Commerce Raiders
- Thread starter marginaleye
- Start date
Richard Saunders
SOC-12
Hello.
If all and i do mean ALL energy that impacts on a black globe is funneled to the capacitors then any signal (radio, meson, laser, solar etc) can be detected and interpreted, ie - radio would be received as am or fm at specific frequencies these could be linked of and sent to the coms shack, the same with laser and mesons.
All you would need would be a band pass filter in the circuit and a zena diode (the zena is for the spikes when the enemy fires a high energy weapon at you), this would also allow you to use the enemys active sensors to lock on and ready weapons to fire before dropping the globe.
Does a black globe absorbe inertial energy (if so why does the ship keep moving and if not why dont unpowered (inert) missiles go through.
As for using black globes on raiders and putting the crew into low berths, the ship with the globe active will pick up a coating of dust and ice on the front of it (solar wind and ramming dust while moving under inertia, yes not much but it will give a sensor echo, bigger than the ships size.
Just some thoughts feel free to yell wingge bitch and complain if you want, or you can always agree.
Bye.
OH give me a black globe and a nice budget and about three months and i could probably work the sensors out.
Bugger there are no imoticons in the short form
Bugger bugger yes there are.
If all and i do mean ALL energy that impacts on a black globe is funneled to the capacitors then any signal (radio, meson, laser, solar etc) can be detected and interpreted, ie - radio would be received as am or fm at specific frequencies these could be linked of and sent to the coms shack, the same with laser and mesons.
All you would need would be a band pass filter in the circuit and a zena diode (the zena is for the spikes when the enemy fires a high energy weapon at you), this would also allow you to use the enemys active sensors to lock on and ready weapons to fire before dropping the globe.
Does a black globe absorbe inertial energy (if so why does the ship keep moving and if not why dont unpowered (inert) missiles go through.
As for using black globes on raiders and putting the crew into low berths, the ship with the globe active will pick up a coating of dust and ice on the front of it (solar wind and ramming dust while moving under inertia, yes not much but it will give a sensor echo, bigger than the ships size.
Just some thoughts feel free to yell wingge bitch and complain if you want, or you can always agree.
Bye.
OH give me a black globe and a nice budget and about three months and i could probably work the sensors out.
Bugger there are no imoticons in the short form
Bugger bugger yes there are.
Well, the sensitivity may be poor.
Another issue with black globes is that they can actually be overloaded by sunlight relatively quickly. The black globe on a Kinunir absorbs around 7 megawatts constantly from sunlight, which will overload HG design in a few hundred hours, and will overload a FF&S design in hours.
Richard Saunders
SOC-12
Well, the sensitivity may be poor.
Another issue with black globes is that they can actually be overloaded by sunlight relatively quickly. The black globe on a Kinunir absorbs around 7 megawatts constantly from sunlight, which will overload HG design in a few hundred hours, and will overload a FF&S design in hours. </font>[/QUOTE]Hello.
Yes it may be faint but if you could detect it without the globe you should be able to still detect it.
If it takes 10% of a ships tonnage to jump then the jump drive would seem to me to be a great energy sink, yes i know the argument has been flogged to death (whether jump capacitors exist or not).
I assume there is no canon law about whether a ship can jump while englobed or not????????.
Bye.
mike wightman
SOC-14 10K
Hi Lionel,
I think there may be a canon reference to globed ships jumping, but I'll have to dig it out later.
I think there may be a canon reference to globed ships jumping, but I'll have to dig it out later.
notagoodusername
SOC-13
To save you the hassle Sigg, GURPS: Traveller Starships page 105. "Instead of flickering, any black globe may be turned completely on. No enemy fire will affect it, but the ship may not fire or maneuver (though it may still jump)."
Hope that helps Lionel.
Shane
Hope that helps Lionel.
Shane
The Oz
SOC-14 1K
High Guard also refers to ships absorbing enough energy in their black globes to power a jump, and thus implies that you can go into jump with the globe on. Note that HG specifically says that even if the BG was used to power the jump, the ship still needs the jump fuel (doesn't say why, though).
HG also refers to a squadron of BG-equipped ships jumping into a system with their BGs on and a predetermined velocity. So it's possible to come out of jump with BGs on.
HG also refers to a squadron of BG-equipped ships jumping into a system with their BGs on and a predetermined velocity. So it's possible to come out of jump with BGs on.
mike wightman
SOC-14 10K
Thanks Shane and Oz, it was the HG one I remembered but couldn't quote.
There is also mention of jumping while globed in Traveller's Digest 11, Project Blackheart.
There is also mention of jumping while globed in Traveller's Digest 11, Project Blackheart.
Jump Space and Globes:
Jumping while globed certainly changes the concept. Now the questions are...does the jump point form outside or inside the globe? And why is the energy not absorbed?
When they're leaving jump space they can turn on the globe inside the microuniverse. That's not a problem even if it were a simultaneous change. But if ship energy is being utilized to keep the microuniverse stable that energy would be focused into globe...
Communications:
to identify the signal. This will be impacted by the techlevel of the ship's communications equipment and globe.
If its a 100AUs from the star it would be different. Shame we don't have a decent absorbtion scale. Assuming that background radiation, solar wings, sunlight, communications chatter all enter the globe and on into the into the capacitors.
