The Imperial Army

[Blue Ghost]

There's always lots of talk about the Scouts, Navy and Marines, but I rarely ever see a discussion about the Imperial Army.

I was wondering what kind of combat role the have in the Imperium. Do they strictly garrison planets, or do they do actual heavy fighting?

I'm too lazy to reach for my rulebook and look them up

 

[aramis]

There isn't an Imperial Army. There are individual worlds Army units, some of whom are seconded to Imperial service.

The Ground Forces of the Imperium herself are the Imperial Marines; Army Troops are to the Imperium as National Guard troops are to the US Government.

 

[rancke]

There isn't an Imperial Army. There are individual worlds Army units, some of whom are seconded to Imperial service.

According to GT:Ground Forces there isn't an Imperial Army. There are plenty of references to the Imperial Army in CT, but all but a few of them can be handwaved away if you wave hard enough. However, there are one or two that clearly shows that the Imperial Army is every bit as much of an Imperial organization as the Scouts and the Navy.

"Over the centuries, the IISS became a major service of the Imperium, equal in stature to the navy [sic] and army [sic]." [Best of JTAS 5-8, p. 13]​

The corollary is that the Imperial Army is a major service of the Imperium, equal in stature to the Navy and the Scouts.

Personally, I believe that if there wasn't an Imperial Army, someone would have to invent it. That is to say, the Emperor would have to ask one of the existing armies under his control to assume various duties that would not be delegated to individual worlds or even duchies. If there wasn't an Imperial Army, the Army of the Domain of Sylea or the Army of Core [Sector] or the Army of Capital would function as one. If you have a job to be done and no one to do it, you get someone who IS there to do it instead.

A historical example of this phenomenon are the British Horse Guards back in Napoleonic times that performed the same functions for the British army that the Admiralty did for the Royal Navy because Britain didn't have a 'Generalty' and the Horse Guards were stationed close to the Government, so they got to do the work instead.

Anyway, if you don't accept GT as canon, then there definitely is an Imperial Army. If, like me, you do accept GT as canon, you have a problem.


Hans

 

[Jame]

Anyway, if you don't accept GT as canon, then there definitely is an Imperial Army. If, like me, you do accept GT as canon, you have a problem.


Hans

My solution is to throw *that bit of* canon out the window and say that there is an Imperial Army as such; there just isn't so much of an organization as for the Navy/Marines.

Though otherwise I accept GT as being as much being canon as anything else.

(If you look at any of my posts on T5 you'll see I want the GT editor, Loren Wiseman, to be the main writer for T5. Shows you what I think...)

 

[Carlobrand]

There isn't an Imperial Army. There are individual worlds Army units, some of whom are seconded to Imperial service.

The Ground Forces of the Imperium herself are the Imperial Marines; Army Troops are to the Imperium as National Guard troops are to the US Government.

Eh?? Then what're all those units in Fifth Frontier War? There are distinct marine units, distinct colonial army units, and distinct - and separate - Imperial army units. Same in Invasion Earth. What of the various Traveller News Service mentions of the Imperial Army? When did GURPS override other canon?

 

[Blue Ghost]

Hmm, me thinks GURPS overstepped a bit here, because it was supposed to diverge from the assasination event, not replace that which happened before--or so I'm of the understanding.

Yeah, the army is specifically referenced throughout CT. I'll accept that there are other armed forces created and mustered by various worlds and what not, but there's also a regular standing army for the Imperium.

 

[MCEvans]

The Imperial Army - by manpower the largest of the Imperial Armed Services
by PR - the least seen and they like it that way

 

[far-trader]

I have long held that yes there is an Imperial Army. I think I first inferred if when we started playing with the first LBBs shortly after they came out. From the Draft roll. In my opinion all the services were equal and Imperial. Later there was more definition and layers but originally for us we served in the Imperial Army, Navy, Marines, Scouts or Merchants (naturally "Other" meant you avoided the service draft).

I think my earliest confirmation of an Imperial Army comes from CT Supplement 6: 76 Patrons - pg22:

"26. Army Officer...

Player's Information:

...the players are approached by a young woman in the uniform of the Imperial army."

