Any Time Travel in Traveller?

[mike wightman]

No TARDIS, but there are artificial gravity, acceleration compensators, reactionless maneuver drives, jump drives, vehicle sized nuclear fusion power plants, nuclear dampers, meson guns, meson screen...

not very hard sci fi really

 

[Shonner]

What classifies as hard sci-fi?

 

[mike wightman]

A rough rule of thumb is only one magic technology.

Compare T2300 with CT. T2300 is a much harder sci-fi setting since it only has one magic technology, the stutter warp. CT has all the ones listed in my previous post which almost moves it into the science fantasy bracket IMHO. I hesitate to do so because CT didn't go with daft sci-fi weapons and uses vector movement for ship combat.

 

[sabredog]

No TARDIS, but there are artificial gravity, acceleration compensators, reactionless maneuver drives, jump drives, vehicle sized nuclear fusion power plants, nuclear dampers, meson guns, meson screen...

not very hard sci fi really

Maybe, maybe not. At least the majority of those things are consistent and reasonable. A time machine? Not so much. It is like that "Ancients did/built it" shuck - useful as a one-off when you want to do something off the wall and totally crazy without having to explain it maybe, but not as an integral part of rules that at least try to stay realistic and grounded in science.

Although my mind is open to a psi-special ability that might work that way. It would be very Zelazny.

And I suppose those other technologies also have their problems and time travel could work if you had unlimited power available (like maybe a sun set off by one of those star-trigger widgets the Darrians use in the OTU) .....oh jeez, it's too late at night for this. To paraphrase a recent flick, I need a case of straws, hours of diagrams, maths, .........

 

[sabredog]

A rough rule of thumb is only one magic technology.

Compare T2300 with CT. T2300 is a much harder sci-fi setting since it only has one magic technology, the stutter warp. CT has all the ones listed in my previous post which almost moves it into the science fantasy bracket IMHO. I hesitate to do so because CT didn't go with daft sci-fi weapons and uses vector movement for ship combat.

I think you can have more than one magic tech - it just depends on how advanced your tech is. But, it should still be logically consistent across the board. "Theoretically possible" counts, too.

I wouldn't say that CT is as hard as something written by Clarke, but it is harder than Star Trek. HG may have tipped the balance a bit, as did Mercenary (FGMP's...what more can I say?)...but not so much as to turn it into science fantasy. Space opera, but still not Star Wars.

 

[nDervish]

So much for hard scifi in Traveller. Do they have plans for a TARDIS in there, too?

Also keep in mind that the MgT "Book N:..." line is, at least nominally, multi-setting. Just because Mongoose put time travel into Book 4: Psion doesn't mean that it's intended to be used in games set in (anything even vaguely resembling) the OTU. It could just be there for use in their Judge Dredd game, which uses the same core ruleset.

Personally, I like this approach because I've always viewed Traveller as a toolkit for creating your own settings, but I can definitely see how it would be problematic for those who associate Traveller strongly with the OTU setting.

If you really want to go crazy about non-OTU-compatible material in a Mongoose book, try checking out their Supplement 9: Campaign Guide... It's pretty much unadulterated (and unedited) space opera stew with little obvious awareness of Traveller (aside from the occasional references to OTU alien races), packed full of computers spontaneously becoming sapient, giant space monsters with godlike powers, and zombies.

 

[Shonner]

I gave Psion a look. Some really cool stuff in there. The book mentions that it can be used as a sourcebook for psionic powers in other games. The Traveller core rulebook is not needed if you are not playing Traveller (some pages from the core rulebook are reprinted in Psion to make the book a standalone).

The Psion book mentions not to use some of the content that is not in the Traveller Universe, unless the ref allows it in his/her own Traveller setting.

I love the Campaign Guide. It is totally not for the Traveller Universe. Because it is for everything else sci-fi. That book might be why Prime Directive got a nod to use Traveller's rules. Prime Directive and the Campaign Guide would go perfect together.

 

[aramis]

A rough rule of thumb is only one magic technology.

Compare T2300 with CT. T2300 is a much harder sci-fi setting since it only has one magic technology, the stutter warp. CT has all the ones listed in my previous post which almost moves it into the science fantasy bracket IMHO. I hesitate to do so because CT didn't go with daft sci-fi weapons and uses vector movement for ship combat.

you forgot the practical, safe, high output vehicular fusion power. Despite fusion being as yet below breakeven except in runaway mode, it is often ignored in "magic technology."

 

[mike wightman]

I didn't mention magic heat sinks either

 

[Hyphen]

I always assumed that the GURPS Traveller timeline was created as a result of some PC's getting hold of time travel, then going back and warning Strephon...

