean that a more detailed look isn't worth it.
I really like these kind of details.

 

[kilemall]

Yeah, I'd place food under 'life support', along with atmospheric-recyclers, cooling for pressurized sections, and all that stuff.

I mean, under life support costs in Book 2 generation. I don't mean that a more detailed look isn't worth it.
I really like these kind of details.

That's why I do the detailed combat/medical system, work out all the engineering and other such things. If I KNOW what happened and WHY, the more effectively I can convey it to the players AND have alternative interesting options for them to try or troubles to experience.

A bunch of cargo hits from a meteor storm during the expedition just trashes the ATVs and other items- 'free' hits that don't hurt- until it hit the 2 tons of life support supplies....

Or the players were smart and portioned out the life support supplies to different ship holds/cubby holes to reduce loss risk, they have enough to get home but only the SPAM cans survived....

 

[Timerover51]

Funny enough, I was a Subsistence Specialist (Cook) on a 180" buoy-tender, sister-ship to Bramble (USCGC Sundew, WLB-404). The galley was primarily prep and cooking space, with a reefer and freezer about the size of home fridges. We kept the majority of frozen and reefered stores below-decks in larger walk-in reefer and freezer. Dry stores were kept in their own storage compartment just off of the forward berthing.

For food prep, the small galley had a fryer, a flattop, a six-burner stove and two ovens (under the flattop and stove). The space also included a sink, a couple of counters, a steamline for serving, a couple of cupboards and a large-ish stand mixer.

Try cooking for a crew of 65 in 12-foot seas on a 180" cutter sometime!

I actually tried to by the Bramble for use on the Great Lakes. The Sundew is owned by Jeff Foster. I spent two days going over the Bramble and have a lot of photos of the ship when it was still a museum ship in Port Huron. They had drained the large cold storage area of refrigerant, while the dry storage area was still in good shape. The deck plans show all of that. The galley was still in use by school groups and Boy Scouts for overnights, and now the Bramble's owner has been taking it out into Lake Huron. Having seen some video of a couple of 180s in use in Alaska as fishing boats, I can readily imagine that cooking in rough weather was not easy. As they were also ice breakers, the bottom was not shaped for resistance to rolling.

 

[Ex_Pendable]

Canonically, it's generally what you list as a B-Ration, perhaps (I can't immediately recall) with A-Rations for High Passengers. There's an actual size/space note from... Beltstrike?

Thanks for the reference, I'll have to check that.

Fundamentally I think you have to decide just how a ship operates in order to determine how the crews are fed. Merchant ships that hit a new port every week or so can eat pretty fresh. Naval ships that might be on patrol for weeks or months are going to be more limited - but that may also be a function of rank.

I like your assessment, although hydroponics can throw some new wrinkles into that.

The bigger question? Is there a rum ration?

US Navy ships that are out to sea for 45 days and are not scheduled to make port in two weeks are authorized to issue two cans of beer to the crew. Crew member shows id card, is marked on the list, and then the can of beer is opened in front of crew member and he or she drinks it on the mess deck, in full view of the ship's master at arms. No hoarding/trading your beer for a bender, you see.

Merchant ships operate by different rules, I'm sure. As long as you're able to work.

on the ICS Jefferson Davis there is the general passenger mess served by two robot/steward food prep stations, the high-social-status dining club served by a high-skill steward, the crew mess served by themselves, and the officers' wardroom served by a full kitchen and staff. in addition in noble country one of the suites can be replaced by a professional kitchen and staff.

Very nice! Could you tell me which compartments on your deck plans are the various messes?

Being a former US Army Quartermaster officer, I use pretty much US Army and Navy standards with the A and B rations for the larger ships and crews. My galley is based on the one in the former Coast Guard buoy tender and icebreaker Bramble, for which I have pretty good deck plans and is about 15 feet by 15 feet for working space, or 3 decks squares by 3 deck squares, using the 1.5 meter deck square (with is almost exactly 5 feet). For quick meals, I use microwave dinners which are refrigerated. As my custom ships all have 3 watches, my crews are larger than called for by the rules, and I have a dedicated cook onboard. Then I also found online a nice aircraft galley used by the US Navy after WW2 for the long-endurance patrol planes that works nicely for smaller ships like your scouts. It fits into one deck square of 1.5 X 1.5 meters. Refrigeration and frozen food storage is based on the Bramble's storage for a 50 man crew, along with standard US Army food storage manuals. They call for 3 cubic feet of refrigerator and frozen food space per man per month.

