Mechs in traveller idea
- Thread starter slyen2002
- Start date
I had voted for it because:
Most of the Mech/giant robot material appears to be pictures from T4. Hence a weak support in canon.
However it would work it would be unlikely that its a standard BattleTech env. A mix between mech, mechs for noble combat, or specific environments.
Savage
Most of the Mech/giant robot material appears to be pictures from T4. Hence a weak support in canon.
However it would work it would be unlikely that its a standard BattleTech env. A mix between mech, mechs for noble combat, or specific environments.
Savage
) Aliens style cargo loaders? Sure.Anti-grav technology seems to speak against the mech idea, so no.
Glen Allen Mcinnes
SOC-12
The use of Grav tech makes most man opperated "Mechs" beound cargo loaders an powerarmors but for thouse who suck at grav tech or dont have acess to the raw mitrials (like the solomani) it may be a feasable course of technogical development.
I remember when the game was in playtest there was a thread on the forums back then regarding mechs.. basically you had two camps of people.
1. The Generics, Those who wanted all things sci fi to be covered to some degree..
2. The Canonists, Those who believe all things not appropriate to or supported by standard traveller precedents or traditional supplements should not be allowed.
I seem to recall that thread ended without a definitive opinion being formed heh
1. The Generics, Those who wanted all things sci fi to be covered to some degree..
2. The Canonists, Those who believe all things not appropriate to or supported by standard traveller precedents or traditional supplements should not be allowed.
I seem to recall that thread ended without a definitive opinion being formed heh
Spiderfish
SOC-12
Should not be allowed?
Hahahaha...
Legislation today was passed in the House of Commons banning all Tech level 21 Banana Peels in games of Classic Traveller and Megatraveller.
We will be bringing you more news when an update on this legislation TNE impact is issued.
Hahahaha...
Legislation today was passed in the House of Commons banning all Tech level 21 Banana Peels in games of Classic Traveller and Megatraveller.
We will be bringing you more news when an update on this legislation TNE impact is issued.
I can't make up my mind. I think as far as official Imperium story material (or Sol, Zho, Vegan, Vargr, Aslan, et. al) I lean against it.
At the same time it seems like it'd be one of those pocket universe type of things, and that a set of rules defining them would probably be appropiate.
That, and I'm running for office this November
At the same time it seems like it'd be one of those pocket universe type of things, and that a set of rules defining them would probably be appropiate.
That, and I'm running for office this November
There was at least one mech design in that DGP publication 101 Vehicles used by one of the minor human races.
Would Imperial forces have "Mechs" I believe this would be unlikely. Would planetary forces have mechs, around TL8-9 likely. Reason grav is either non-existant, or an emerging technology. Walker type vehicles can go places tracked and wheeled vehicles cannot. My conclusion then is that mechs (and walker vehicles) will occur at the TL8/9 level where there is terrain too difficult for tracked and wheeled vehicles and grav vehicles are too rare or expensive. But I do not believe they will be common.
As for high tech mechs a TL14 or TL15 "Mech" is certainly possible. How will it fair against a Trepida grav tank?
Would Imperial forces have "Mechs" I believe this would be unlikely. Would planetary forces have mechs, around TL8-9 likely. Reason grav is either non-existant, or an emerging technology. Walker type vehicles can go places tracked and wheeled vehicles cannot. My conclusion then is that mechs (and walker vehicles) will occur at the TL8/9 level where there is terrain too difficult for tracked and wheeled vehicles and grav vehicles are too rare or expensive. But I do not believe they will be common.
As for high tech mechs a TL14 or TL15 "Mech" is certainly possible. How will it fair against a Trepida grav tank?
There aren't really any places that walkers can get to that current vehicles can't. While you might say that they can get into hilly terrain better, can they do it and move about well? If you were a commander that had to assault a mountain outpost, would you rather do it with a mech or with good air support? They will be overly ponderous in the terrain they have been touted as excelling in, or sitting ducks for guerillas with heavy weapons.
Also, the complexity of the mechs will make them prohibitively expensive to operate. To pack as much into these vehicles as most mechs display, there would have to be a good amount of miniturization on some big mechanical equipment...not to mention the power plant. Motors and actuators to operate the limbs, beam weapons, missiles...how many missiles can you fit into a walking tank?
What about safety considerations for the pilot? The M1 Abrams has a compartmented turret so that if the ammunition for the main gun starts to cook off the occupants of the turret will not be killed or severely injured. Will the pilot tub for a mech offer the same level of protection?
This leads me to ask, what level of metallurgy does the manufacturer possess? A running mech is going to create enormous stress on all joints. Failure *WILL* happen. Can they take weapon recoil? What about the excess weight of the armor? What about stresses from reactive armor detonations? You know someone will mount it...
What about sensors? Target and fire control radar and computers take up space.
Pilot controls? To be responsive, the control computer will have to be exceedingly powerful by current standards.
As a full on BattleMech (from anime or wherever) no way...as an oversized suit of battledress, sure, why not?
Now, that's not to say some government on a balkanized world won't make a stupid decision and build a bunch. There neighbors likely won't since conventional combat vehicles will be much cheaper and as or more effective than mechs.
Just my opinion. Take it or leave it.
Also, the complexity of the mechs will make them prohibitively expensive to operate. To pack as much into these vehicles as most mechs display, there would have to be a good amount of miniturization on some big mechanical equipment...not to mention the power plant. Motors and actuators to operate the limbs, beam weapons, missiles...how many missiles can you fit into a walking tank?
What about safety considerations for the pilot? The M1 Abrams has a compartmented turret so that if the ammunition for the main gun starts to cook off the occupants of the turret will not be killed or severely injured. Will the pilot tub for a mech offer the same level of protection?