Savage
Jumping while globed certainly changes the concept. Now the questions are...does the jump point form outside or inside the globe? And why is the energy not absorbed?
When they're leaving jump space they can turn on the globe inside the microuniverse. That's not a problem even if it were a simultaneous change. But if ship energy is being utilized to keep the microuniverse stable that energy would be focused into globe...
Communications:
Or it could be distorted. This might totally depend on the energies being absorbed at the time of the communications. The more energy from other sources, the tougher it is
to identify the signal. This will be impacted by the techlevel of the ship's communications equipment and globe.
Wouldn't this depend on the location of the ship.
If its a 100AUs from the star it would be different. Shame we don't have a decent absorbtion scale. Assuming that background radiation, solar wings, sunlight, communications chatter all enter the globe and on into the into the capacitors.
Savage
Not necessarily. First of all, you have a multi-megawatt background noise, which means low power sources are hard to detect. Secondly, the black globe mechanism could easily spread out signals, which would pretty much eliminate the ability to detect any signal which wasn't a substantial fraction of the total incoming energy, and would also severely limit data transfer rate.
Just a side note with using the WWII analogy for commerce raiders. First of all the Germans had three types of raiders: purpose built warships (like the Graf Spee), u-boats, and armed merchant men.
Everyone knows about the first two, but, their armed merchant ships accounted for thousands of tons of allied shipping and I believe there were only five of them ever completed and released into the seas. They had the double effect of tying up naval assets hunting for them and being "sneaky" enough to do serious damage.
In my mind a similiar ship would very effective in Traveller. Base it on one of the standard design frames, but boost the performance by cutting down on cargo space. Admittedly, it could not damage large convoys, but part of the effectiveness of commerce raiders is that merchant ships are forced to convoy together with large escorts which again reduces trade and sucks ships away from the front lines. And, of course, it you've got lots of guts, join up with a convoy and attack it from the inside during the jump sequence.
Everyone knows about the first two, but, their armed merchant ships accounted for thousands of tons of allied shipping and I believe there were only five of them ever completed and released into the seas. They had the double effect of tying up naval assets hunting for them and being "sneaky" enough to do serious damage.
In my mind a similiar ship would very effective in Traveller. Base it on one of the standard design frames, but boost the performance by cutting down on cargo space. Admittedly, it could not damage large convoys, but part of the effectiveness of commerce raiders is that merchant ships are forced to convoy together with large escorts which again reduces trade and sucks ships away from the front lines. And, of course, it you've got lots of guts, join up with a convoy and attack it from the inside during the jump sequence.
The Oz
SOC-14 1K
I have often thought that being a subsidized merchant would involve certain design features intended to make the ship more useful for military service, if called up. This is just like the great ocean liners, which had Royal Mail subsidies and in return had the necessary structural reinforcements for easy mounting of heavy guns when mobilised.
Imagine a 10,000 dton longliner that is required to have four 100-dton weapons bays installed when the ship was built. Normally the bays are used to hold small craft, or cargo, or fuel. But if a war starts, the bays can easily be equipped with weapons and the ship becomes an armed merchant liner with much heavier weaponry than just some triple turrets.
Used as a convoy escort it would give a commerce raider quite an unpleasant surprise. OTOH, it wouldn't have any armor and its other defenses might be light as well, so it can't endure a stand-up fight against a real warship.
Imagine a 10,000 dton longliner that is required to have four 100-dton weapons bays installed when the ship was built. Normally the bays are used to hold small craft, or cargo, or fuel. But if a war starts, the bays can easily be equipped with weapons and the ship becomes an armed merchant liner with much heavier weaponry than just some triple turrets.
Used as a convoy escort it would give a commerce raider quite an unpleasant surprise. OTOH, it wouldn't have any armor and its other defenses might be light as well, so it can't endure a stand-up fight against a real warship.
BetterThanLife
SOC-14 1K
With the size of a typical solar system, being invisible doesn't matter. You can go EMCOM and hide anywhere. Visual range is limited, (in most variations of the rules in OTU) to around 50KM. Detection range on active sensors is between (again depends on rule set) 50,000KM and 250,000 KM. You don't need Black Globes and if you are just sitting there silent you can still watch what everyone else is doing. As for visual camo, you could always coat the ship in Cameoline. But since you will be detected long before visual range what is the point?
Space is big and borders are absurdly porous. Don't wait until war is declared. Get your raiders into striking range in months -- years? -- before they're needed.
Countermeasures to "black globe cloaked" ships? Some sort of gravitic mass-detecting sensor, perhaps? </font>[/QUOTE]
It would also make it possible to hide warships just about anywhere -- not just among the asteroids and icy Oort cloud bodies, and down in the atmospheres of gas giants. Black Globe Generators consume negligible amounts of power, right? If so, you could "put englobed ships to sleep" (with their power plants operating at standby levels and their crews in low berths) with a flock of stealthy (and probably tiny) "sentinel drones" waiting for orders or a set of pre-determined "wake-up conditions."
Space is big and borders are absurdly porous. Don't wait until war is declared. Get your raiders into striking range in months -- years? -- before they're needed.
Countermeasures to "black globe cloaked" ships? Some sort of gravitic mass-detecting sensor, perhaps? </font>[/QUOTE]
BetterThanLife
SOC-14 1K
It is in the description of how Black Globe generators work in Combat. Where the Invisibility of them is discussed.
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