Dreadnought
SOC-12
Falkayn--
Dave
If it's current T20 stuff, I have no idea, as I've read none of it, sorry.
Dave
(hypothetical) What would you ask Dave Nilsen?
- Thread starter hunter
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Dreadnought
SOC-12
Uxi--
Thanks,
Dave
Did you pick it up on your own, or were you mentored into it by existing Traveller players?
We certainly tried to integrate everything. I'm not sure if we completely succeeded, but we kept reaching for that.
I just posted on that earlier today or last night. Let me know if that answers your questions or if you have some specific ones.
That was intended to mean that the Hivers did not weather the period from 1130 to 1200 unscathed by virus, but that it hit them hard, and then they were able to rebuild after it much more rapidly than human societies.
Thanks,
Dave
ChaserCaffey
SOC-12
All Ithklur are considered to be in one of two spiritual/philisophical states: "elementary" and "enlightened". Ithklur begin as "elementary", conscious only of the physical world, but eventually become "enlightened". I think the best description I've seen comes directly from the TNE sourcebook "Aliens of the Rim, Vol. 1"Originally posted by Falkayn:
It does sound similar, here is the appropriate bit from Gateway to Destiny:
<snip>
I don't mean to harp on it, but it bothers me not knowing how this fits in, and your previous post does seem to fill in some gaps for me (oh, if only I had more TNE stuff to hand).
(Sorry for the long quote, I'll edit if someone decides this is too long for fair use)
Note that for Ithklur, being elementary does *not* mean being regarded as stupid or somehow not as good as the enlightened, just at an earlier stage of development. The closest human parallel is officers and enlisted personnel, and the Ithklur career paths from AotR reflect this.
I'm not familiar with the T20 material, but it sounds as though the designers wanted to carry this concept over into the D20 system, and decided that the best way to do it was to allow Ithklur characters to take a feat that would designate them as "enlightened".
It's called being "Gregged". See my comments in my defence of Dave and GDW in the "TNE Flamewar" thread.Originally posted by Cymew:
Having been totally confused by Greg Stafford and his odd behaviour of making all statements about Glorantha totally subjective *and* contradictory I really liked the objectiveness of Traveller!!
BTW, Dave, do you have any comment on what I wrote over there? Was my analysis of your game direction decisions accurate?
RainOfSteel
SOC-14 1K
Originally posted by Hyphen:
Dear Hunter ("deer hunter"?
OK, I'm stumped. I understood Dave being "TNE Ancient", but what the frell is "GDW Design 6 Emeritus" supposed to mean??
I've been reading through the last eight pages, wondering exactly the same thing.Any ideas?
Originally posted by RainOfSteel:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Hyphen:
OK, I'm stumped. I understood Dave being "TNE Ancient", but what the frell is "GDW Design 6 Emeritus" supposed to mean??
I've been reading through the last eight pages, wondering exactly the same thing.Any ideas? </font>[/QUOTE]A & that didn't translate well? Or a Prisoner reference/employee #.
Casey
Rupert Boleyn
SOC-12
I'm going to stick my nose in here, too. I also liked your style.
As to why, well it's hard to say (I'm not very good at this sort of criticism), but one element was this feeling that the writer (you) had an interesting sense of humour, and that you believed in what you were doing. This made your much less dry than that of many game companies, and helped the reader (me) feel they were part of 'the group', and not just a guy buying stuff of the bookstore shelf. Your writing was personal in some way, even when you were writing impersonal material.
In some ways SJG's house style is similar, but they like exclamation marks more.
RainOfSteel
SOC-14 1K
Originally posted by Casey:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by RainOfSteel:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Hyphen:
OK, I'm stumped. I understood Dave being "TNE Ancient", but what the frell is "GDW Design 6 Emeritus" supposed to mean??
I've been reading through the last eight pages, wondering exactly the same thing.Any ideas? </font>[/QUOTE]A & that didn't translate well? Or a Prisoner reference/employee #.
Casey </font>[/QUOTE]Maybes it's a typo and should read GDW Designer Emeritus.
It's called being "Gregged". </font>[/QUOTE]In fairness to Greg Stafford, he's dealing with mythologies, legends, religious mysteries and magic, all of which are invariably both internally contradictory and contradicted by other belief systems.Originally posted by Hyphen:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Cymew:
Having been totally confused by Greg Stafford and his odd behaviour of making all statements about Glorantha totally subjective *and* contradictory I really liked the objectiveness of Traveller!!
While Stafford probably goes a bit overboard, his world is pretty much the complete opposite of generic McFantasy like the Forgotten Realms, etc.
