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Mottoes of the Various Services

Originally posted by Andrew Boulton:
"We Serve The Imperium!"

Nice. But too republican (small r). Should be "We serve the Emperor."
Good (lack of) God, no! The good of the Imperium has to take precedence over the desires of the Emperor.

We should keep in mind that (at least in the Dennyverse) Arbellatra had to defuse further attempts by her fellow admirals to seize the throne and to restore the Imperial Navy to it pre-civil war state as the primary protector of the Imperium.

I touched upon this subject in this piece on the COBRA class escort.

So how did the Cobra-class of close escorts acquire a reputation for being mutiny prone?

In fact the crews of Cobra-class escorts were no more prone to mutinies than the crews of any other class of Imperial warship under normal conditions. But it was during the Imperial Civil War that a statistical blip occurred as a result of the sloppy manning practices in effect at the time.

When Admiral Plankwell unloaded his sidearm into Empress Jacqueline he not only disconnected the Imperial Navy from legitimate civil authority, he violently disrupted the bond of comradeship within the officer corps and enlisted ranks of the navy. If Plankwell -- an unwashed lout from the farthest frontier -- could by force of arms proclaim himself to be El Numero Uno, reasoned one would-be claimant to the throne, then anyone could. And anyone who could gather a battle fleet would do just that.

Prior to the assassination of Empress Jacqueline the Imperial Navy guarded the frontiers and kept the peace between the worlds, to be permitted to serve in the Navy was an honor and privilege granted to a select few. But when Plankwell planted his posterior upon the Iridium Throne he converted the various sector fleets, and the Core Fleet in particular, from being guardians of the empire to being in effect bands of pirates that any sufficiently warm body could join.

Sector Admirals seeking to plant their hindquarters on the throne would gather a fleet for an expedition to the core, and as a general rule would place personnel who are the most competent -- and certainly the most loyal to themselves -- aboard their flagships. The less powerful the unit being manned, the less loyal or competent the embarked crew. The loyalty and competence of close escort crews were often the last thing on the mind of the would-be rulers. To further aggravate matters, bureaucrats (usually ground based) would use the requisitioning of fleet units by would-be claimants as an opportunity to rid themselves of incompetents and other unwanted personnel.

All of this was in no way conducive to the creation of a sense of comradeship amongst the crews of Cobra-class escorts. Normally a military unit, from the infantry fire-team to the crew of a first line battleship, is also a social unit. But the crews of close escorts in the claimant fleets were little more space-going mobs. It should not have been a surprise to see a high rate of disorder aboard units of the Cobra-class. Nor should it have been a surprise if the captain of a Cobra decides to turn pirate, as many did during the Civil War.

The notable exception to the aforementioned misadventures in personnel management was the task force organized and led by Grand Admiral Alkhalikoi to put down what she called "The Great Mutiny," and restore civil authority over the Imperial Navy.

Whereas most escort captains in the claimant fleets were flakes and losers, Admiral Alkhalikoi hand picked the commanders of her close escorts and gave them license to head-hunt for their own crews.

The close of the Civil War and the restoration of rational personnel management practices (along with the hunting down of the remaining renegades) brought an end to the mutiny problem in the close escort units. However, the aforementioned statistical blip would become an issue when the time came for the Imperial Navy to replace the Cobra-class escort.
 
Like Les The Imperium of MTU has long had (game and realworld) one unifying motto, roughly translated:

"Service is Citizenship"

Heavily inspired by Heinlein's "Starship Troopers" obviously but not quite so... heavy handed?

IMTU there are few ways to attain the status of Citizen of the Imperium. You may of course be born to Nobility, elevated to the Nobility, or serve a term in one of the services (Army, Marine, Navy, Scout, or Merchant in CTB1). Nobility is also a Service IMTU but not one subject to draft. The draft IMTU is also voluntary but there is no shortage of applicants to the services and part of the requirement of application is being subject to the draft if the service of your application denies said application. Only those who really fail to meet the needs of The Services won't be drafted (in CTB1 that's a roll of 6 on the draft, i.e. Other).

You can also lose your Citizenship, but that's generally bad, very bad. Naturally most player characters are Citizens, with all the privilege and responsibility the status earns. Most people in The Imperium are not Citizens. Not exactly subjects but also not entirely free.

Naturally there are other mottos, specific to services, units and such, but this is one known by all Citizens, IMTU.

Long explanation for three little words
but I felt it needed some context.
 
And then I dug up this old thing from the TML:

I had this vision of a conversation between Marine Captain Randall (Jeff Anderson from CLERKS) and Marine First Sergeant Hartman (R. Lee Ermey from FULL METAL JACKET, Etc.), a survivor of the first wave on Objective Alpha. (From part 17 of FIHP.)