Thank you, that's very helpful! Your watch system is sensible and familiar. The TV dinners is something I've considered for unique diets.

One ton of Class B rations, 2240 pounds or about 370 man-days, takes up just under 100 cubic feet, so you can store 5 tons of food per 1 Traveller Displacement Ton of 14 cubic meters or 13.5 cubic meters. As that is based on the men consuming 4000 calories per day, a ton of Class B rations is good for a bit longer for sedentary crew. Class A rations take up about the same amount of space, but you have to allow for refrigeration in there. Remember too that perishable foods do have a limited shelf life, so would be replaced after each jump. Some of the preserved food is good for 5 years.

Very helpful, thank you! I've been looking at the T-Ration system the Army and Marines are using, shelf-stable for six months at 80°F and provides 9 or 18 servings per tray. Could be ideal for both large and mid-sized crews.

I also posted my version of the Emergency or Survival Ration in the Ship's Locker it you want to look at that. I based it on the WW2 D Ration, for which I have the recipe, with additional vitamins packed with it.

Yes, thank you!

I am working up a recipe for my version of Ex-Tee Three using the US Army WW1 iron or emergency ration, a mixture of pemmican, parched and ground wheat, fats, and sugar. The Army included a small bar of chocolate with that as well.

Tropical Chocolate?

Funny enough, I was a Subsistence Specialist (Cook) on a 180" buoy-tender, sister-ship to Bramble (USCGC Sundew, WLB-404). The galley was primarily prep and cooking space, with a reefer and freezer about the size of home fridges. We kept the majority of frozen and reefered stores below-decks in larger walk-in reefer and freezer. Dry stores were kept in their own storage compartment just off of the forward berthing.

For food prep, the small galley had a fryer, a flattop, a six-burner stove and two ovens (under the flattop and stove). The space also included a sink, a couple of counters, a steamline for serving, a couple of cupboards and a large-ish stand mixer.

Spoiler:

Try cooking for a crew of 65 in 12-foot seas on a 180" cutter sometime!

Nice picture, I see you also have a serving line with steam hot table. Very helpful, thank you!

Funny you'd think of all the problems on a starship, refrigeration wouldn't be one of them.

It's assumed that space is cold - it isn't, it's a vacuum and has no actual temperature. But items will radiate away their heat until they're just a few degrees above absolute zero. Major freezer burn, certainly. The hard part is keeping everything within an optimum range - not too hot, not too cold.

The BeltStrike standard is for total life support including food- each life support week is 1000 Cr, you can fit 150 life support weeks into one ton.

So 150,000 Cr per ton.

Obviously if you are talking about planetside and no life support needs, I'd probably go with a 150,000 Cr per ton mechanism for bulk and figure out how many days/weeks that is based on the CT cuisine quality/cost rules.

Ah, thank you!

Yeah, I'd place food under 'life support', along with atmospheric-recyclers, cooling for pressurized sections, and all that stuff.

I mean, under life support costs in Book 2 generation. I don't mean that a more detailed look isn't worth it.
I really like these kind of details.

Me too.

That's why I do the detailed combat/medical system, work out all the engineering and other such things. If I KNOW what happened and WHY, the more effectively I can convey it to the players AND have alternative interesting options for them to try or troubles to experience.

A bunch of cargo hits from a meteor storm during the expedition just trashes the ATVs and other items- 'free' hits that don't hurt- until it hit the 2 tons of life support supplies....

Or the players were smart and portioned out the life support supplies to different ship holds/cubby holes to reduce loss risk, they have enough to get home but only the SPAM cans survived....

Or instant oatmeal with blue cheese dressing.

 

[flykiller]

Could you tell me which compartments on your deck plans are the various messes?

sorry, didn't see this earlier.

deck 1 -  6 pub
         13 general pax food distribution
         14 general pax mess
         15 general pax discards intake
         16 high pax food distribution and lounge
deck 2 -  9 officer wardroom
         10 officer galley
deck 3 -  5 crew mess

 

[Ex_Pendable]

sorry, didn't see this earlier.

deck 1 -  6 pub
         13 general pax food distribution
         14 general pax mess
         15 general pax discards intake
         16 high pax food distribution and lounge
deck 2 -  9 officer wardroom
         10 officer galley
deck 3 -  5 crew mess

Thank you!

 

[Limburger59]

High energy plankton