...and YES, that's a scenario idea I've had for 20 years now...

So much for hard scifi in Traveller. Do they have plans for a TARDIS in there, too?

Don't know, but trendi (tavonni research, engineering & design, inc.) can certainly sell you a K9...
http://members.tip.net.au/~davidjw/tavspecs/rit/k9.htm

 

[sabredog]

AAAAAHHHHHHH!!!!! OK, OK, I give already! Traveller ain't that hard! And it's not that hard on even the Mohs Scale of SciFi Hardness: http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/MohsScaleOfScienceFictionHardness



...but I will still put it between 'soft' and 'hard' because it doesn't have transporters. Yet.

 

[far-trader]

...but I will still put it between 'soft' and 'hard' because it doesn't have transporters. Yet.

heh :devil:

CT LBB3 copyright 1981 (not sure it's in the 1977 printing or not):

Page 15 (tech level chart):

Tech Level 16 - Transportation - matter transport (aka transporters )

I seem to recall MegaTrav breaking that down a little more, with basic matter transport at TL16 and no safe people transporters until TL... 18?

 

[sabredog]

heh :devil:

CT LBB3 copyright 1981 (not sure it's in the 1977 printing or not):

Page 15 (tech level chart):

Tech Level 16 - Transportation - matter transport (aka transporters )

I seem to recall MegaTrav breaking that down a little more, with basic matter transport at TL16 and no safe people transporters until TL... 18?

NOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!

Still....at TL 16 (TL17 in the 1971 ed.) they are safely over the horizon in the OTU. And nowhere to be seen IMTU. Not that it keeps players from always asking for them.

 

[Cryton]

I always assumed that the GURPS Traveller timeline was created as a result of some PC's getting hold of time travel, then going back and warning Strephon...

...and YES, that's a scenario idea I've had for 20 years now...

Ran that one ages ago, but rather than warning Strephon (they figured he would assume they were madmen), they killed Dulinor with a surface to air missile as he was on approach to the Imperial palace. We were shocked when the same thing turned up in GURPS.

Guess great minds stink like.

 

[Dragoner]

Transporters could be hard, look at the experiments with quantum entanglement.

Though thing the english language writhes in pain at the use of the term magic, which presupposes a supernatural power; iirc "magic-tech" is from D&D.

Hard or hardish, trav is ok.

 

[mike wightman]

NOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!

Still....at TL 16 (TL17 in the 1971 ed.) they are safely over the horizon in the OTU. And nowhere to be seen IMTU. Not that it keeps players from always asking for them.

Ever see what DGP did to the TLs of the Imperial core worlds in MT?

TL16 was becoming the normal TL for a developed world...

Fast forward to the Regency setting for TNE and you have a TL16 fleet and tech base.

So very much part of the OTU

 

[Shonner]

The tech G stuff I presented as ancient ruins, with no way to repair. Even tech F was kind of over the top. I limited that as well.

 

[sabredog]

Ever see what DGP did to the TLs of the Imperial core worlds in MT?

TL16 was becoming the normal TL for a developed world...

Fast forward to the Regency setting for TNE and you have a TL16 fleet and tech base.

So very much part of the OTU

TL15 has for so long seemed a hard wall to get through for developing tech, though the creep (like in A.I.) was always there.

I stay very comfortably in my personal non-OTU, and it's average is TL12-13 with the core worlds at 15. TL16+ is a magic land that is what everyone wants to have but can't: disintigrators, teleporters, warp drives, anti-matter drives, personal shields, nova bombs, and anything made by and left behind by visiting all-knowing alien masters.

It might be nice for some to run a game that has such high TL's but personally, I like the grit of the lower levels and keep the higher TL stuff out for the most part except as something for the players to yearn for when they went to those few places that had it.

 

[SanDragon]

I always assumed that the GURPS Traveller timeline was created as a result of some PC's getting hold of time travel, then going back and warning Strephon...

...and YES, that's a scenario idea I've had for 20 years now...

Don't know, but trendi (tavonni research, engineering & design, inc.) can certainly sell you a K9...
http://members.tip.net.au/~davidjw/tavspecs/rit/k9.htm

My Droyne isn't crawling into that!

 

[MCEvans]

heh :devil:

CT LBB3 copyright 1981 (not sure it's in the 1977 printing or not):

Page 15 (tech level chart):

Tech Level 16 - Transportation - matter transport (aka transporters )

I seem to recall MegaTrav breaking that down a little more, with basic matter transport at TL16 and no safe people transporters until TL... 18?

Don't forget Paranoia Press Merchants & Merchandise pg 22 gives you 6 different transporters from TL 16 to TL 18 with capacity and cost. Even added a new skill Transporter Specialist (Operations) :devil: