• Welcome to the new COTI server. We've moved the Citizens to a new server. Please let us know in the COTI Website issue forum if you find any problems.
  • We, the systems administration staff, apologize for this unexpected outage of the boards. We have resolved the root cause of the problem and there should be no further disruptions.

Why don't new people play Traveller?

  • Thread starter Thread starter Malenfant
  • Start date Start date
Aramis,

I think if we recruit our "local" artists this would have spin-offs, when they showcase there work in supplements as people would identify with the characters drawn...btw, when I say realistic I mean things the THB cover or Rebellion Sourcebook or many of the Challenge covers.
 
Some advertizing blurbs or slug lines:
*Dragons are Merciful--Compared to Hard Vaccumn!
*Traveller: A Toolkit for Trouble.
*Come out of your hole and join us in the Stars.
*Traveller: The future of Roleplaying
 
Originally posted by spank:
]*Traveller: The future of Roleplaying [/QB]
I think that would be false advertising, since it wouldn't exactly be introducing any truly novel concepts to roleplaying that everyone would want to follow.

And it's especially ironic, since the game is basically a dinosaur ;)
 
I'm coming in a bit late here (ok, THIRTY PAGES late
) so if I rehash anything I may have missed in my cursory skim of what went before please forgive my oversight.

Traveller has six incarnations of rules sets now. CT, MT, TNE, T4, T20, GurpsTrav, and T5 (if you care to count it in its unfinished state) makes seven. I have GM'd or played in all but the last one, with the bulk of my time spent using TNE. They all work well enough. They all do the job. None of them are perfect. None of them will ever be perfect. I have tweaked the rules in all of them to suit my GM style and/or fancy.

Of the rules sets, my favorites have been a CT/MT amalgam and T20. That’s my preference, not an endorsement. I have friends in several states that will never play Traveller, but buy T20 because its another D20 plug in that they can use with other games they play or run. I also have friends who will never play T20 because its "just not traveller".

And there in lies the rub.

Traveller does not need another rules set. It has plenty of them. It does not need a rehash of old rules that will only be played by semi-progressive minded grognard types (like me). What it needs is new blood.

In my (admittedly limited) experience, the issue that people have with the Traveller tends to be the OTU itself. Often touted as the largest and most fully realized setting in existence, I rather think sometimes that the OTU is a victim of its own success. It happens to be TOO big, TOO well realized, and in many ways forged in stone.

If you wish to play a true exploration campaign, there aren’t too many frontiers. IIRC, the Solomani and the Zhodani hold the only true frontiers. In most settings the Imperium is either fenced in or trying to reclaim blasted bits of its former self. All well and good. I’ve had fun with these, but they are not new ground.

Don't get me wrong. I have enjoyed many long hours with the OTU setting. Its a wonderful gaming environment... IF you understand the setting. But there have been times when I have longed for a true space exploration game in a setting that wasn't so very big, or where ships weren't limited to six parsecs per week. Or where the aliens were different. And please note… I am a fan of the OTU.

The almost universal complaint I have had as a GM when dealing with new players has been that there is simply too much to absorb. I’ve been playing this game since 1986, and I still don’t have all the bits and pieces. How can the newbie possibly get it all?

The simple answer is… they can’t.

So, here comes the sacrilegious statement. Perhaps what Traveller needs to attract new blood is a new setting. Not a new milieu. Not a new star cluster. Not a war scrapped rehash of what already has been. But something altogether new. Not that I wouldn’t mind a full compendium of the totality of Imperial space traveller, but maybe a complete new setting is in order.

It’s a thought anyway.
 
It's easy to bitch about the problems. The question still remains what makes Traveller stand out compared to the other games on the market? How does it capture the dollars of the younger market? What are players looking for that Traveller provides?

If we can answer these questions we have the next generation of players. If not we keep asking the questions of how to attract new players and failing.

One big failure of Traveller IMHO is the fact the Imperium is bound in by other empires. Much of the science fiction Traveller is based on has at its root the American West i.e. the Frontier.

The unknown is the lure of SF in general--Where is the Imperium's frontier? The Spinward Marches used to be but it got bound in too closely by other empires for other storylines.(District 286 not withstanding.)

The introduction of The Shattered Imperium, The Virus, backdating to 1000 all attempt to introduce the element of unknown. The Imperium may of helped Traveller at first (See Marc Miller's interview by DGP in the 10th anniversary issue of Challenge.) Unfortunitly, I believe it has been poorly introduced since its inception.

I've already mentioned my solution in the T5 forum on COTI under the topic: Why, Why? Why!!! where I postulate a future 500 years after the wreckage of the Virus and the realignment of societies since.

Maybe this new history would allow the kids to make the Traveller universe their own. (Simply by knowing it better than us old farts.) In essence, Traveller: Reboot. The new stuff is their's allowing us grognards to ruminate about the golden age of the third imperium.

FWIW,
Lord Iron Wolf
 
I thought we had already covered the main problems - the traveller universe is too big, there's no real intro to the setting for new people to start in, and the background is too bland and non-specific for modern tastes.

The 3I era does need a reboot IMO - toss out all the old canon and rebuild it. Make the universe a bit more current (like adding decent computers, nanotech, biotech, etc) but otherwise generally keep it the same - but remove the inconsistencies and "old school" stuff.

