Building the port.

[Jame]

Suddenly I'm reminded of a WEG d6 supplement called "Platt's Starport Guide." It has several lines to describe the quality of the port, traffic and things like that. If you want, I'll get it and post it, though there may be copyright issues...

 

[mad13142000]

Originally posted by far-trader:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by MADDog:

If I'm A666345-9...

Well contrary to popular mythology size does matter

In your first example above you'd have a primary type A port, and possibly a secondary and up to 3 tertiary ports </font>[/QUOTE]Precisely my point. I don't have a problem with a Lo pop world HAVING a class A port, but by my UPP there couldn't be more than 900 people on planet - about the number needed for ONE starport, much less a secondary and up to 3 tertiary ports! If a planet is in a main, but doesn't offer anything else as a planet, then the Class A Port is like a truckstop - some of the best in this country are in towns less than 1000 people... They offer full amenities, but don't deal in a lot of actual cargo loading/unloading...I can get my ship fixed, fueled, some r&r for current crew, get a new crew member, everything BUT get a lot of cargo...Similarly, a planet with a crappy port can still offer a LOT of cargo (ie - cargo handling capability) but not offer any of the stuff that makes an A not a C...

So, I'm lobbying for # of ports tied to pop, the amount of trade handling tied to a combination of pop and class, and the level of starport 'stuff' tied to TL and maybe class...

my .02Cr
-MADDog

 

[far-trader]

Originally posted by MADDog:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by far-trader:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by MADDog:

If I'm A666345-9...

Well contrary to popular mythology size does matter

In your first example above you'd have a primary type A port, and possibly a secondary and up to 3 tertiary ports </font>[/QUOTE]Precisely my point. I don't have a problem with a Lo pop world HAVING a class A port, but by my UPP there couldn't be more than 900 people on planet - about the number needed for ONE starport, much less a secondary and up to 3 tertiary ports! If a planet is in a main, but doesn't offer anything else as a planet, then the Class A Port is like a truckstop - some of the best in this country are in towns less than 1000 people... They offer full amenities, but don't deal in a lot of actual cargo loading/unloading...I can get my ship fixed, fueled, some r&r for current crew, get a new crew member, everything BUT get a lot of cargo...Similarly, a planet with a crappy port can still offer a LOT of cargo (ie - cargo handling capability) but not offer any of the stuff that makes an A not a C...

So, I'm lobbying for # of ports tied to pop, the amount of trade handling tied to a combination of pop and class, and the level of starport 'stuff' tied to TL and maybe class...

my .02Cr
-MADDog </font>[/QUOTE]I think we're on the same page, or at least in the same chapter, just getting there by different means. I relate size to Pop and such but the actual number of ports is seperate with varing types, while I think you have both interdependant. What I mean is you would see a low Pop etc. system have a single port of the listed level and a hi Pop etc. system have several ports of the listed level, right?

I like the truck-stop analogy, in my system its just a matter of how many truck-stops this planet has. For the example its one full service station, probably a secondary station with fewer amenities and capacity, and possibly some tertiary stations. Note that the class E (if present) is really just a final emergency backup to the others. A simple beacon transponder and comms and sensors to keep traffic from crashing or getting lost. The secondary and tertiary are all just there for overflow and backup in case of emergency. I don't go much for the multiple compeating ports model. There's the ISA port and possible military base ports. That's all I'd say the UPP refers to. In the game (IMTU anyway) its (the UPP) just a quick reference provided by the TAS anyway, and woe to the PC's who think it tells them all they need to know before landing.

Discussion is all good, more inspiration for the Officers, and like you its just my Cr.02 too.

 

[Liam Devlin]

Good discussion- the low pop world gas station concept! Like it.<nods at Far Trader & Maddog>.

I'd say definitely Population plays a factor in number of ports <referring to regina example plop101 sent me>..Three A's: one Navy Hi & Down/ one Scout Hi & Down, One ISA Hi & Down...we're getting good feedback here..I think we're cooking the right stew!

 

[Antares Administration]

Here's another wrench - TL. The same lo pop world at TL E (let's say) could automate most of its mundane mechanical activities, and severely reduce the staffing requirement, i.e. more bang for the buck.

If steal my earlier post from this thread:

For example, you could have an NI world with a low population and a very high natural resources number. Production would probably be distributed, so you'd have a significant number of Class D or E spaceports to handle cargo. Pop wouldn't be the "only" contributing factor.

If you highly automate those ports, you might even be able to improve the class (at some expense, mind you) without committing additional human resources.

Imagine that your truck stops now have automated approach and landing control, robotic servicing, and probably a significant amount of remote control. Instead of one larger truck stop, you can afford (in human terms) a truck stop in every hick town.

