AHL deckplans officially retconned?

[Nathan Brazil]

Then I don't understand their commercial strategy.

By doing so, they risk alienating a part of old die-hards, while the newbees don't care about the name...

I don't work for Mongoose, but I do believe in one of Marc Miller's Traveller assumptions

Everything Is Driven By Economics
Economics is not strictly the study of finance; it is the study of making choices between and among limited possibilities. Regardless of the pronouncements of political, moral, or cultural leaders, action in this universe takes place because it will produce some economic advantage. Economic advantage generally means rewards in a monetary sense, but it can also mean rewards in political or social power. Behind all lies some economic motive. - TRAVELLER 5 Core Rules v5.09 p.20

Everyone votes with their pocketbook. Mr. Sprange caters to the pocketbook. He has an idea "Traveller is like this" and is vindicated with more pocketbooks, perhaps younger pocketbooks, agreeing. If not, he would have to change or sell something besides Traveller, yes?

 

[Spartan159]

All he they had to do was not call this Azhanti High Lightning. They could have named it anything, but no. It would have been better if they had named it something else, then we'd have something new. We already have an AHL, why do we need another?

I'm gonna call that deckplan the Mongoose class cruiser

 

[aramis]

If not, he would have to change or sell something besides Traveller, yes?

He'd still owe Marc a certain chunk for the duration of the license.
Possibly more than he'd lose for producing crap.

 

[mike wightman]

As long as the fans like Mongoose Traveller, there won't be a "problem" for anyone ... except Marc and us grognards. So in a sense it is indeed Mongoose which is re-framing the Traveller brand.

So is Marc ok with Mongoose completely re-writing the OTU while he writes novels that contradict it?
Or vise versa.

 

[DickNervous]

So is Marc ok with Mongoose completely re-writing the OTU while he writes novels that contradict it?
Or vise versa.

But is he really doing that? Granted, the AHL deck plans are different and it would have avoided a lot of angst if they just did something as simple as calling it "Mark II", but that isn't a complete rewrite of the OTU.

I know that HG2 has a lot of new stuff in it for higher tech levels ranging from Anti-Matter power plants (TL20), Thrust 11 M-Drives (TL17), Jump-9 (TL18), and a variety of weapons and shields above TL16. And looking at the Tech Level tables in T5 it seems that what Mongoose has published is pretty much aligned with that. And if I recall, the original LBBs and the Core Rulebooks for MgT1, and T5 were all meant to be "setting agnostic."

Of course, he could go and realy muck things up with the 3I sourcebook, but I guess we will have to wait and see.

 

[aramis]

But is he really doing that? Granted, the AHL deck plans are different and it would have avoided a lot of angst if they just did something as simple as calling it "Mark II", but that isn't a complete rewrite of the OTU.

I know that HG2 has a lot of new stuff in it for higher tech levels ranging from Anti-Matter power plants (TL20), Thrust 11 M-Drives (TL17), Jump-9 (TL18), and a variety of weapons and shields above TL16. And looking at the Tech Level tables in T5 it seems that what Mongoose has published is pretty much aligned with that. And if I recall, the original LBBs and the Core Rulebooks for MgT1, and T5 were all meant to be "setting agnostic."

Of course, he could go and realy muck things up with the 3I sourcebook, but I guess we will have to wait and see.

What I saw in the draft didn't all line up with T5, FWIW.

 

[Nightwind1]

Okay, I finally saw the deckplans...


Whiskey

Tango

Foxtrot


Over?

 

[DickNervous]

What I saw in the draft didn't all line up with T5, FWIW.

I'm not saying they line up perfectly, mainly because what I saw in the T5 book is more generalized, but I don't think it is all that much out of whack as far as the tech levels go.

 

[mike wightman]

'Ion' cannon TL12 - no similar weapon system exists in the OTU or in T5; and once again this weapon system has nothing to do with ions.

Tachyon cannon TL14 - WTF?

Jumpbreaker missile warhead - TL13

All presented in the book as standard components with no contra-indication for the OTU.

Then there are the ridiculous dogfighting rules...

 

[aramis]

I'm starting to see non-grognard blowback on Google Plus and RPGGeek. Especially when it's mentioned that Matthew didn't get the SW license... but made a big deal about hinting at who did get it. Before FFG was even allowed to admit they had.

