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What is the working life time of a space craft?

Re: used car example
It's dependant on who is certifying said vehicle....
Under U.K MOT (Ministry of Transport) testing, said 1995 car would automatically fail it's MOT test, due to the cracked windscreen, & as such is regarded as unroadworthy....
As such, WV 5-6.....?

If my car really had a wear value of 5, it would have only a 50% chance per day to work when I need it, and that's just not so. it would be more accurate to say that the UK requires Wear Value 0, which doesn't even exist in TNE.

By the rules as written the chance of a vehicle breakdown is equal to WV on a d10, checked every 8 hours, or fraction thereof, the equipment is used. Thus a brand new car (Wear value 1) has a 10% chance of a potential breakdown when you go to drive it to work. If the vehicle has not received its routine maintenance in the last week the potential breakdown is automatically an actual breakdown. A ground car requires 2 hours of maintenance a week.
Therefore by the rules as written a brand new car that hasn't been getting 2 hours of skilled maintenance a week will have a 10% chance of a breakdown every time you drive to work, and if it has been getting 2 hours of maintenance a week than you still have to make a difficult task against the skill of the maintenance person to avoid the breakdown. To actually be sure there is no chance of breakdown on that new car will require 4 hours of maintenance a week.

My car probably gets 4 hours of maintenance a year (assuming brushing the snow off doesn't count as maintenance) and it runs fine 99.9% of the time. Therefore the TNE rules are broken at least for groundcars. Minimum maintenance of any vehicle seems to be 1 hour a week, but most new cars probably need more like1 hour/ 6months.
 
Wear value

The wear value in TNE starts at 0, so a car will in theory run just fine when new. As it ages and breaks down it's wear value will increase, more from breaking down than from age.
The rules in TNE actually work well and add to the overall setting.
 
Wrong, Peter.

The chance of an actual breakdown would be ((WV)/10/ * ((Mechanic's Asset)/20) per 8 hours of operation (the "day" of operation).

Knowing your driving habits, that's a "day" a week.
 
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"Wrong, Peter.

The chance of an actual breakdown would be ((WV)/10/ * ((Mechanic's Asset)/20) per 8 hours of operation (the "day" of operation).

Knowing your driving habits, that's a "day" a week."

More like a day a month. But that's not how I understood it. According to the TNE main rules [p 241 of the Mark 1 Mod 1 version, column 2, par 1] "For most vehicles, including planetary vehicles (all ground vehicles...), potential breakdowns are rolled for eadh eight-hour period _(or fraction therof)_ [emphasis added] for which the equipment is used."

Therefore since it says "or fraction thereof" I need to check for every drive to and from work even if that is only a five or ten minute drive. Do the rules say anything different somewhere else, or are you just reading it differently?
 
The wear value in TNE starts at 0, so a car will in theory run just fine when new. As it ages and breaks down it's wear value will increase, more from breaking down than from age.
The rules in TNE actually work well and add to the overall setting.

The rules say that the wear value of a piece of major equipment is determined by rolling 1d10, and that the value of an item is its base price divided by its wear value. Therefore 1) it can't have a wear value of 0, and 2) something with a wear value of 1 costs full price. Thus a new item must be wear value 1 according to page 241 of the TNE main rules. Do they say soemthing else somewhere else?
 
TNE wear value

The thing to remember about TNE is that everything is assumed to be rebuilt, each rebuild beyond new adds 1 to the wear vallue and every 10 break-downs add 1 to the wear value, the rolling a d10 is, I assume a quick and dirty way of modeling the history a a piece of equipment. As for what the wear generated is I would assume that the roll is 0-9 not 1-10, at least that's how I would do it in my campaign. Of course you could do it the otherway, if you decide there is no new equipment being manufactured.
 
This (WV 0) is supported in the wear value rules in T2K2.x
 
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what the TNE rules say

I believe part of this is because TNE and Twilight use the same rules set, in an attempt to increase interchangiblity between the products. It would make sense that rule in one game and the other would support one another, not work to seperate the systems.
 
TNE was using the Twilight 2000 rules -- GDWs "house rules" after Mark Miller left GDW IIRC. So the rules should be more or less identical. That's why I never switched to TNE -- I wasn't very fond of Twilight 2000's rules...
 
Twighlight 2000 rules were fine, as they were specifically designed to work for the "modern military" genre... but they had to change them to "update the game" for the 2nd edition (and develop their "house rules").

Yes, this was specifically to try to blindly follow the "universal system" craze... Hero system was the first, but then Palladium, Gurps, etc came along, and the clones at GDW wanted the same for their stuff, so they made up that crud.
 