Paul Nemeth
AA

 

[Liam Devlin]

Paul, I refer you to the possibility of robots earlier in this thread:
__________________________________________________
"Now technology adds a wee spice to it- robotics. Most semi-independent-full independent robotic help works on batteries running 72-96hrs (TL-C+)..doing the work of (lets be maxxed here- 12hr work days) 6-8 sophonts. [if using eight hour wk. days this increases exponentially!]"
__________________________________________________

- the stickler on this being that TL-C + robots would have to be used to compensate for lack of Living employees. say 8 to 1 ratio<Using the 12 hr workday>. Or 12 to 1 if using the 8hr work model..
So a Port like..(one I've seen in Gushemege & Dagudashaag Sectors) C000010-C Ni 611 Im <stellar data>..
8 people there, 64 (8-1) robots minimum, 96 (12-1) in this system- a mere automatic refuelling (space gas)station in an asteroid system along a trade route.

Cost for services of the human employees will be higher than use of robotic services- supply & demand n all that..
Good idea..Hmmm< ruminates on this a wee more>

 

[trader jim]

The original Tital of this thread is "buildong the Port", question< WHO is going to build the port?...we need construction Companys!! and lots of em, whose gonnae house em, feed em ect ect, adventure seed!! had to throw this out there!!!

 

[Antares Administration]

Originally posted by Shane Mclean:
A high pop world is likely to have a bigger downport to facilitiate the tarde coing to and from world, whereas the low pop port on a trade main would have a bigger highport to make for quicker onward shipping.

...

*= Port tonnage depends upon the pop level of the planet, position on a main or cluster, etc, and can represent trade passing through and in/out. Give the GM advice or a quick points system to determine which level of trade it is. More on this later when I have ideas.

Shane

Hi, Shane. I agree with your point, and I'd like to make a suggestion based upon my posting in Universal Starship Facilities Profile.
......................................
Mythmere Shane and Liam, some of the prep we're doing for ITB indicated that we're going to have to integrate what we're doing with this factor. I'd appreciate if you could keep us in the loop on what you're considering.

So far, we're looking at asking that World Trade Balance and a new factor called Planetary Economy, we may be able to use Pop instead, be included in the Sector Data Tables starting with Gateway. That would give players the World's baseline economic data. Starport commercial traffic ought to tie in with that.

A point for discussion - WTB is planetary natural resources - Population, and represents the planets net exports. Therefore:

1. The primary starport of the planet should have a Traffic value >= the Absolute Value (WTB). Stated otherwise, Min Traffic = Absolute Value (WTB). For example, Starfall has a WTB of +7 (it's a strong net exporter). Therefore, Min Traffic should equal 7.

2. Traffic = Imports + Exports + Transient , where all terms are represented as positive numbers. Right now, for the sake of simplicity, we're looking at representing transient (background) trade with a single value for each subsector. Let's call it TT. WTB and TT both use the Pop convention where the factor represents a power of 10. The maximum size of Traffic for any port should the greater of 2xWTB or TT. But with powers of 10, 2xWTB will never be more than one factor higher, and the formula becomes WTB+1. Therefore, Traffic = the greater of WTB +1 or TT. Now, if the background TT for Williamsburg/Glimmerdrift Reaches is +3, and Starfall's WTB is +7, you should ignore the TT, and the maximum Traffic rating for Starfall should be 8.

This way, we've derived a range that a starport's traffic value must fit. Starfall traffic must be between 7 and 8.

Rather than over specify the solution at this point, we could just say:

Traffic must be > WTB, and < the greater of WTB +1 or TT, and let the GM decide the actual value of Traffic.
.....................................

So if Starfall is Traffic 8, WTB +7, and TT 3, and it has one highport, Tripartite Highport, and two downports, Tripartite Downport and First Landing, let's consider this scenario:

a. All the TT goes through the Highport,

b. The two downports handle 50% of the domestic traffic, and the Highport handles the rest, and

c. For the two downports, the split between TDP and FL is 99/1.

Remember that we're working in powers of 10. Therefore:

Tripartite Highport Traffic = 10^8/2+10^3=10^7
Therefore THP Traffic Value is 7.

Tripartite Downport Traffic = .99 x 10^8/2=10^7
Therefore TDP Traffic Value is 7.

First Landing Traffic = .01 x 10^8/2=10^5
Therefore FL Traffic Value is 5.

The Tripartite Ports are new and modern, and therefore working at close to capacity. So each of those ports should be around factor 7 size.

First Landing is a special case as those who are involved understand, so I won't go any further with it here, except to say that the traffic at FL's starport is factor 5 in volume.

Would that work?

Paul Nemeth
AA