Capt. Randall: I am constantly compelled to continually ask myself as to why are we here.

1SGT. Hartman: We serve the Imperium, sir!

Capt. Randall: Granted that is the meta-purpose that drives the actions of everyone from the newest marine recruit in the grinder to His Majesty the Emperor Himself, but that still does not explain why we ourselves are stuck on a pathetic mudball like Tarkine.

1SGT. Hartman: To keep a lid on the [expletive] pirate-hugging scum, sir!

Capt. Randall: Eloquent and to the point as always First Sergeant.
 
"Good (lack of) God, no! The good of the Imperium has to take precedence over the desires of the Emperor."

The Emperor *is* the Imperium.

In a feudal system, monarchy, or dictatorship, you swear allegiance to the leader - "God save the Queen!", "Heil Hitler", etc.

In a republic, the leader is really a servant of the state/people - "God bless America!", "Vive la France!", etc.
 
IMHO I think it should be "For Emperor and Imperium", as in "For Queen/King And Country". Also, colonial units won't say "We serve the Emperor" but "We Serve [insert Noble's name here]; they swear alliegance (sp?) to their direct liege, who, in turn, swears alliegance (sp?) to the Emperor - this is a variant on Feudalism, after all, not on Absolutism.
 
Braknak Security Inc. (aka The Brute Squad):

"Knowing is only half the battle. The other half is our business."

@Lord Irial:
I´m afraid you mixed up the Marines´ motto. It´s either "semper fidelis" (forever loyal) (the USMC motto, IIRC) or "sic temper tyrannis" (that´s what always happens to tyrants). Of course, what you wrote, "that´s what always happens to loyal people", is also a kind of motto, although a rather cynical one...

@Employee 2-4601:
How about calling the Colonial Corps the "Corps of Engineers"?
And the ST Army motto could be "semper vigilans" - always vigilant.

Yours,
Chaos
(Latin amateur with a BIG dictionary)
 
"IMHO I think it should be "For Emperor and Imperium""

Bit of a mouthfull though! No use as a battle cry - the war would be over before you finished saying it :)
 
Originally posted by Andrew Boulton:
"Good (lack of) God, no! The good of the Imperium has to take precedence over the desires of the Emperor."

The Emperor *is* the Imperium.

In a feudal system, monarchy, or dictatorship, you swear allegiance to the leader - "God save the Queen!", "Heil Hitler", etc.

In a republic, the leader is really a servant of the state/people - "God bless America!", "Vive la France!", etc.
As a Big "R" Republican (in the U.S.) I basically take the view that no polity can be considered to exist apart from the body of citizens and that the leader (President, Queen, Emperor, Whatever...) is basically the First Citizen, and that oath of fealty to the Emperor is a oath to Imperium as a whole. I do believe that this interpretation is consistent with the already published comments of Norris and Strephon. (Two guys I could work for.)

Of course Your Traveller Universe May Vary...
 
That's your opinion, and there's some truth to it - without the people there's no Imperium, and therefore no Emperor, and he only keeps his position because the people let him.

But that doesn't change the fact that in a feudal system you swear allegiance to *individuals*. Your loyalty is to the *person*, not the group they represent.

The British oath is:

"I [full name], swear by Almighty God that I will be faithful and bear true allegiance to Her Majesty Queen Elizabeth the Second, Her Heirs and Successors, according to law."
 
Originally posted by Andrew Boulton:
"IMHO I think it should be "For Emperor and Imperium""

Bit of a mouthfull though! No use as a battle cry - the war would be over before you finished saying it :)
No, the battle cry would typically be "For Norris!" or "For Brzk!" (sp?); it is a feudal system, after all; most troops would swear alliegance (sp?) to the local Noble (or, at most, the local Archduke), and the Noble would swear alliegance (sp?) to the Emperor.
 
Originally posted by Fritz88:
Actually, Chaos, sic semper tyrannis is the motto of the Commonwealth of Virginia, not the Marines.
I knew it wasn´t the Marines motto; maybe I wasn´t clear enough. That happens to me, sometimes.

I didn´t know who did use it, though. Interesting...
 
Chello!

And the quote comes from what Marcus Junius Brutus is supposed to have said when he stabbed Gaius Julius Ceasar in 44 BC.

In American history, John Wilkes Boothe shouted it after shooting President Abraham Lincoln in the back of the head.

Tony
 
Originally posted by Andrew Boulton:

The British oath is:

"I [full name], swear by Almighty God that I will be faithful and bear true allegiance to Her Majesty Queen Elizabeth the Second, Her Heirs and Successors, according to law."
Is that the military oath only or for all citizens?
 
