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Who is in command on a scout vessel?

L

l_c_jackson

SOC-9
Hi

The Scouts Field branch has no ranks. Where you have a crew of a scout ship made up of Field branch, which one is in command?

Suggestion #1: The Pilot, as he is likely to be responsible for any tactical decisons made in space.

Suggestion #2: The most senior (longest serving) crewmember. However this method would need some other method as a tiebreaker.

How do other GM's handle this issue?

Thanks, Lindsay Jackson.
 
Seniority, except where areas of expertize come into effect.

Pilot in tactical, biologist/geologist while picking where to set down. Xeno-specialist/linguist (or highest level of Carousing :D ) when dealing with natives.

Ties broken by paper scissors rock, twister or spin the bottle. Unless a crewmember's Aslan. Let the aslan win.

No, wait, that's wookies, but I think it still applies.
 
I think by "rank" they just mean that they don't have a rigid paramilitary hierarchy. They obviously have some hierarchy.

Besides a lot of that "having no rank" sounds like affectation.
 
Seriayne said:
Seniority, except where areas of expertize come into effect.

Pilot in tactical, biologist/geologist while picking where to set down. Xeno-specialist/linguist (or highest level of Carousing :D ) when dealing with natives.

Ties broken by paper scissors rock, twister or spin the bottle.
Click to expand...
The pilot/"owner" is in charge of the ship. The second-in-command (Exec) is in charge of personnel support (certification, records, training, et cetera). The mission leader is in charge of the mission (the aforementioned biologist, geologist, linguist, and first-contact experts).

Those who plan and order the mission usually set up precedence, for instance:

"The Mission Leader is in charge of the mission once you reach your destination, and until you depart that destination. If any member of the team has trouble, then the (Exec) will take charge of that situation, and may over-ride mission objectives to do so. If the ship or crew is in danger, then the Pilot is in charge, and may take any actions as necessary to ensure the safety of the ship and crew, even if it means over-riding the orders of the Exec or Mission Leader."

"(... agent Rekobah, you have your own set of orders ... maintain your cover story, if at all possible...)"
 
Seriayne said:
Seniority, except where areas of expertize come into effect.

Pilot in tactical, biologist/geologist while picking where to set down. Xeno-specialist/linguist (or highest level of Carousing :D ) when dealing with natives.
Click to expand...

Nailed it IMTU.. except---

Seriayne said:
Ties broken by paper scissors rock, twister or spin the bottle. Unless a crewmember's Aslan. Let the aslan win.
Click to expand...

Ties broken by cutting the cards (so gambling skill comes in). Unless a crewmember is Hiver, then only the Hiver knows who is really in charge. ;)
 
Sean Connery is always in charge....."or do I have to kick all of your a$$e$ out the airlock first?"

battleBuck.jpg
 
Most Senior when on ground. Seniormost pilot in flight.
Most Senior is by enlistment timestamp, plus one year per special duty.
Most Senior Pilot is same calc, but only amongst those with pilot skill... which, for basic gen, is all of them... but not for advanced.
 
The pilot of a Scout survey ship is the commander of the mission

Thanks all, there are some interesting ideas there.

I just came across a partial answer in the "World Builder's Handbook" under the specifications for the "Donosev" class survey starship (page 49). It says:

"33 Commander's Office: The pilot of a Scout survey ship is the commander of the mission, and as such merits a private office as well as a stateroom." So, that's Survey Branch sorted out.

The remaining field branches are: Exploration and Communications. I can't think of a good reason why they would adopt a different method, can you?

I can see problems if the Scouts were to switch commanders, depending upon the situation. By this rule, there would be emergencies in which it is not entirely clear which specialist should be giving the orders. For example, while taking off (implies pilot) under fire from the ground (implies exploration specialist). Such ambiguity could easily be fatal for all onboard and should be avoided at all costs!

The seniority method (with tie-breaker) would at least give a single consistent answer at all times (assuming a consistent tie-breaker - not cards!) It's perfectly workable, it just does not appear to have been used.
 
l_c_jackson said:
Thanks all, there are some interesting ideas there.

