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CT Only: Experience

You are confusing the rule in Book 1 with the rule you quoted from TTB in another thread several years ago. The rule on p. 35 isn't a surprise to me. It is a rule that applied to all combat in CT.

The passage I was referring to in TTB (that damage to characteristics does not change the effectiveness of a characteristic) muddied the water because of how it was written. It implied that even damage from previous combats did not alter the effectiveness of a characteristic. The rule had to be cleaned up in the errata.

So, what you're saying is: Lowered stats do no matter during a combat, but they matter after the combat is over.

So, if your STR 9 is lowered to STR 7 in combat, a player still refers to his character has having STR 9 during the combat.

But, once the combat is over--let's say the next day--and the character received no healing (still at STR 7 for three days until naturally healed), then you consider the character to be at STR 7 for all purposes.

Am I reading you right on this?
 
So, what you're saying is: Lowered stats do no matter during a combat, but they matter after the combat is over.

So, if your STR 9 is lowered to STR 7 in combat, a player still refers to his character has having STR 9 during the combat.

But, once the combat is over--let's say the next day--and the character received no healing (still at STR 7 for three days until naturally healed), then you consider the character to be at STR 7 for all purposes.

Am I reading you right on this?

Yes, you are reading me right, and Book 1 right, and the Errata that clarified the language from the TTB right.

The text in TTB is there so players are not having to keep recalculating modifiers during the fight -- which could be a pain in the ass and slow combat down.

But it is awkwardly phrased and lacking proper context in the surrounding paragraph and as such can be read as writing over the original intent of the rules.
 
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Is there a link to buy the 1977 CT pdf?

I just checked DriveThru, and I didn't see it.


It's in the FFE CT CD-ROM, I've got it as most do here,we can look up most any question you have at the moment on this topic.


I would agree with creativehum as to the reason why, and if one needs a reason you could say it's the whole 'didn't notice was shot' adrenaline rush to counterbalance the first blood/knockout rule.


I just can't swallow it.


Fortunately for going with Striker, I can use the Light/Serious/Mortal system for minor NPCs and my approximating system for detailed PCs and NPCs.
 
"Hit Points" in Traveller (at least, in CT) are very fluid (and abstract, to an extent)

A gunshot wound that is a serious wound isn't defined by a number of points, rather it is defined as what ever it takes to knock TWO physical attributes to zero.

If a character takes damage and no physical are lowered to zero, then the wound is very minor--COMPLETELY healed in 30 min with medical care or with three days rest for natural healing.

There are anomalies, where sometimes less damage damage points represents more damage to the character.

Take, for example, a character with these stats: 68A777. He is hurt, using the first blood rule, where damage is randomly applied to his END. Damage is 8 points.

After the combat, the character has taken a Minor Wound, and his stats are 682777 until healed.

Now, consider the same character (totally healed now) taking first blood damage in the amount of 10 points of damage. Randomly, damage is applied to END, which takes that stat to zero.

The character's stats become 680777, and he is unconscious.

In 10 minutes, he wakes up, and his stats automatically raise to 685777 until healed.

Here, less damage resulted in more stat damage to the character.




Or, consider another character with attributes 79B777 who takes the same amount of damage, 10 points, and it is randomly taken on the same stat, END. This second character does not go unconscious, but instead takes the damage and operates as if he has no wound during the combat. His stats become 791777.



The point being: Damage in CT is defined by its effect, not by the amount of damage points.
 
Now, consider the same character (totally healed now) taking first blood damage in the amount of 10 points of damage. Randomly, damage is applied to END, which takes that stat to zero.

The character's stats become 680777, and he is unconscious.

Actually, no. There are two points of damage left, and they must be applied to STR or DEX.

(Book 1, p.34: "Once a characteristic has been reduced to zero, further points may not be applied to it; they must be applied to other (non-zero) characteristics.")

This means characters effectively have a hit point pool of STR + DEX + END in combat.
 
Anyone curious about these matters might want to take a look at the CT Errata. It makes clear a few points that are in the rules text, but not always spelled out as well as they should.

First, "hits" in CT are full dice values. After the first hit the Player gets to decide which dice are applied to which characteristics. So if a 6 and 2 are rolled for damage the Player can assign the six or one characteristic and the 2 to another to keep his character conscious.