ChaserCaffey, thnks for chiming in, that helps me get a better idea of where the Ithklur are at. They always seemed interesting as servants/not servants of the Hiver and this thread has halped me put some flesh on those bones, as well as igniting ideas for a TNE 1248 campaign ...
Rupert Boleyn
SOC-12
How do you get that characters could do that much unarmed damage? About the most you'll ever see is Str15 x Skill-10 /10 = 15 points x 1.5 (for a kick) = 23 points. That's a lot, but it's also for a very strong, very skilled character. More likely would be something like Str-8 x Skill-5 /10 = 4 points (6 for a kick), which is about the same as a pistol.
Yeah and most people have serious misconceptions about the lethality of firearms. Infection is the real killer as far as gunfire... and a kick could just as easily lead to internal damage, ruptured organ, broken bone, etc.
That said, I use D10 for my firearms damage dice and use all of the alternate rules (Critial Hit, Called Shot/Location, etc ).
That said, I use D10 for my firearms damage dice and use all of the alternate rules (Critial Hit, Called Shot/Location, etc ).
Did you pick it up on your own, or were you mentored into it by existing Traveller players?
</font>[/QUOTE]On my own. I was the primary referree / DM for my groups previous RPGs: AD&D 2nd, West End's Star Wars, some assorted Palladium (Macross II, Robotech II, TMNT), and of course a brief foray into Cyberpunk. We were just coming off of a Star Wars campaign and rather and the AD&D was moving to another homebrew campaign area so we wanted something else for our "Sci-Fi" flavor. I was wanting something more "Hard-Science" and TNE fit the bill perfectly.
Then of course, I discovered the TML and it's hostility towards TNE and induldged my predilection for conflict and joyfully jumped into the fray.
Unfortunately this was already mid-late '97 and GDW was already belly-up IIRC.Our TNE campaign kinda fizzled mostly due to Real Life (tm) concerns, and I started another Star Wars campaign until I worked out a couple more campaign arc issues (that I never seemed to get to).
That was intended to mean that the Hivers did not weather the period from 1130 to 1200 unscathed by virus, but that it hit them hard, and then they were able to rebuild after it much more rapidly than human societies.
</font>[/QUOTE]Ah ok, I was interpreting that to mean that the Hiver Federation of the New Era was going to fall between NE2 and NE17. I was planning on having the Hivers and their deception removed from their preeminence but not with extinction of the Hivers, etc but rather that "The Federation" moved beyond their hegemony and they became "ordinary" (if still influential and manipulative) members.
I will add that I found both the RSB and RCVG enormously useful books, even though I never did get a Regency campaign going (I was centered on the RC). And I've been drooling for years about the 'Flamer vehicles in Striker II in an official product, particularly illustrations. Ah, what might have been.
I did have a question if there were any plans or ideas for the Centrist / Federalist battle of the Assembly in the RC and and if the Primary AO was going to be altered at all. I had my own plans on that, of course, but am curious on yours and GDW's (to the extent you remember) on that matter.
Dreadnought
SOC-12
Hyphen, Rain of Steel, Casey (and any others)--
"GDW Design 6 Emeritus" goes like this.
That was my suggestion for what my title might be because I didn't understand how in the world one got them. When I first contacted Hunter about posting here, I asked him if I could get my dog's picture as my avatar (and he set that up for me), and said I wasn't sure how that title thing worked, but that "GDW Design 6 Emeritus" would be okay with me.
Honestly, I was not sure if "Ancient" was reserved for guys like Marc, or what "Old One" was for, and I did not want to get all presumptuous and ask for a title to which I was not entitled. So I figured I'd just suggest one which was accurate and descriptive.
My title my last three years at GDW was "Chief of Design." In the US Army, radio callsigns for specific officers use the unit's distinctive callsign plus a numeral representing the officer's position. 6 is the commanding officer, 5 is the XO, etc. So the commanding general of the 1st Infantry Division, "Danger," would be "Danger 6." So in that parlance, "Chief of Design" would be "Design 6."
Emeritus, of course, is "one retired from professional life but permitted to retain as an honorary title the rank of the last office held" (Merriam-Webster), you know, like "professor emeritus."
So "GDW Design 6 Emeritus" means a former GDW Chief of Design.