Originally posted by Redleg:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Andrew Boulton:

The British oath is:

"I [full name], swear by Almighty God that I will be faithful and bear true allegiance to Her Majesty Queen Elizabeth the Second, Her Heirs and Successors, according to law."
Is that the military oath only or for all citizens? </font>[/QUOTE]All citizens - except if you are born in the country, you don't ever have to actually say the words (unless you're knighted or serve in the Commons or the Lords). You're assumed to have agreed. Anyone becoming a British citizen must swear the Oath of Allegience, or make a solemn affirmation to the same. I would imagine that anyone taking up military service would also swear the Oath.

So we're all liegemen of the Queen - even if a citizen is of a republican bent. Therefore, any British born republican is also an oathbreaker
and technically a traitor :D - although I think this would be extremely difficult to make a legal case for.

Gentlemen, a
toast.gif
 
The military oath is longer:

"I swear by Almighty God that I will be faithful and bear true allegiance to Her Majesty Queen Elizabeth II, her heirs and successors and that I will as in duty bound honestly and faithfully defend Her Majesty, her heirs and successors in person, crown and dignity against all enemies and will observe and obey all orders of Her Majesty, her heirs and successors and of the generals and officers set over me."

"0307. Irrespective of private beliefs, this Oath embodies the context within which the British Army fights and operates. It expresses the formal yet personal loyalty of every soldier in the British Army to the Sovereign as head of state. This focus on the Sovereign means that whatever the political views of individual soldiers, the British Army is essentially apolitical. Similarly, the Sovereign is the authority for the Commissions and Warrants of the various categories of officers. There is a similar formal yet personal relationship of Corps and Regiments to the Sovereign. These relationships find expression in the Colours, Standards and other emblems of Regimental and Corps spirit which derive from the Sovereign, and in the Ceremonial which demonstrates publicly the role of the Army in the fabric of the nation."

http://www.army.mod.uk/servingsoldier/usefulinfo/valuesgeneral/adp5milcov/ss_hrpers_values_adp5_3_w.html#selfless
 
Originally posted by Valarian:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Redleg:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Andrew Boulton:

The British oath is:

"I [full name], swear by Almighty God that I will be faithful and bear true allegiance to Her Majesty Queen Elizabeth the Second, Her Heirs and Successors, according to law."
Is that the military oath only or for all citizens? </font>[/QUOTE]All citizens - except if you are born in the country, you don't ever have to actually say the words (unless you're knighted or serve in the Commons or the Lords). You're assumed to have agreed. Anyone becoming a British citizen must swear the Oath of Allegience, or make a solemn affirmation to the same. I would imagine that anyone taking up military service would also swear the Oath.

So we're all liegemen of the Queen - even if a citizen is of a republican bent. Therefore, any British born republican is also an oathbreaker
and technically a traitor :D - although I think this would be extremely difficult to make a legal case for.

Gentlemen, a
toast.gif
</font>[/QUOTE]Indeed it would be foolish and self destructive to take such a case to court, Monarch's rule by the consent of those with power under them and I doubt modern day Britain would appreciate this sort of action and we all have a lot more economic power nowdays.

You've also got to take into mind the quite probable illegitimacy of the current line's claim to the throne, such things could be brought up and used to discredit them.

The present line draws authority from the Marriage of Henry Tudor to the daughter of King Edward IV* who was probably not his father's son. His father was on campaign during the possible period for conception, this would make Henry Tudor's bride not royal at all.

Of course without this we would not have had the Tudor Kings or Queens or the sweeping changes brought in like the reformation freeing us from papal domminance**. This would have made war with Spain less likely so we would probably have been content to lie in the Spaniard's shadow rather than rising to eventually become a great Imperial power, anyone that is what I heard.

Swings and Rounabouts.


* This was a political marriage to give Henry VII a more legitimate claim.

** Or that Henry VIII drama-doc with Ray Winstone
 
In 1966, I swore to defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic...
I still deem myself beholden thereto, and so I vote, and write to the newspapers, and to my congressional representatives...
I feel this is a model oath for any representative government (strange British system with no written constitution not withstanding). But of course, somebody out there will want my heart's blood for saying this.
 
"I feel this is a model oath for any representative government"

For a republic, sure.

"(strange British system with no written constitution not withstanding)."

Magna Carta is kind of our Bill of Rights. Not having a formal, written constitution does make it more flexible, and able to constantly evolve, but it's not something I'd recommend for most countries.
 
Indeed not, it's left us vunerable to all kinds of terrible laws and injustices, constantly evolving consitutions probably aren't a good thing at any rate.

It kind of defeats the point of something that's meant to look after your civil rights if it can be changed at the drop of a hat by any jumped up corrupt government.
 
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