 

[Swiftbrook]

Okay, I finally saw the deckplans...

Any links to legal previews of the plans for those of us who don't have the book?

 

[whulorigan]

'Ion' cannon TL12 - no similar weapon system exists in the OTU or in T5; and once again this weapon system has nothing to do with ions.

Well, despite the fact that the "Ion" connection seems to be purely Star Wars and not based on a scientific rationale, the "effect" of the Ion Cannon bears somewhat of a resemblance to T5's "Scrambler" series (Electronic/Magnetic/Gravitic), which also did not exist in canon prior to T5.

Tachyon cannon TL14 - WTF?

This is the one that bugs me the most. No explanation, no prior mention, no "science" rationale of any kind whatsoever - just a complete hand-wave effect for "magic" particles, and a hand-wave for special armor that stops them. One of the things that has always characterized the general "flavor" of Traveller (regardless of campaign-setting or ruleset) is that there was always at least some attempt to ground the technology in some type of rudimentary scientific understanding (current or "futuristic"), rather than just pure technobabble.

 

[Nightwind1]

Any links to legal previews of the plans for those of us who don't have the book?

Quite legal:

http://www.mongoosepublishing.com/rpgs/traveller-1/high-guard.html

About half-way down: "2D Deckplans" link

 

[atpollard]

Quite legal:

http://www.mongoosepublishing.com/rpgs/traveller-1/high-guard.html

About half-way down: "2D Deckplans" link

Just FYI, I just downloaded and opened it and found lots of plans, but none labeled AHL (either abbreviated or spelled out).

So if it WAS there, then something happened. :coffeesip:

 

[McPerth]

Just FYI, I just downloaded and opened it and found lots of plans, but none labeled AHL (either abbreviated or spelled out).

So if it WAS there, then something happened. :coffeesip:

Same here

 

[whulorigan]

Just FYI, I just downloaded and opened it and found lots of plans, but none labeled AHL (either abbreviated or spelled out).

So if it WAS there, then something happened. :coffeesip:

It's there; it is simply called "Frontier Cruiser" (w/o class name). The plans in the MgT2-HG PDF call it "Frontier Cruiser [Azhanti Class]" (Although it is called "Azhanti High Lightning" in the accompanying descriptive text).

 

[Reban]

It's there; it is simply called "Frontier Cruiser" (w/o class name). The plans in the MgT2-HG PDF call it "Frontier Cruiser [Azhanti Class]" (Although it is called "Azhanti High Lightning" in the accompanying descriptive text).

They paid someone for that?

I've never liked MgT deckplans, either in 2D or the new 3D.

Recently I've been coming to the conclusion that more 'big ships' should have the original AHL style stacked decks perpendicular to the axis of thrust. Lots of reasons why, among them wouldn't it be easier on the inertial dampers? Compartmentalization is easier. and now I have a new reason from this thread: Elevator conversations

 

[Hyphen]

I know that HG2 has a lot of new stuff in it for higher tech levels ranging from Anti-Matter power plants (TL20), Thrust 11 M-Drives (TL17), Jump-9 (TL18), and a variety of weapons and shields above TL16.

They've increased antimatter, then - MT introduced it at TL 17.

 

[McPerth]

It's there; it is simply called "Frontier Cruiser" (w/o class name). The plans in the MgT2-HG PDF call it "Frontier Cruiser [Azhanti Class]" (Although it is called "Azhanti High Lightning" in the accompanying descriptive text).

I suspected it for a while, but if so it does not respect even the external shape of the Azhanti class.

See that the maps were published (to my kowledge) trice: in the AHL game proper, in the Arrival Vengeance MT suplement and (partially, not all the maps) in the Challenge #42, with the amber zone Ressearch Station Beta, pages 50-51.

Being so (relatively) accesible, would MgT have had any IP issue to reproduce them if they'd chosen to keep the AHL as they have always been?

 

[atpollard]

It's there; it is simply called "Frontier Cruiser" (w/o class name). The plans in the MgT2-HG PDF call it "Frontier Cruiser [Azhanti Class]" (Although it is called "Azhanti High Lightning" in the accompanying descriptive text).

Thank you for the clarification. I was probably not the only one to wonder.