I just came across a partial answer in the "World Builder's Handbook" under the specifications for the "Donosev" class survey starship (page 49). It says:

"33 Commander's Office: The pilot of a Scout survey ship is the commander of the mission, and as such merits a private office as well as a stateroom." So, that's Survey Branch sorted out.

The remaining field branches are: Exploration and Communications. I can't think of a good reason why they would adopt a different method, can you?
Click to expand...
For some peculiar reason, people in the Classic Era consider piloting skill to be the defining skill of a shipboard command officer. I've never understood why command officers don't need astrogation skill (IMTU they most certainly do, whereas pilots are merely drivers), but that's how it is. So it makes sense that the pilot is the captain.

Exploration and Communication don't operate ships (except, I suppose, X-boats), so there's no reason why they should single pilots out for command.


Hans
 
Higher command would always designate who is Responsible for the ship. While on the ship, that person is in Command.

If there's a Mission, then higher command would have also designated who's Responsible for the Mission. So, even if that person isn't Responsible for the ship, they would be able to give orders to the Scout that is (think Commodore vs. Ship Captain kind of reasoning).

Now, if you are simply talking some Scouts all happen to come together in the field, the same rules apply (that is, the person Responsible for the ship (even if they are NOT a pilot or navigator) is in charge of the ship). If there's a Meta-decision to be made with respect to an event that would normally fall into the purview of the scouts, the scout with the lowest service serial number ("senior") in the applicable branch would become Mission lead and have the responsibility for that mission.

There is no need for tie breakers. If the day you graduated from Scout Training your friend Willie got his serial number before you, then he's "senior" to you until he leaves the Scouts.

IMU. YMMV.
 
Rancke2 said:
If the mission commander is not in command of the ship then he is not part of the crew either, which was what the original question was about.
Click to expand...

The mission commander is not part of the ship's crew, yet he is on the ship ( with his own crew ) and he can tell the ship's commander where to take the ship. He is also part of Field Ops too.
The ship commander can refuse the mission leader's orders but had better have a pretty good reason why he forced the mission scrub.

of course the real answer is 'whoever the people in the head office say is in command'

'no ranks' != 'no chain of command'
 
Hi

I realize that there may be some stuff in canon regarding this, but if it were my choice, starting from a clean sheet of paper, I'd think that there would have to be one leader, regardless of whether the team/crew is planet side or shipborne.

In my mind if you try and make the leader dependent on whether you are shipborne or ground borne could lead to problems if the safety of one group (such as the ground team) puts the safety of the ship in danger, or vice versa.

As such, if there is only a single leader, regardless of situation, that person may defer to the opinion of, or ask for input from, others depending on the situation, but final decisions would be the one leader's decision alone. That way there would be no issues with the person in charge of the ship disagreeing with the person in charge of the ground team, etc.

Lacking any form of rank, I'd guess that maybe seniority could be used to decide this, though I could see problems with that, as some people seem to be better suited to managing and sometimes some people seem better suited to a narrower, specialist view.

An alternate thought then would be by crew election. The crew votes and the winner is put in charge, and remains so for a set period of time, or perhaps if there is a vote of no confidence, etc.

A third option would be if a superior officer/leader back at base chooses a leader for the crew.

Anyway just some thoughts.

Regards

PF
 
dean said:
Higher command would always designate who is Responsible for the ship. While on the ship, that person is in Command.
Click to expand...


Gents,

That is the answer here. Everyone else is simply over-thinking the question with tie-breakers, seniority, and all the rest.

When the ship is question is part of a larger organization, the person in command is whomever the Powers That Be of that organization designate is in command. The Powers That Be will also designate a "chain of command", or a system to determine the chain of command, to handle situations when the commander is incapacitated.

"Mission" commanders and the like are most likely not even in the picture as personnel assigned to a "mission" are essentially only "passengers" aboard. Look at an aircraft carrier for example. The commander of the air group aboard isn't part of the carrier's chain of command and, given enough casualties, a lowly lieutenant junior grade will assume command of the ship before the air group boss does.

When dealing with ships operated for and by the PCs, all the "systems" discussed here - and more - will be employed. However, and IMHO, in the case of detached duty scouts the commander will be the person the IISS handed the scout/courier over to. That person may designate someone else as a commander but the IISS will still hold the original commander responsible.


Regards,
Bill
 
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