When I saw that Hunter changed my SOC-10 to "TNE Ancient," I thought, "oh, cool, I get to be an Ancient. That's kind of nice." Then a while later I guess he must have dug through his inbox to the message where I suggested GD6E and changed it to that. I have since told him that he can leave it like that or TNE Ancient, whichever he prefers, and whatever is easy for him. I would be happy with either, although I wrote to Hunter that TNE Ancient might be more appropriate as this is specifically a Traveller board. (My former title as Traveller Line Manager would be "Traveller 6 Emeritus" using the same pattern.)
Sorry for the confusion. Confusion just follows me around like a big cloud, doesn't it?
Dave
"GDW Design 6 Emeritus" goes like this.
That was my suggestion for what my title might be because I didn't understand how in the world one got them. When I first contacted Hunter about posting here, I asked him if I could get my dog's picture as my avatar (and he set that up for me), and said I wasn't sure how that title thing worked, but that "GDW Design 6 Emeritus" would be okay with me.
Honestly, I was not sure if "Ancient" was reserved for guys like Marc, or what "Old One" was for, and I did not want to get all presumptuous and ask for a title to which I was not entitled. So I figured I'd just suggest one which was accurate and descriptive.
My title my last three years at GDW was "Chief of Design." In the US Army, radio callsigns for specific officers use the unit's distinctive callsign plus a numeral representing the officer's position. 6 is the commanding officer, 5 is the XO, etc. So the commanding general of the 1st Infantry Division, "Danger," would be "Danger 6." So in that parlance, "Chief of Design" would be "Design 6."
Emeritus, of course, is "one retired from professional life but permitted to retain as an honorary title the rank of the last office held" (Merriam-Webster), you know, like "professor emeritus."
So "GDW Design 6 Emeritus" means a former GDW Chief of Design.
When I saw that Hunter changed my SOC-10 to "TNE Ancient," I thought, "oh, cool, I get to be an Ancient. That's kind of nice." Then a while later I guess he must have dug through his inbox to the message where I suggested GD6E and changed it to that. I have since told him that he can leave it like that or TNE Ancient, whichever he prefers, and whatever is easy for him. I would be happy with either, although I wrote to Hunter that TNE Ancient might be more appropriate as this is specifically a Traveller board. (My former title as Traveller Line Manager would be "Traveller 6 Emeritus" using the same pattern.)
Sorry for the confusion. Confusion just follows me around like a big cloud, doesn't it?
Dave
Dreadnought
SOC-12
Okay, I'm up to Malenfant and Uxi's posts on multi-bodied, meta-identity on page 8, I think.
Malenfant, your observation about the vulnerability of AI characters is well taken, and of course was noted in TNE in our discussion of the way that vampire ships would need to capture crew and somehow keep them coerced into properly maintaining their systems, or showing up at starports with their guns trained on the control tower and say, "check the oil and rotate the tires, or the control tower gets it."
Also, I enjoyed the idea of the PC starship who constantly harangue the crew to "mop my floors (actually, there's an interesting question: if the ships said, "mop my floors," would you be likely to say, "hey, bonehead, the correct phrase is 'swab my decks'" if you were standing near an airlock?), shine my brightwork, paint my fin," although honestly I've long doubted that future starships will actually have painted hulls, probably having something more adaptive. However, we stuck with the notion of painting because it's just simpler to think of, and that's the only way that the nice Osprey or Squadron-style profile galleries make any sense. Scrap views of nose art only make sense if they are in some sense permanent parts of the vessel. If they're just snapshots of a constantly-changing kaleidoscope fluxing across the surface of the ship (as they well might be), what's the point in showing a picture of it as a way of showing different ships' distinctive appearances? You could have a ship constantly playing Ren & Stimpy cartoons across its surface. That's one of those cases where "what would the future really look like?" ran a little afoul of "what do people buying the game today think will be fun and interesting to look at?" and we erred on the side of the latter, if only because that's what's fun for designers and artists as well.
Which reminds me, some of the most fun I had as "Traveller 6" and "Design 6" was supervising art. I loved working with Lamont Fullerton designing the Arrival Vengeance patch, staying up all night a couple nights running working on the deckplans, making the "bridled steed" bedspreads, the potted plants, the pool balls on the pool table, the bowls of chips at the bar, etc. Making the details come to life like that was one of the best parts of the job.
Dave
Malenfant, your observation about the vulnerability of AI characters is well taken, and of course was noted in TNE in our discussion of the way that vampire ships would need to capture crew and somehow keep them coerced into properly maintaining their systems, or showing up at starports with their guns trained on the control tower and say, "check the oil and rotate the tires, or the control tower gets it."
