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TNE Only: What if there was no Virus

My Thoughts

I am unsure how far the Solomani would actually push into 3I space.
For each subsector they advanced into they would need to leave a garrison. They would not want to spread themselves too thin or the reserve fleets of the 3I could push them back or even push through them and take back more territory than they lost.
Same with the other species considering invasion.
 
Chuck Anumia said:
I am unsure how far the Solomani would actually push into 3I space.
For each subsector they advanced into they would need to leave a garrison. They would not want to spread themselves too thin or the reserve fleets of the 3I could push them back or even push through them and take back more territory than they lost.
Same with the other species considering invasion.
Click to expand...

I could not agree more. But also ego has a lot to do with this. They'll be singing songs from the "Rule of Man" and overstepping their asset capabilities. I'd say they're best off if they allow for pocket empires within their borders.
 
Chuck Anumia said:
I am unsure how far the Solomani would actually push into 3I space.
For each subsector they advanced into they would need to leave a garrison. They would not want to spread themselves too thin or the reserve fleets of the 3I could push them back or even push through them and take back more territory than they lost.
Same with the other species considering invasion.
Click to expand...
They'll reclaim their old territory of the Solomani Sphere. They've been preparing for this for decades, and probably have all the ready forces. Beyond that - they probably won't extend themselves much.

Aslan are another thing - they have a generation of ihatei hungry for lands. As long as there are spare ihatei, they'll continue to expand.
 
Golan2072 said:
They'll reclaim their old territory of the Solomani Sphere. They've been preparing for this for decades, and probably have all the ready forces. Beyond that - they probably won't extend themselves much.

Aslan are another thing - they have a generation of ihatei hungry for lands. As long as there are spare ihatei, they'll continue to expand.
Click to expand...

And then they'd run into the Solomani Confederation, who'd want to "Kick the Kitties Out!"

AND this might also cause a number of the former 3I areas to join together to "kick the Kitties Out!"

Though in the 3I some of the "smarter" ihatei night be able to do what the ones in the Darrian Confederation did - trade troops for land, especially in the areas staring at the SolCon across the other border.
 
rancke said:
Out of 4000 independent clan lords Lucan can probably find someone that will talk to him. Maybe even Dulinor can. Aslan honor is very... flexible.


Hans
Click to expand...

We probably need to scrutinize the canon for any generic all encompassing response. They might talk, but big enough to make a difference is another subject.

After the ruling on "depots" I'm certainly not wanting any more devastating canon changes.
 
epicenter00 said:
The desire for land > everything else. The winner writes history. Once the male is sitting on prime land of his dreams, what he did to get it ... well, it's not ideal, but hey LAND!
Click to expand...

If his wives think he's dishonoring them by it, he wakes up to find himself being challenged by his brothers in law and/or her would be suitors.

If his wives think it's dangerous for society, he may not even wake up.

If they simply don't approve, his ships get no fuel and his guns no ammo.

Aslan society has an interesting power balance.
 
Chuck Anumia said:
Perhaps a smart Emperor of the 3I would offer the "Kitties" land for their help pushing the Solomani back into their place?
Click to expand...

If there was just an Emperor of the 3I...

aramis said:
epicenter00 said:
The desire for land > everything else. The winner writes history. Once the male is sitting on prime land of his dreams, what he did to get it ... well, it's not ideal, but hey LAND!
Click to expand...
If his wives think he's dishonoring them by it, he wakes up to find himself being challenged by his brothers in law and/or her would be suitors.

If his wives think it's dangerous for society, he may not even wake up.

If they simply don't approve, his ships get no fuel and his guns no ammo.

Aslan society has an interesting power balance.
Click to expand...

Or an Assasin could well visit him if the actions he did to obtain this prime land are too dishonorable...
 
My Thoughts

epicenter00 said:
The desire for land > everything else. The winner writes history. Once the male is sitting on prime land of his dreams, what he did to get it ... well, it's not ideal, but hey LAND!
Click to expand...
That was my thought as well.
Land is the greatest drive for Aslan Society.
The females are the checks and balances to the approved ways of getting land as Aramis has pointed out.
 
epicenter00 said:
It's more like "The Colossus Stumbles A Little."

The Rebellion would honestly end really soon if Strephon announces himself in 1116. I doubt it'd even be remembered as a Rebellion, more like "Dulinor's Putsch." GDW (and a lot of players) I think consistently don't take into account the changes into people's thinking that news taking months to get to them from Capital would do to the thinking of nobles in an Imperium that has stood for 1,000 years. There'd be a tremendous amount of "wait and see."

None of the internal factions, save Dulinor's and Lucan's factions would have ever arisen in a formal manner if he announces himself in 1116. The later factions arose from the stress of the civil war. In 1116 and much of 1117 a lot of these potential factions are still in shock and probably have a "wait and see" attitude.
Click to expand...

In my mind there's a lot to recommend these points. Several aspects of the Rebellion timeline work to get GDW/DGP's desired end results but don't make much sense to me. Most of the future faction leaders have a vested interest in waiting and seeing in an attempt to ride out the storm. They derive their legitimacy from the Imperium and initially they won't want to mess that up. Strephon popping up in 1116 would make them want to freeze in place and figure out whether he really is the Emperor or not. Caution is warranted but declaring independence, or worse yet, a claim to the Throne, just smacks of opportunism. At some point the Imperial Navy would have stepped in to keep the noble leadership in line if it began to stray too far. And there's no way the Navy would allow Lucan to gut so many regions for ships to throw at Dulinor. Again, it makes a good story, (in some ways), but it's not very convincing.

