How Old Are We?

[Liam Devlin]

Originally posted by trader jim:
liam....who you tryin to kid...chocklet milk and coffee....old chow hall trick...i used to do that way back in.....holy cow....never mind!!!

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Actually, TJ, yer telling on yerself- Da taught me this trick from the Chief's mess on CVA-67, USS JFK !(and he was a seven term man E-7), back in 74, we wer in Norfolk,VA/ it was in port, at Christmas dinner.

 

[Liam Devlin]

first 24hrs shows 25 of 39 polled are in 31-40 range! more than 50%....demographics. Hmmmm.
interesting!

 

[Falkayn]

Originally posted by Jame:
I'm under 25 - 22, as a matter of fact, and feeling every second (life's rather frustrating me at the moment, economically at least). The reason I didn't care for Firefly was its Wild West theme - it just didn't appeal to me (and I do have one CT item, mainly because CT was before my time ).

Don't worry about the economic challenges, that continues later in life (but you start worrying about the mortgage, the car payments, and the children's education

).

Glad you found out about Traveller, it's a fun game and worth playing!

 

[Falkayn]

Originally posted by lightsenshi:
I honestly don't see Traveller appealing to a younger crowd any longer. It lacks the instant flavor of some other game systems.

I agree with your assessment, but not because of a lack of "instant flavour". Most of the younger people I know (limited to those I work with, my nephews/nieces and those I know through church) don't understand sci-fi the way I (and I suspect may Traveller players) do.

Most of them know about sci-fi as a TV/movie genre, not the almost solely literature genre I grew up with. I mean I got to watch Star Trek (original), Buck Rogers and Star Wars, but I formed my mental picture of sci-fi through Isaac Asimov, Larry Niven, Jerry Pournelle, Poul Anderson, Robert Heinlein and Harry Harrison (go Stainless Steel Rat!).

Many of the young people I know just do not find my favourite 'science fiction' interesting, either because there aren't anime references, they don't understand the science (when real science is actually referred to) or find the characters too old to readily identify with. Most of them are uninterested in pen-n-paper roleplaying because they'd prefer to play online computer games than actually have to use their imagination and visualise!

OTOH, my nephews were delighted when I got one of them the DVD of Outland, they thought it was a great movie (despite some dated SFX). Perhaps I should get them playing some T20?

The RPGs that have "instant flavour" probably do well because they pick up on existing brands (like Star Trek, Star Wars, Farscape, etc.) and get bought by kids looking for background material on their favourite TV series/movie. Also, Traveller has until recently only been seen as either:
1. Classic Reprints: Young 'uns think they must be for old-timers.
2. GURPS Traveller: Just another GURPS universe, and so less appealing to non-GURPS players.
Perhaps T20 will break those old views and get it out amongst the sub-25 year olds again!

 

[kafka47]

For Traveller to work, we need a real great Science Fiction film that would inspire a generation and consequently inspire Traveller. Then we need to get the kids to read. As a librarian, I think that I do my part for suggesting that libraries buy T20...sadly, there has been a backlash of sorts against RPGs in Toronto Public. And, I am not sure why? They have high circ. and they don't really have a high loss rate. I think that everyone knows about the cultural wars in the US and just fear the contagion coming northwards.

In the meantime, those visiting Toronto - check out the homepage of the Merril collection for lost RPG wonders. web page

 

[Liam Devlin]

Originally posted by kafka47:
For Traveller to work, we need a real great Science Fiction film that would inspire a generation and consequently inspire Traveller. Then we need to get the kids to read. As a librarian, I think that I do my part for suggesting that libraries buy T20...sadly, there has been a backlash of sorts against RPGs in Toronto Public. And, I am not sure why? They have high circ. and they don't really have a high loss rate. I think that everyone knows about the cultural wars in the US and just fear the contagion coming northwards.

_________________________________________________
Innoculated against anti-RPG tyranny; raised and trained next generation gamers from children (now teenaagers). Gen-X might be bereft of dreams and ability to read in CD-age, but millenium-Next, I'm doin me part.

Btw-my MUM is a librarian, in Indiana, halfway to Toronto from me.Three cheers for you!
And am Innoculated against creeping socialist doom from the north, and EU. I read therefore I'm free!

72 hrs later 32 of us out 50 in 31-40 range! Whoo Hoo!Catch up ye whipper snappers! Quit yer lurkin, and start workin!

 

[Loki]

Will be 55 next month. Still remember starting gaming on an Atari 800 with cassettes (only later did I upgrade to a 5 1/2" floopy drive), AH's D-Day board game, Coleco-Vision and, I am embarassed to admit it, bought the original PONG game for my TV. Wow, I am old as the hills. Or at least some hills!