Also, I enjoyed the idea of the PC starship who constantly harangue the crew to "mop my floors (actually, there's an interesting question: if the ships said, "mop my floors," would you be likely to say, "hey, bonehead, the correct phrase is 'swab my decks'" if you were standing near an airlock?), shine my brightwork, paint my fin," although honestly I've long doubted that future starships will actually have painted hulls, probably having something more adaptive. However, we stuck with the notion of painting because it's just simpler to think of, and that's the only way that the nice Osprey or Squadron-style profile galleries make any sense. Scrap views of nose art only make sense if they are in some sense permanent parts of the vessel. If they're just snapshots of a constantly-changing kaleidoscope fluxing across the surface of the ship (as they well might be), what's the point in showing a picture of it as a way of showing different ships' distinctive appearances? You could have a ship constantly playing Ren & Stimpy cartoons across its surface. That's one of those cases where "what would the future really look like?" ran a little afoul of "what do people buying the game today think will be fun and interesting to look at?" and we erred on the side of the latter, if only because that's what's fun for designers and artists as well.
Which reminds me, some of the most fun I had as "Traveller 6" and "Design 6" was supervising art. I loved working with Lamont Fullerton designing the Arrival Vengeance patch, staying up all night a couple nights running working on the deckplans, making the "bridled steed" bedspreads, the potted plants, the pool balls on the pool table, the bowls of chips at the bar, etc. Making the details come to life like that was one of the best parts of the job.
Dave
Dreadnought
SOC-12
Antony--
I do recall having an image in my mind of Lucan as some cyber-augmented guy hanging in this giant holotank of the space around him and reaching out and grabbing stars to order the Vampire Fleets to attack them, and generally doing his version of Daffy Duck's "mine, mine, all mine!" That sort of thing would have been well placed at the IIS Data Repository. Also that reminds me that I think that there were going to have to be multiple Lucans in various star systems, which would somehow be subordinate to the "master Lucan," kind of like hunting down the various brains in Starship Troopers.
And the idea was that these scenes would be shown in the adventure material from the Black Curtain era. But as we had not yet gotten to the point where we were designing the BC in detail, a lot of those specifics were not yet nailed down.
The other level on which your question is a good one is that, as you could see in RSB, we were still using the DGP material at this point. I recall having discussions with Marc at a few points during my tenure where I checked with him and he assured me that we could still use the DGP material in the continuity, which I fully intended to do. That must have been before the Sanger purchase, as the only good reason to not use the DGP continuity material would be if we were somehow legally prohibited from so doing, which at the time I was told we were not.
Dave
Must have been pretty big, or else as you imply, a pretty wimpy MG. I recall having a devil of a time getting a decent MG into the TL-15 version. I even believe the resulting design was compromised in some way, but I'd have to look at the book again to confirm that.
That's an excellent question on a couple of levels. First, the answer is that that sort of thing would, yes, have been incorporated into the Black Curtain plot, i.e., the ability of the Vampire forces there to take advantage of the unique data and technology there to be taken over.
I do recall having an image in my mind of Lucan as some cyber-augmented guy hanging in this giant holotank of the space around him and reaching out and grabbing stars to order the Vampire Fleets to attack them, and generally doing his version of Daffy Duck's "mine, mine, all mine!" That sort of thing would have been well placed at the IIS Data Repository. Also that reminds me that I think that there were going to have to be multiple Lucans in various star systems, which would somehow be subordinate to the "master Lucan," kind of like hunting down the various brains in Starship Troopers.
And the idea was that these scenes would be shown in the adventure material from the Black Curtain era. But as we had not yet gotten to the point where we were designing the BC in detail, a lot of those specifics were not yet nailed down.
The other level on which your question is a good one is that, as you could see in RSB, we were still using the DGP material at this point. I recall having discussions with Marc at a few points during my tenure where I checked with him and he assured me that we could still use the DGP material in the continuity, which I fully intended to do. That must have been before the Sanger purchase, as the only good reason to not use the DGP continuity material would be if we were somehow legally prohibited from so doing, which at the time I was told we were not.
Dave
ChaserCaffey
SOC-12
No problem. If you're really interested in the Ithklur and their dynamics vis a vis the Hivers, then picking up a copy of Aliens of the Rim might be worth your time. They're usually available from used game stores (I've had good luck with Titan Games at www.titangames.com) or on eBay for a not unreasonable sum of money. The book is chock-full of information about the interactions between Ithklur and Hivers- read it over, then read Mr. Nilsen's posts earlier in the thread again. I guarantee you'll have a little lightbulb on over your head.
(Note: Not sure if the website plug is OK, but I'll remove it if requested to)