Or alternatively, just dump all that stuff and present something new and exciting - and the closest thing we have to that on the horizon is TNE:1248.
 
Originally posted by Malenfant:
I thought we had already covered the main problems - the traveller universe is too big, there's no real intro to the setting for new people to start in, and the background is too bland and non-specific for modern tastes.
I have to disagree here. I think that Gateway offers a nice size area for a Referee to get started in. The 'Imperium' as a whole and the Solomani War act as a nice background, while pretty much everything a new Referee needs to know about the Domain region is there. Also in the book are adventuring ideas, seeds, even a full adventure.

The 3I era does need a reboot IMO - toss out all the old canon and rebuild it. Make the universe a bit more current (like adding decent computers, nanotech, biotech, etc) but otherwise generally keep it the same - but remove the inconsistencies and "old school" stuff.
Reboot ain't gonna happen. I've already mentioned that. You want an more 'modern' setting, create a new one that isn't the OTU. That's fine and might work. Reworking the OTU? No way. You can't make the changes needed without destroying the fabric of the setting completely.

Or alternatively, just dump all that stuff and present something new and exciting - and the closest thing we have to that on the horizon is TNE:1248.
Hey we DID introduce Deadspace....we do have other ideas....

Hunter
 
Originally posted by hunter:
[QB]
Originally posted by Malenfant:
I have to disagree here. I think that Gateway offers a nice size area for a Referee to get started in.
Well, I was merely reiterating the complaints that others had raised on the rpgnet thread. Though yes, you're right about the Gateway book
.

Reboot ain't gonna happen. I've already mentioned that. You want an more 'modern' setting, create a new one that isn't the OTU. That's fine and might work. Reworking the OTU? No way. You can't make the changes needed without destroying the fabric of the setting completely.
Personally I don't see that as a bad thing ;) . I know it ain't gonna happen though.


Hey we DID introduce Deadspace....we do have other ideas...
Yes, and I'm curious to see them
 
Originally posted by Malenfant:
Personally I don't see that as a bad thing ;) . I know it ain't gonna happen though.
1) I don't necessarily disagree, but I don't fully agree either

2) There ain't a chance in hell I am going to risk alienating even a small fraction of an established fan base that DOES buy OTU materials by rebooting it. :D

3) Whats wrong with a new setting instead? We are already doing 'setting' books. That's really what HH, Aldenata, 1248, Gateway, etc. are.

Hunter
 
I think new, diverse settings are a must. That's one of the driving forces behind the success of D&D -- they keep coming up with new, diverse settings. Greyhawk, Blackmoor, Forgotten Realms, Mystara, Red Steel, Birthright, Planescape, Kara-Tur, Dark Sun, Zakhara, Mazteca, Eberron -- I'm sure I've forgotten some.

Each of those settings attract their fans, and those fans are just as passionate about gaming in those settings, and just as resistant to changing those settings, as the oldest and crusty-est Traveller grognards and gearheads.

So creating a setting with the tropes currently in fashion for science fiction -- nanotech, cybernetics, bioware, genetic engineering, artificial intelligence, etc. -- should be a perfectly logical marketing strategy. It won't be for everyone. But those people will still have the OTU in all its incarnations.

It's like an individual having a strong stock portfolio, or a city having a strong economic base -- diversification is (usually) the key.
 
Originally posted by hunter:
2) There ain't a chance in hell I am going to risk alienating even a small fraction of an established fan base that DOES buy OTU materials by rebooting it. :D
How about in the sense of keeping the OTU the same, but removing inconsistencies etc? Wouldn't be so much of a "reboot" as a "cleanup".

3) Whats wrong with a new setting instead? We are already doing 'setting' books. That's really what HH, Aldenata, 1248, Gateway, etc. are.
Nothing at all! But the problem is that those haven't been finished and published yet (and from the looks of it won't be til next year at the earliest?). It sounds like people would be interested in the 2320AD book (I've been pimping that and 1248 on rpgnet whenever the subjects crop up).

Plus, what's happening with the Guidebook? How does that fit in here, is that coming out before all the other books? I take it you're not interested in any more input from anyone on the playtest board (even though there has been input since the playtest was declared closed - there are still problems with it that people are noticing from the draft material)?
 
What would really work for me is a "setting" book for the JP any time between 990 and 1110.

You have a number loosely aligned of smallish pocket empires with the 3I to the rim, Vargrs to the Spinward, a small area of K'Kree to trailing, and an open frontier to the core.

The 3I can become the 'sleeping giant next door' with a brief out line of JP/3I history. The same with the Vargrs and the K'kree.

Than you can have each of the 'pocket empires' as a test bed of different types of tech goodies (Nanotech, biotech, cybertech, ect...). and a frontier to explore.
 
GT has at least two mini-settings that attempted to allow for biotech etc., one of the Minor Human races in GT: Humaniti and the Islands Clusters articles (article 1, article 2) in JTAS online. Still OTU and at least fleshed out enough to be useable by a Ref. You could also for example move the Islands closer to Earth and create a near earth setting similar to 2300AD.

<shrugs> But it's not "official printed canon" evidently. :(
file_22.gif


Casey
 
Back
Top