Of course it's not much of a Rebellion if nobody shows up to play either. :)
 
Vargas said:
In my mind there's a lot to recommend these points. Several aspects of the Rebellion timeline work to get GDW/DGP's desired end results but don't make much sense to me. Most of the future faction leaders have a vested interest in waiting and seeing in an attempt to ride out the storm. They derive their legitimacy from the Imperium and initially they won't want to mess that up. Strephon popping up in 1116 would make them want to freeze in place and figure out whether he really is the Emperor or not. Caution is warranted but declaring independence, or worse yet, a claim to the Throne, just smacks of opportunism. At some point the Imperial Navy would have stepped in to keep the noble leadership in line if it began to stray too far. And there's no way the Navy would allow Lucan to gut so many regions for ships to throw at Dulinor. Again, it makes a good story, (in some ways), but it's not very convincing.

Of course it's not much of a Rebellion if nobody shows up to play either. :)
Click to expand...

I was never a fan of the Shattered Imperium myself. However, one of the implications of the Shattered Imperium is that the institutions of the Imperium were far less stable than they appeared - the person of the acknowledged Emperor was the sole unifying factor and without such a person to hold everything together, everything, well, Shattered.
 
Vargas said:
In my mind there's a lot to recommend these points. Several aspects of the Rebellion timeline work to get GDW/DGP's desired end results but don't make much sense to me. Most of the future faction leaders have a vested interest in waiting ...And there's no way the Navy would allow Lucan to gut so many regions for ships to throw at Dulinor. Again, it makes a good story, (in some ways), but it's not very convincing.

Of course it's not much of a Rebellion if nobody shows up to play either. :)
Click to expand...

And they are waiting. Dulinor and Lucan are at war. When Lucan insists on loyalty and everyone sits back to watch. He tries taking their resources. The only way Lucan can survive a 7-8 front war until TNE is if he has additional resources at the right times. The only way Dulinor isn't crushed is if Lucan screws up the CORR, LISH, OLDE fleet call-to-arms.

Lucan is one of two Grand Admirals of the Imperium Navy. He can tell the navy to do anything...there are missing pieces from Rebellion Sourcebook and follwup books.
 
My problem with Lucan is he needs to be dead. Who the heck is protecting him?

He's third in line to the throne. He's maybe got some sycophants, but the major movers are expecting Strephon to have a lot of years left and Varian to take over after him. Now Strephon is dead, Varian is dead, Lucan is being accused of murder and dissolving the Moot and pissing off a number of movers just by that and eventually shooting someone in his court and acting generally like a royal lunatic. He is a textbook case for the Cleon-three treatment. (Cleon III, aka Cleon the mad, assassinated 245 after having been found to be a homicidal maniac.) This is a man who by all rights should mysteriously disappear from the picture while official pronouncements of his heroic death in battle play over the hyper-net and the Moot reconvenes to declare a ceasefire.

In an era when half the upper nobility sits on the sidelines while the kinslayer Emperor and the regicide Archduke have it out, where is he finding people so blindly loyal that he doesn't manage to fall to some clever poison or just get stuffed in a sack and given the "man-in-the-iron-mask" treatment one dark night?

(I might also point out, apropos of nothing in particular, that there are enough "people" in the Vegan Autonomous District - and at high enough tech level - to support some 30 fleets of their own, and the tensions in that sector and the Imperial intention to use them as a counterweight to the Solomani dispose me to suspect the Vegans'd have at least some if not most of those fleets. Now, I'm sure the Solomani had a lot of fleets of their own, but they were off trying to do everything at once. I gotta think the Vegans would have held on to their corner of the universe more firmly than is portrayed.)
 
Carlobrand said:
My problem with Lucan is he needs to be dead. Who the heck is protecting him?

He's third in line to the throne. He's maybe got some sycophants, but the major movers are expecting Strephon to have a lot of years left and Varian to take over after him. Now Strephon is dead, Varian is dead, Lucan is being accused of murder and dissolving the Moot and pissing off a number of movers just by that and eventually shooting someone in his court and acting generally like a royal lunatic. He is a textbook case for the Cleon-three treatment. (Cleon III, aka Cleon the mad, assassinated 245 after having been found to be a homicidal maniac.) This is a man who by all rights should mysteriously disappear from the picture while official pronouncements of his heroic death in battle play over the hyper-net and the Moot reconvenes to declare a ceasefire.

In an era when half the upper nobility sits on the sidelines while the kinslayer Emperor and the regicide Archduke have it out, where is he finding people so blindly loyal that he doesn't manage to fall to some clever poison or just get stuffed in a sack and given the "man-in-the-iron-mask" treatment one dark night?
Click to expand...

Fully agreed. I cannot for the life of me imagine why anyone is taking orders from Lucan, at least not after he shows his true colors. Every Admiral/Noble/General/Bureuacrat would be afraid for their lives, and are inexplicably loyal to a man who has neither loyalty toward them nor a prior base of support by some "party" of ideologues. With the precedent of the "Right of Assassination" in its historical form to rid the Imperium of Cleon the Mad, I do not know why anyone did not exercise it (especially after he disbanded the Moot to prevent deliberation over his legitimacy & ascension, and began executing those who failed him).

And BTW, Lucan is third in line to the throne after Strephon, but the expectation is that Grand Princess Ciencia is 1st in line and will take over after Strephon, then deceased Princess Lydia's sons Prince Varian and Prince Lucan in that order. So Lucan's claim to the throne is even more remote.
 
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