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Essentially, T2K 1 and T2K 2 are not related mechanically (any more than any other GDW design was simply by being written by the same group of guys.

But the differences between T2K2.0 and DC1.0 are negligible; T2K2 has vehicles and military careers in detail, while DC has the "psionics" rules and monsters. TNE uses bits of both, and the task system upgrades (which were included in the TNE1.1 Ref's Screen, and the DC1.1 rulebook).

Mechanically, TNE is about 80% T2K, but T2K is about 97% in TNE.

Hence why it's a valid cite for understanding TNE.
 
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Actually TNE is based on Twilight 2nd Edition 2. Version, the version that uses D20 instead of D10 for task resolution. IMHO lousy chargen but solid game system.
 
Ok, now how about if some how a ship is left abandoned in space with fuel tanks full and power plant just just idleing like a computer in sleep mode? Or set down on a planet, asteroid, etc. In other words how long will it stay in working order assuming it takes no damage from a meteorite or something else. Assume it is left in full working order and the crew never returned for some reason. How long before the power plant turns to lead or whatever happens to it? Can someone find it after say 200 years and use it? If so, what has to be done to make it usable?
 
... a ship is left abandoned in space ... say 200 years ... what has to be done to make it usable?
all gaskets and seals replaced. all rubber and plastic replaced. all exterior sensor devices replaced (micrometeorite damage), along with all exterior window glass or whatever is used.

all emp damage from solar flares identified and repaired - though of course a hinky computer or a slightly off-balance ai could be an adventure all by itself.

new acceleration couches on the bridge.

might about do it.
 
Ok, now how about if some how a ship is left abandoned in space with fuel tanks full and power plant just just idleing like a computer in sleep mode? Or set down on a planet, asteroid, etc. In other words how long will it stay in working order assuming it takes no damage from a meteorite or something else. Assume it is left in full working order and the crew never returned for some reason. How long before the power plant turns to lead or whatever happens to it? Can someone find it after say 200 years and use it? If so, what has to be done to make it usable?
If it's left with fuel tanks full, there needs to be some sort of steady power supply to keep the liquid hydrogen cooled enough to remain liquid (or some other method to keep the ship REALLY cold). Otherwise, if it heats, the hydrogen will go to a gaseous state, and the result will be much like what happens when you put a bunch of water in a pressure cooker and supply enough heat to turn it to steam without giving it a vent...

In other words, BOOM.

A ship could be designed (in theory) to make it easy to keep that fuel liquid, but it's going to require specific design choices. There's going to have to be some assessment of what temperature range the fuel needs to stay at, and what temperature range is going to work for the rest of the ship. What sort of autonomous routines will the ship go to when it's been sitting there? Presumably, there will be standing instructions to "perform actions X, Y, and Z if the following internal conditions exist...", and that's going to be affected by how capable you think ship's computers ought to be.

You could also just have the ship vent the fuel tanks as needed, which might be simpler.

As far as power plant life expectancy... I'm not aware of anything that gives rules for TLs found in Imperial space. GT:Starships makes some mention
of Darrian ships with extremely long life expectancies, but that seems to imply regular refits and rebuilds. I'd have to say a lot would depend on the situation, but that it's not totally impossible for a ship to "hibernate", so to speak, and be able to fly with some work to get it back into some semblance of functionality. There will be issues with materials that have aged or rotted, but if it's "fly the old ship or die of asphyxiation", you could probably make it workable for ships that are around two or three hundred years old. It's really a GM call, as we don't know the particulars of the technologies involved -- will the power plant crap out? Will the moving parts still move? Will the electronics still work? Will the gravitics handle being shut down for that long? Many materials don't like really long-term exposure to vacuum, too, and we don't know the details of how advanced materials would handle it. If it's not specifically designed to hold up for decades or centuries, I have doubts that it would do so; there would also be the question of whether typical materials in use would have that built in, or if it would only be economically sensible to use materials that aren't excessively durable.

It's not going to be "Hey, cool, look at my spiffy new ship that I found!", but it might be, "Hey, look what I managed to get to move with spit and duct tape and prayer!" You're going to need major refitting at the closest available port before it's even remotely going to be safe.
 
Actually, most ships will cool rather rapidly without an operating plant. Down to whatever the local blackbody temp is...

Due to fusion plants, one has to have the ship set to shed heat, otherwise one cooks.

And generally, once more than one orbit past the ecosphere, and you're down to liquid temps anyway. Further, pressure alone is used to liquify many nominaly gasseous compounds... Keep it in a sufficiently strong tank, and it stays liquid until the pressure-altered boiling point. (Both liguification and solidification temps vary by pressure. Both go up.
 
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