This leads me to ask, what level of metallurgy does the manufacturer possess? A running mech is going to create enormous stress on all joints. Failure *WILL* happen. Can they take weapon recoil? What about the excess weight of the armor? What about stresses from reactive armor detonations? You know someone will mount it...
What about sensors? Target and fire control radar and computers take up space.
Pilot controls? To be responsive, the control computer will have to be exceedingly powerful by current standards.
As a full on BattleMech (from anime or wherever) no way...as an oversized suit of battledress, sure, why not?
Now, that's not to say some government on a balkanized world won't make a stupid decision and build a bunch. There neighbors likely won't since conventional combat vehicles will be much cheaper and as or more effective than mechs.
Just my opinion. Take it or leave it.
That is pretty much my take on it...I look at
it this way if you don't want them don't use
them. But why chase away gamers who might be
attracted to try Traveller if something "cool" that they use in other systems just might tip
the balance?
The other thing as pointed out else where is
you can put these things on planets where Grav technology for what ever reason was not used
or developed. Also, who says this has to be human tech ieda? Lets say a minor race developed walker technology for cultural or physiological reasons (the Drakarans and or Clotho come to mind).Carrying this thought on, say these machines where encountered by some lower
leveled human types.Who then decide to make their own.
This is only one of many possible ways these machines can be included without distracting
or replacing the cannon.
Something that occurred to me about battledress and an option that means that they do actually make sense to have larger versions (mecha versions).
Things that are easy to detect:
Fusion/Fision Power
Active Grav Drives
Things that are hard to detect:
Battery usage
"Leg" Drives
So a Grav tank with legs isn't so daft after all. It allows a low profile hard to detect, still mobile vehicle. A vehicle that with the right legs can use them to grasp the ground and allow a very stable firing platform.
Against most lower tech oponents you wouldn't be using the legs ever, just floating arround splatting things with your enormous guns. Against equivalent tech oponents, the edge in stealth may be worthwhile.
A hybrid power vehicle (Legs/Grav) can drop out of space, land and disappear by turning off their fusion power plant (or turning it down massively) switching off the grav units and going to Legs and battery mobility. This also allows 'mecha' to fly at will.
Things that are easy to detect:
Fusion/Fision Power
Active Grav Drives
Things that are hard to detect:
Battery usage
"Leg" Drives
So a Grav tank with legs isn't so daft after all. It allows a low profile hard to detect, still mobile vehicle. A vehicle that with the right legs can use them to grasp the ground and allow a very stable firing platform.
Against most lower tech oponents you wouldn't be using the legs ever, just floating arround splatting things with your enormous guns. Against equivalent tech oponents, the edge in stealth may be worthwhile.
A hybrid power vehicle (Legs/Grav) can drop out of space, land and disappear by turning off their fusion power plant (or turning it down massively) switching off the grav units and going to Legs and battery mobility. This also allows 'mecha' to fly at will.
The problem with this discusion is that it covers too much. What do you mean by "Mecha"? According to the strict definition of Mecha (as defined by the various manga writers) any vehicle qualifies, including tanks and helicopters.
Personally I would like to see the more "realistic" forms of mecha in Traveller. Powered Armor Suits like Madox-01, Starship Troopers, and even the suits from Bubblegum Crisis would all work in the setting. Larger vehicles like the Star Wars Walkers and AT-ATs are a bit dodgy in terms of actual combat effectiveness but they look so cool!
The shape changing, combining, and transforming mecha wouldn't fit well within Traveller.
In the real world Mecha are just the wrong shape to be effective. A combat vehicle needs to be low and/or narrow to present the smallest possible target. Mecha are tall and wide...
Eric J
Personally I would like to see the more "realistic" forms of mecha in Traveller. Powered Armor Suits like Madox-01, Starship Troopers, and even the suits from Bubblegum Crisis would all work in the setting. Larger vehicles like the Star Wars Walkers and AT-ATs are a bit dodgy in terms of actual combat effectiveness but they look so cool!
The shape changing, combining, and transforming mecha wouldn't fit well within Traveller.
In the real world Mecha are just the wrong shape to be effective. A combat vehicle needs to be low and/or narrow to present the smallest possible target. Mecha are tall and wide...
Eric J
Evo Plurion
SOC-12
I agree with Spyder. Mechs, like manned space fighters*, are cool but unrealistic. In the OTU, mech technology couldn't precede grav technology, and I couldn't see mechs having any tactical capabilities against fast, maneuverable grav tanks.
Sylen2, I've seen your other posts concerning mechs. I know you are a big fan. I am too; I love the concept. So don't let the OTU or our interpretations thereof hinder your enjoyment. You want mechs? It's your universe. Use them.
*Yes, I think space fighters are unrealistic. Unmanned missiles and drones make a lot more sense. They're smaller, cheaper, need no pilot and are easily controlled from the mothership.
Actually Sylen2, you've inspired me to start a thread about manned fighters vs missles and drones. Thanks!
Sylen2, I've seen your other posts concerning mechs. I know you are a big fan. I am too; I love the concept. So don't let the OTU or our interpretations thereof hinder your enjoyment. You want mechs? It's your universe. Use them.
*Yes, I think space fighters are unrealistic. Unmanned missiles and drones make a lot more sense. They're smaller, cheaper, need no pilot and are easily controlled from the mothership.
Actually Sylen2, you've inspired me to start a thread about manned fighters vs missles and drones. Thanks!
RainOfSteel
SOC-14 1K
I'd say that the Imperium and other major states don't use "mecha", but various smaller states, if they had a high enough TL, might deploy some.
This way, the primary portion of the OTU retains its look and feel, and odd little corners, are, well, odd little corners.
This way, the primary portion of the OTU retains its look and feel, and odd little corners, are, well, odd little corners.