 

[lightsenshi]

Originally posted by Loki:
Will be 55 next month. Still remember starting gaming on an Atari 800 with cassettes (only later did I upgrade to a 5 1/2" floopy drive), AH's D-Day board game, Coleco-Vision and, I am embarassed to admit it, bought the original PONG game for my TV. Wow, I am old as the hills. Or at least some hills!

8 TRACKS!

 

[trader jim]

yeah...well beat this guys...I STILLGOT MY OLD TRASH 80!!!...beat that!!!!

 

[mshoen]

I'm part of that 36-40 crowd that cut their SFRPG teeth on CT, Star Frontiers, and good old Universe from SPI...ah those were the days!
Makes me feel like digging up my old Members Only nylon jacket, my Vanns slip on sneakers, a good REO Speedwagon albumn, and vote for the Gipper in 2004!

Of course having a wife 10 years my junior helps me keep a fresh "perspective".

Cheers to my fellow 30-somethings!
Big Mike
Class of 1984

 

[Shadowdancer]

I turned 43 in December.

 

[Liam Devlin]

And from yer picture, ye dinnae looka day over 32!
(must be the life ye lead keeps ya so young, eh?)

Slainte!
see ya at Starfall!

 

[kafka47]

Originally posted by Liam Devlin:

Originally posted by kafka47:
[qb
Innoculated against anti-RPG tyranny; raised and trained next generation gamers from children (now teenaagers). Gen-X might be bereft of dreams and ability to read in CD-age, but millenium-Next, I'm doin me part.

Great Liam, we need more young people in the library. Gamers tend to be excellent readers. So that is why I cannot understand some issues that my selection committee. But, they clarified it below...

Btw-my MUM is a librarian, in Indiana, halfway to Toronto from me.Three cheers for you!
And am Innoculated against creeping socialist doom from the north, and EU. I read therefore I'm free!
!

It is not so much an issue of intellectual freedom, TPL does endorse the freedom to read what you want and whenever you want. It seems like that RPGs fall into realm of handbooks...which the committee feels have a high loss rate...therefore, RPGs exist outside of Merill but usually classed as generic which defeats the ideal of accessibility...

So Toronto-Area gamers, if you want to see T20 or any other RPG, enough of those who fill out a purchase request form will cause the committee to shift its position.

Then comes the whole problem with budgets, which are really strapped in Canada for public libraries.

In the meantime, as mentioned there always is the Merril Collection...

 

[Liam Devlin]

Originally posted by kafka47:

Great Liam, we need more young people in the library. Gamers tend to be excellent readers. So that is why I cannot understand some issues that my selection committee. But, they clarified it below...

________________________________________________
The "great Liam"? Nahhh, must be "Great, Liam.."

_________________________________________________
It is not so much an issue of intellectual freedom, TPL does endorse the freedom to read what you want and whenever you want. It seems like that RPGs fall into realm of handbooks...which the committee feels have a high loss rate...therefore, RPGs exist outside of Merill but usually classed as generic which defeats the ideal of accessibility...

So Toronto-Area gamers, if you want to see T20 or any other RPG, enough of those who fill out a purchase request form will cause the committee to shift its position.

Then comes the whole problem with budgets, which are really strapped in Canada for public libraries.

In the meantime, as mentioned there always is the Merril Collection...

_________________________________________________
Mum sez stuff like that disappears off shelves(checked out once and never returns). Thus it remains in the realm of FLGS's & Bookstore chains.

Bummer for TPL.
I'll pray for a better tomorrow, and convert those within arms reach.

 

[siefertma2]

Originally posted by kafka47:
For Traveller to work, we need a real great Science Fiction film that would inspire a generation and consequently inspire Traveller.

I'm afraid that's not likely to happen. Hollywood response mainly to what the public wants: flashy SFX, action, violence, and some T&A thrown in for good measure. (Remember "Swordfish?" Lousy movie, but thousand of horny males rented it just to get a glance of Haley Berry's "acting attributes.") But a movie that actually makes you to think??? Unless we are dealing with a "gay cowboys eating pudding"* art film that only can appeal to foppish, pretentious, coffee house poseurs, then forget about it.

Who says that there's no middle ground?

*Not that there's anything wrong with being gay, a cowboy, and/or pudding.

Then we need to get the kids to read.

Isn't that like trying to get pigs to sing?

 

[kafka47]

Originally posted by Mark A. Siefert:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by kafka47:
For Traveller to work, we need a real great Science Fiction film that would inspire a generation and consequently inspire Traveller.

