All in the family
- Thread starter jhulse
- Start date
I dug up my copy of that module. The King Richard's 'normal' stateroom is 6 meters by 12 meters, with a toilet of 3m by 3m, according to the ship diagrams. It has 8 'luxury' staterooms, of indeterminate size for the 'very wealthy'/VIP's stuck in odd shaped places, that look to be at least twice as large at least.
There is also mention of laundry rooms on some decks, that look to be large, and they are at the back of the decks, near the equipment stuff, and crew showers on their quarters decks. In the room descriptions, each room has 'modern personal conveniences, including ultrasonic showers', so that may do away with water consumption, and thus even a stall or tub, maybe? Yet , the diagrams show sinks by the commodes ...
'Sleeping areas are large and comfortable, and have variable gravity settings from 0g to 2g for the hardy'. Variable gravity would make a good feature in a bed, eh?
Fritz_Brown
Super Moderator
The 'normal' stateroom is 6x12 METERS?! My master bedroom (including bath) isn't that big! And 3x3 meter bathrooms? Hope they are stacking at least 3 bunks in that area, besides the head equipment. You could knock out one wall between staterooms, and have a gravball court!
Well, the specs are:
Crew: 182
Saterooms: 188
Passengers: 300
Most of the crew is triple bunked, with seperate communal showers and lounges, etc. Their state rooms are barely smaller than the regular passengers are.
High Guard stats:
RN-E421273-000000-00000-0 2,200 MCr 5000 tons
Low berths 18 Cargo 220
Shuttles 2 Fuel 1100
Staterooms 188 Agility- 1
2 model/7 computers EP 100
Regular stateroom CR 50,000, with 1,000 in Casino chips, for 1 jump, or 9 days stay. The large staterooms go for 150,000 to 300,000. LOL
Crew: 182
Saterooms: 188
Passengers: 300
Most of the crew is triple bunked, with seperate communal showers and lounges, etc. Their state rooms are barely smaller than the regular passengers are.
High Guard stats:
RN-E421273-000000-00000-0 2,200 MCr 5000 tons
Low berths 18 Cargo 220
Shuttles 2 Fuel 1100
Staterooms 188 Agility- 1
2 model/7 computers EP 100
Regular stateroom CR 50,000, with 1,000 in Casino chips, for 1 jump, or 9 days stay. The large staterooms go for 150,000 to 300,000. LOL
RandyT0001
SOC-13
Sounds like the designer of the King Richard just decided what would be in the ship without any regard for the rules. Specifically the rules about crew quarters on commercial vessels and the rules about the number of passengers permitted per stateroom, maximum of two. Given (for example, I don't have the KR myself) 62 staterooms for the crew leaves 126 for the passengers which means each passenger stateroom has an average of 2.38 passengers in it. It's a broke design. I am really amazed how poorly it was done after reading tidbits about it on the net. How long would it have taken to properly design the ship when it was published, a couple or three hours, max? I'm suprised FASA survived in the gaming market with such poor quality control.
far-trader
SOC-14 10K
Which is what it says in the stats, but my count of the deckplans and text says it's actually 244 "staterooms" and 9 suites (8 for special passengers and 1 for the Captain).
Of course that's 40 "staterooms" too many presuming the passenger staterooms are all sold double occupancy which would support the model that they are double size and cost so much. A nice coincidence (?) the Pool Deck has exactly 40 passenger "staterooms" and the deckplans don't show nearly enough fuel, even allowing the "fuel tanks" are double height. The shown "fuel tanks" are about right for the 100tons of power plant fuel. That leaves some 1000tons of jump fuel not really shown. Making the Pool Deck a triple height deck and filling in the "stateroom" area as fuel is about right. I mean for the pools too. Come on, 3m of deck height for a pool? A wading pool maybe, but you need at least 2 decks height for a lap pool and 3 if you want a low diving board. But it does change the profile a bit.
Yep, the triple occupancy of double sized staterooms is not too bad, pretty comfortable in fact. Roomier than the required half-stateroom minimum for regular crew. And the officers are double occupancy in double sized staterooms which is the standard. I don't think the design is all that broken (except the pool deck and jump fuel I fixed for my own use). In fact using the basic numbers you'll come up with a lot of "extra" tonnage for the luxury features, like the pools.