Seems pretty cut and dried to me

I'm sure there were others too.

 

[McPerth]

I'm sure there were others too.

From TNS, JTAS 6, page 5:

Reliable sources in the defense establishement had admitted in private that the Imperial Army 1197 Separate Light Infantry Brigade (...)

(emphasis is mine)

As you see, there are, and I guess quite more...

 

[mike wightman]

Early TAS bulletins mention Imperial Army units being deployed to Efate.

GURPS got it very wrong on this one.

 

[far-trader]

According to GT:Ground Forces there isn't an Imperial Army.

From the Traveller wikia it sounds like GURPS: Ground Forces did have the Imperial Army codified in it? Is the entry wrong?

http://traveller.wikia.com/wiki/Imperial_Army

 

[rancke]

I'm not going to spend much effort on defending the non-existence of the Imperial Army, but as I said, a lot of the references can be handwaved away. The idea is that when the Imperium needs an army unit, they borrow one from a member world and stick them into Imperial Army uniforms. So any TNS reference can be explained away by that prolific journalist TNS staff writer getting it wrong. Other references -- quite a lot of them, really -- can be explained aways as being to planetary army bodies temporarily seconded to the Imperium.

But there are some references that IMO can't be handwaved.


Hans

 

[Otto Harkaman]

Here is a listing of Imperial Regular, Colonial and Marine units available for the Invasion of Earth during the Solomani Rim War.

http://www.lexweb.us/invasionearth/imperialgroundtroops.pdf

 

[Dragoner]

There are quite a few mentions in the FFW as well about the Imperial Army, as well as differenciation from colonial forces. However, that being said, it makes no sense that the Imperium would not maintain a standing army structurally, ie: command, staff, supply, etc. . Only about 10% of modern militaries are actual combat troops.

 

[Magnus von Thornwood]

Lift v. Grav?

So, I have been lurking and enjoying for while this thread and I just checked out the list of Invasion: Earth Imperial Ground Troops and I am again confused by some of the designations.

So, what the fanark is the difference between Lift Troops and Grav Troops?

Also, why the additional designation Armored?

Laterness,
Craig.

 

[Otto Harkaman]

Well I see what you mean. My assumption is that the Grav units seem more attack oriented and the lift units seem more like they have internal movement capabilities but "soft" skinned transports.

 

[Dragoner]

Grav could be mechanized and lift as in lift infantry, with armor meaning heavier armor brigade element.

 

[Dragoner]

There are quite a few mentions in the FFW as well about the Imperial Army, as well as differenciation from colonial forces. However, that being said, it makes no sense that the Imperium would not maintain a standing army structurally, ie: command, staff, supply, etc. . Only about 10% of modern militaries are actual combat troops.

Building on this, a rough outline IMTU:

The Imperial army follows a pattern inherited from the Terran (French) using a general staff style supreme command. Thus the command structure is separated into four parts:

(a) is mobilization (including colonial forces)
(b) is intelligence
(c) is operations
(d) is communications

The same is with the orders given by the HQ, with the orders showing the work of all 4 units of the SHQIA (Supreme Headquarters Imperial Army). Other HQ's for sectors and theaters world follow a similar organization such as SecHQIASpinMar, with the letter designation following in reports or orders as: SecHQIASpinMar(a) for orders concerning the mobilization of colonial forces in the Spinward Marches or: SysHQIAEfate(b) for a report on Ine Givar activities on Efate.

Thus a usual order can consist of four parts:
(a) - information about Imperial and Colonial forces, including reinforcements.
(b) - information about enemy forces.
(c)- information about the mission objectives of operations, and general instructions how to reach those objectives (though the Army uses mission style tactics for the most part).
(d)- information about communications, logistics etc...

 

[Gray Pennell]

Interesting there are no jump infantry. That could be lift but I see lift being troops that come down in the cutters. The difference between air assault and paratroops.

 

[Garyius2003]

GT: Ground Forces had an Army, and it makes sense in a way.

The is a truly interstellar General Staff/Command function for higher levels, with worlds providing the ground units trained to an Imperial standard and equipped to the same.

In fact, the Imperial Army is the force that has the huge forces, and the 5kon landers.