I'm afraid that's not likely to happen. Hollywood response mainly to what the public wants: flashy SFX, action, violence, and some T&A thrown in for good measure. (Remember "Swordfish?" Lousy movie, but thousand of horny males rented it just to get a glance of Haley Berry's "acting attributes.") But a movie that actually makes you to think??? Unless we are dealing with a "gay cowboys eating pudding"* art film that only can appeal to foppish, pretentious, coffee house poseurs, then forget about it.

Who says that there's no middle ground?

*Not that there's anything wrong with being gay, a cowboy, and/or pudding.

Then we need to get the kids to read.

Isn't that like trying to get pigs to sing?</font>[/QUOTE]I have hope...otherwise, I wouldn't be in this profession. Kids are reading, just not the same way, as their parents but has been an eternal problem.

As for Hollywood, occasionally, a film comes around and breaks the mould. If there would be an SF film that might do it, it would Asimov's Foundation. It would get people reading again SF and indeed the classics. But, the most I can hope for is that David Weber auctions off the movie rights to some of his titles.

 

[lightsenshi]

Harrington movies would rock.

 

[sandman]

The RPGs that have "instant flavour" probably do well because they pick up on existing brands (like Star Trek, Star Wars, Farscape, etc.) and get bought by kids looking for background material on their favourite TV series/movie. Also, Traveller has until recently only been seen as either:
1. Classic Reprints: Young 'uns think they must be for old-timers.
2. GURPS Traveller: Just another GURPS universe, and so less appealing to non-GURPS players.
Perhaps T20 will break those old views and get it out amongst the sub-25 year olds again!

I must say that I'm a new convert to Traveller. Ok, I'm not in the sub-25 range for the Poll, but then again, I might just introduce 6 other players to Traveller. We were looking for a Generic Sci-Fi RPG but didn't really knew one. Some kept comming back with Mechwarrior (because they Just Love Mechs) others weren't interested in learning "Yet Another RPG System".

Then I found out about T20... Many of us (but not me) knew about the D20 system, and it doesn't have the Obligatory Mecha Reference that every other SF RPG has since Anime made them cool.

I'm planning on getting the Classics Reprint, because even if T20 is a pretty Generic System, I don't really have time to come up with a complete Imperium/Setting for the players. Since we're averaging 15 years of RPG experience, the Feeling of the background must be there because Munchkinin' Around isn't our way to have Fun.

I Really must say that the Classic Traveller might have put off many younger gamers because of the Look of the books. Other companies Traveller lines are dead (TNE, T4...) and it's not everyone that actually want to play GURPS.

T20 is a refreshing look on a 25+ year old, Mature, completely original RPG with massive potential.

Lets put it that way: It's the ONLY Generic SciFi D20 book out there (at least for now)

others are based on TV Shows or Movies, and as such, aren't really "Generic" (You can easily forget the Imperium in T20... but Forgetting the Empire in StarWars isn't that good for the majority of the players, because they WANT to play in THAT particular background).

Anyway, enough ranting, I'm still reading T20 (just finished the Design Sequences) and have some catching up to do

 

[sandman]

quote:Originally posted by kafka47:
For Traveller to work, we need a real great Science Fiction film that would inspire a generation and consequently inspire Traveller.

I'm afraid that's not likely to happen. Hollywood response mainly to what the public wants: flashy SFX, action, violence, and some T&A thrown in for good measure. (Remember "Swordfish?" Lousy movie, but thousand of horny males rented it just to get a glance of Haley Berry's "acting attributes.") But a movie that actually makes you to think??? Unless we are dealing with a "gay cowboys eating pudding"* art film that only can appeal to foppish, pretentious, coffee house poseurs, then forget about it.

Just look at all those SF Shows on TV that got Thrashed. The Marketroids got the better of Andromeda, Farscape is now Farscrapped, Firefly's Been Squashed. B5 had a very tough life on TV, with it's follow up show (Crusades) being thrashed because "Oops, we don't have the money we promised you", Star Trek is lousier on every new iteration of the shows (Now Featuring Pretty Bimbo(TM)) and suffer from a terminal case of Generic Plot Generator Syndrome.

Heck, even in the Bibo'R'Us department, Lexx didn't last that much. (tho it was WEIRD enough not to qualify as a "sexual innuendo only" show)

Now it's Reality Shows.

If only they'd made Survivor In Space. Bunched'em all up in MIR and let the winner fall back to earth with it.

 

[sandman]

Sorry, forgot a thing

SciFi Movies that makes us think...

Hum... maybe Equilibrium could qualify, even if it has scenes of intense action. Kind of mix between the Matrix, Farhenheit 451 and 1984.

http://us.imdb.com/Title?0238380