I didn't have time to read through the whole thing yet, i.e. count the rooms manually, but another anomaly is the side of the plans with the staerooms and side view show 9 levels, one of which is a double height level, on the bottom, but only 8 plans are shown on the flip side, with the pool deck and the dull deck not matching according to scale with the side views, both sides supposedly using the same scale. Also, the elevators on the dull deck don't line up with any other deck's elevators. In fact, most of the elevators don't line up. And, where do those elevators near the shuttle bays go??? Outside maintenance access? Anyway, I guess the bottom double height level works as the pool level.
far-trader
SOC-14 10K
Yep you're right the elevators don't quite line up through some of the levels. Um, elevators near the shuttles? Hmm, I wonder if you might be confused by the key, it has a small error. The asterisk (*) are actually the Lifeboat stations and the circles (o) are the lifts. The key has them mixed up.
The ninth deck, the double one on the profile view, is the engine deck show on the bottom of the deckplan page. It's rather boring, black with some corridors and the four fuel tanks.
I've been inspired by the ressurection of this noble ship as a topic to again play around with my fixing the deckplans. Due to copyright issues I probably can't share, except perhaps as a variant. We'll see how long I can task to it and maybe put them up. Maybe I should do a quick and dirty plain version just for feedback. I am tempted to use it as an entry for the little contest here on CotI though so we'll see
Yeah, I'm a tease
The ninth deck, the double one on the profile view, is the engine deck show on the bottom of the deckplan page. It's rather boring, black with some corridors and the four fuel tanks.
I've been inspired by the ressurection of this noble ship as a topic to again play around with my fixing the deckplans. Due to copyright issues I probably can't share, except perhaps as a variant. We'll see how long I can task to it and maybe put them up. Maybe I should do a quick and dirty plain version just for feedback. I am tempted to use it as an entry for the little contest here on CotI though so we'll see
Yeah, I'm a tease
Hey, that's right! I never noticed that. I thought those circles were air vent tubes, for some reason.LOL
I bought the book just to have it, read through it a couple of times, and then shelved it, in case I ever got characters who could afford to take a luxury cruise, which never happened in any of my games.
A plain version suits me fine;I'd like to see a remake of the plans. It was a very cool ship design for it's time; quite a break from all the scouts, merchants, and military ships. I also have an old Dragon MAgazine with the Exodonia StarPort article in it, also very cool at the time, compared to the usual starport maps of the day.
I bought the book just to have it, read through it a couple of times, and then shelved it, in case I ever got characters who could afford to take a luxury cruise, which never happened in any of my games.
A plain version suits me fine;I'd like to see a remake of the plans. It was a very cool ship design for it's time; quite a break from all the scouts, merchants, and military ships. I also have an old Dragon MAgazine with the Exodonia StarPort article in it, also very cool at the time, compared to the usual starport maps of the day.
far-trader
SOC-14 10K
Hmm, my whole stateroom thinking above needs another look. Now that I've checked the scale a little closer the crew staterooms are not full double size, more 1.5x, which does still go good with triple occupancy but changes stuff a lot. The passengers staterooms are full double though, so that's good. Too late tonight to look deeper
I always tend to think of a "typical" hotel room when I think of staterooms, and they are always much larger than a "typical" stateroom. I used to work as a hotel architect for several years, so I still know the basic dimensions.
Holiday Inn express 12'-8" x 22'-0"
Sleep Inn 12'-0" x 18'-8"
Some rooms will be larger or smaller, but those are the basics. If you transfer a "typical" sized stateroom (six squares) in "English", you will have roughly a room that is 10'-0" x 15'-0", including the fresher. This has always seemed a bit cramped for me, especially when you have to stay there for a whole week. Can anyone imagine having to live in a hotel for a week? You can't go outside, no pool or patio, and you can only stay either in your room or in the lobby... I would be crawling at the walls by the time I got out of jump space! Be that as it may though, those are the rules and I always take them as the MINIMUM standards. I personally think that high class passengers should need and expect to have more spacious staterooms than the standard passenger. Since a portion, up to 50% in some rule systems, are taken up as common space, I could see luxury liners having up to 8 or 10 tons per stateroom. Not that the actual rooms would be larger, but that it would include more space for passenger lunges, jogging tracks, climbing walls.... anything you can do on a modern cruise liner today needs to happen inside the hull. That takes a lot more room than (4 tons per passenger)...