However in first blood the first incoming hits are applied to a randomly rolled characteristic. This means the player loses that advantage and might lead to the PC being knocked unconscious on the first hit.

The rules say that any time a characteristic goes to zero any left over damage points must be applied to another characteristic. In fist bold the characteristic is determined randomly. Otherwise the player chooses.

The rules never state what happens when a characteristic is lowered but doesn't go to zero. It certainly never says such a wound stays at the wounded level. The example in the text, however makes it clear that a characteristic that is dropped from 8 to 4 goes to 6. This example is buried in the middle of a paragraph about what happens when one characteristic goes to zero. (Note: Recovery for a wounded character who does not become unconscious or has one characteristic driven to zero is medical attention or three days of rest. ([Per the CT Errata: “30 minutes with a medical kit and an individual with at least medical-1 skill, or three days of rest.”]))

I believe this is because the text is contrasting what happens when two characteristics go to 0. In such a case, the wounded characteristics do not rise to the mid-point between the wounded value and the starting value of the characteristic, but remain where they are or rise from 0 to 1. (Note: Recovery for a character with two characteristic driven to 0 is dependent on a medical facility and an individual with medical-3 skill. [Per the CT Errata: “Recovery is dependent on medical attention (a medical facility and an individual with Medical-3 skill; recuperation to full strength without medical attention is not possible).” Such medical attention should require between 5 and 30 days (5D days) to complete.])

If we do not read the rules this way we end up with the situation in S4’s example, where a man shot and driven unconscious will end up with higher characteristics than a man who only had the characteristics driven down a few points. This is, let’s be honest, weird. Which is why it is awesome the CT Errata makes it clear that a man who has taken wounds but is not knocked unconscious will have his characteristics set between the wounded value and the starting value before the combat.

These rules put pressure on characters:

The more they fight without rest, the lower their characteristics will get.

The lower their characteristics, the more likely the first shot will knock them unconscious, seriously wound them, or kill them.

The lower their characteristics the less effective they become with firearms, melee weapons and brawling.

Recovery will often depend on time — time the PCs do not always have. If a medic is not available then minor wounds or light wounds will required three days of rest. (And rest is defined as doing nothing.) A character who has suffered serious wounds will need medical attention for 5D days — a long time if you are being chased by adversaries, rushing to beat someone to a treasure, needing to get off planet to keep making money for your ship, and so on.

A seriously wounded character might well have a modified UPP of 116786. Such a character would go into a fight knowing it might well be his last.

The wounding system, as it stands, is a lovely design of pressure applied to the PCs (and their players), forcing them to make decision about what fights to start, when to show their faces, what risks to take, how best to lie low, seeking out medical help in hostile environments, whether to risk a fight when weakened, or take the time to heal, the need to make allies or provide bribes when looking for a safe place to heal, and so on.

Like most of the Classic Traveller rules it is a fiercely clever piece of work, much more interesting in an application of wounds than, say the Hit Points of D&D, in that there more implications for wounds and much more for the players to consider as wounds place more and more pressure on them.
 
Has anyone noticed the text on wounding and death on page 35+ of the Traveller Book is different in places to what is written in the sidebar of page 47?
Each die rolled for wounds is treated as a group of hits that should not be divided; for example, a ID result of 5 should be treated as 5 hits to be applied as one group to one of the physical characteristics. Select the first physical characteristic to receive wounds randomly; the wounded player character may select all subsequent physical characteristics to receive wounds.
Note that this isn't the text for the first blood rule, it is how to allocate hits subsequent to first blood.
Note number two, the same disparity is in Starter Edition.

Since this is getting away from experience I think it is time for a new thread.
 
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Actually, no. There are two points of damage left, and they must be applied to STR or DEX.

(Book 1, p.34: "Once a characteristic has been reduced to zero, further points may not be applied to it; they must be applied to other (non-zero) characteristics.")

This means characters effectively have a hit point pool of STR + DEX + END in combat.

His stats were 68A777.

He took 10 points of damage for his first hit. Let's say 2D was rolled, getting 5, 5.

That is taken together, as a whole total of 10 points, applied randomly to the three physicals. Random selection lands on END.

So, the character's stats are 680777, just as I said. And, the character is unconscious.

Where are you getting two points of damage left?
 
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