Back to work now.... :-(
Holiday Inn express 12'-8" x 22'-0"
Sleep Inn 12'-0" x 18'-8"
Some rooms will be larger or smaller, but those are the basics. If you transfer a "typical" sized stateroom (six squares) in "English", you will have roughly a room that is 10'-0" x 15'-0", including the fresher. This has always seemed a bit cramped for me, especially when you have to stay there for a whole week. Can anyone imagine having to live in a hotel for a week? You can't go outside, no pool or patio, and you can only stay either in your room or in the lobby... I would be crawling at the walls by the time I got out of jump space! Be that as it may though, those are the rules and I always take them as the MINIMUM standards. I personally think that high class passengers should need and expect to have more spacious staterooms than the standard passenger. Since a portion, up to 50% in some rule systems, are taken up as common space, I could see luxury liners having up to 8 or 10 tons per stateroom. Not that the actual rooms would be larger, but that it would include more space for passenger lunges, jogging tracks, climbing walls.... anything you can do on a modern cruise liner today needs to happen inside the hull. That takes a lot more room than (4 tons per passenger)...
Back to work now.... :-(
I agree about going 'stir crazy' if stuck in a 10' x 15' room for a week. This has always been a bit of an issue to me. Sure, you can have holographic consoles etc, but after a few days that would get pretty boring for most people. On a cruise shop there would be other things to to do, as on the King Richard, but what about those passengers booked on standard freight ships? There's not a lot to do there and the cabins are certain to be small and cramped.
In the real world taking passage on a cargo ship can give you a LOT more space than on a cruise ship. Here's an example I found in a quick search.
Cargo Ship Passage
240 square feet is about 15x15. Bigger than a stateroom.
In the real world taking passage on a cargo ship can give you a LOT more space than on a cruise ship. Here's an example I found in a quick search.
Cargo Ship Passage
240 square feet is about 15x15. Bigger than a stateroom.
Fritz_Brown
Super Moderator
Yeah, but volume is not an issue in a hotel. It IS in a space/starship. So, looking at ships (wet) is probably more realistic than comparing to hotels. Especially when you consider the hotel is not a form of travel - it a place to live for a week, while you do other things.
One thing about going stir-crazy: the popularity of the "smoke deck" on naval ships. You are no longer allowed to smoke inside US naval vessels - secondhand smoke in a government workspace, and all that. So, there is a sponson (an outside space that is not on the deck) designated for smoking (and, often one for enlisted, another for CPOs, and another for officers). There are an amazing number of people who don't smoke who spend time on the smoke deck, as it is (often) the only location where you can venture outside after dark. Even when you can't see the horizon, there is an innate need to get "outside". I don't know HOW the sub guys do it.
One thing about going stir-crazy: the popularity of the "smoke deck" on naval ships. You are no longer allowed to smoke inside US naval vessels - secondhand smoke in a government workspace, and all that. So, there is a sponson (an outside space that is not on the deck) designated for smoking (and, often one for enlisted, another for CPOs, and another for officers). There are an amazing number of people who don't smoke who spend time on the smoke deck, as it is (often) the only location where you can venture outside after dark. Even when you can't see the horizon, there is an innate need to get "outside". I don't know HOW the sub guys do it.
people did it and do it all the time. sub crews, prisoners, astronauts, ancient sailors, snowed-in peasants. I was on a carrier and I would routinely go two to three weeks, sometimes a month or two, never going topside. TV, focusing on the job, and a sense of perspective all help.
Fritz_Brown
Super Moderator
flykiller, if you could go a month without going topside, that explains a lot......
(We would actually take a route from the mess decks, through the hangar bay, back up to our workspaces, for dinner. It would often allow for a nice pause for sunset out one of the elevator openings.)
(We would actually take a route from the mess decks, through the hangar bay, back up to our workspaces, for dinner. It would often allow for a nice pause for sunset out one of the elevator openings.)
spare-dale.Originally posted by Fritz88:
flykiller, if you could go a month without going topside, that explains a lot......
(We would actually take a route from the mess decks, through the hangar bay, back up to our workspaces, for dinner. It would often allow for a nice pause for sunset out one of the elevator openings.)
well, once in a while I would stand on the fantail and just watch the water, the wake trailing away out of sight.
people did it and do it all the time. sub crews, prisoners, astronauts, ancient sailors, snowed-in peasants. I was on a carrier and I would routinely go two to three weeks, sometimes a month or two, never going topside. TV, focusing on the job, and a sense of perspective all help. </font>[/QUOTE]But would you spend $10,000 a week to do it?
As an afterthought, with advanced automation, even as crew you might get bored. For example the crew in the movie 'Dark Star'.
Chuck Anumia
SOC-14 1K
Then there are those who who play vidio games (even compationons) without taking a break except to sleep, eat or use the fresher the entire journey.
