grendelttroll
SOC-12
As long as they're licenced for Traveller or pass through QLI (which is licenced) for publishing, my guess is they would allow it.
Hunter could hop in on this question and answer it more formally
New blood or lack thereof.
- Thread starter jfwking
- Start date
Hunter could hop in on this question and answer it more formally
Liam Devlin
SOC-14 5K
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++Originally posted by Minotaur:
What you do to get new players is get children that play
to get friends to come, like me
Welcome Minotaur, (progeny of Father Fletch)! Or you can raise your gamers from infancy (while fending off the hobbit/ kender poaching of snacks).
For those of you without progeny, this is an option unavailble save thru adoption.
Another method of evangelizing T20/Traveller, was getting the D20 AdnD'ers the T20 HB fer christmas.
Now if I can get my RW/RL time conflicts resolved, the FTF gamers are wondering when we're gona start.
In the meantime, managed to scrape together with folks off this forum a dandy online RP game of T20. A coup[le of players have had their FTF game of T20 take off, and have dropped into inactive status (but this is a good thing too, as T20 is being perpetuated.
Last...
May I commend the Minotaur on their choice of Avatar!
PAX SOLEE!
Piffle, I say! I'm raising my own gamers, and I haven't had to adopt! I gotta tell you, this uncle gig is the greatest in the world! All the benefits of being a grandparent, without having to slog through parenthood, first!
And I gotta tell you, my protege is coming along nicely! He's got the devil's own luck when it comes to rolling the dice. (He rolled a natural Yahtzee just last night, curse him!
My approach to attracting new blood to Traveller is by forming PBEM's with D&D players and introducing them that way. If they are DM's even better. My current group has three DM's and they seem to be enjoying it. T20 was a godsend for this.
This approach has little financial risk for them, since I am the only one with the T20 HB (plus the LBB and some T:G sourcebooks). Once they see whether it is their cup of tea they buy the HB. One of my players is already planning on introducing his face-to-face group to Traveller.
Like somebody said before, Traveller may not appeal so much to those that do not enjoy hard science, but in my experience hard science can be made very interesting and more enjoyable than the lite stuff. It has so much depth. It just might take a bit more work for the Referee but I've always thought that T Referees were very different people than other game masters.
This approach has little financial risk for them, since I am the only one with the T20 HB (plus the LBB and some T:G sourcebooks). Once they see whether it is their cup of tea they buy the HB. One of my players is already planning on introducing his face-to-face group to Traveller.
Like somebody said before, Traveller may not appeal so much to those that do not enjoy hard science, but in my experience hard science can be made very interesting and more enjoyable than the lite stuff. It has so much depth. It just might take a bit more work for the Referee but I've always thought that T Referees were very different people than other game masters.
Liam Devlin
SOC-14 5K
Originally posted by CarlP:
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Well, my uncling is a bit stretched as they live several states away. Still, good work if ye can get it!LOL!
Gaming Glen
SOC-12
My nieces are states away as well, in a small farming community so it would be hard to find enough players anyway. But, I own a game store so I have lots of "kids" to teach.
The problem is that many prefer fantasy. I switched my D&D game to T20 and lost 3 players. I have a couple new ones finally join, one new to RPGs (so our first newbie is no longer the worst RPG'er in the group ), but all he wants to do is kill things.
Maybe it's time to have a firefight and let him taste fear.
Then there's the 19 year-old know-it-all that claims that we did not go to the moon. It was a good thing that someone else was GMing and my character was not necessary for the current plot so I could leave the room. I really detest conspiracy advocates (but, UFO believers:
).
Now that I have the THB, I've been thinking that it might have been better to split it into two books; one for players and one for GMs. But what's done is done.
Glen
The problem is that many prefer fantasy. I switched my D&D game to T20 and lost 3 players. I have a couple new ones finally join, one new to RPGs (so our first newbie is no longer the worst RPG'er in the group
), but all he wants to do is kill things.
Then there's the 19 year-old know-it-all that claims that we did not go to the moon.
It was a good thing that someone else was GMing and my character was not necessary for the current plot so I could leave the room. I really detest conspiracy advocates (but, UFO believers:
Now that I have the THB, I've been thinking that it might have been better to split it into two books; one for players and one for GMs. But what's done is done.
Glen
Ross Heenan
SOC-8
Even though I'm new to the Traveller system, I would say that the problem with getting new blood for any system (RPG or wargammming)at present is grass roots advertising and demographics . Most people I know started out playing RPG's in Uni and we see a few kids at the local hobby store but most of the kids are either interested in some wargame or other . Also , here in OZ we see very little Traveller material and what we do see is quite expensive . Apart from "raising your own RP's" and promotions through gaming clubs , I think the present situation of 5 to 7% new is most likely to continue . Given a choice most kids would rathe play the Playstation than sit around with a bunch of friends playing out a futuristic of fantasy game
The Hinterworlds Rambler
SOC-14 5K
Also,
These darn kids today don't seem to have the will or attention span to sit and voluntarily do math, as in the old days... Curse of the Remote Control? That and the amount of reading I'm sure is intimidating... and then of course you have the often negative image that goes with RPGs. I ran out of toes and fingers counting how many gamers I know that are doppelgangers of the comic book guy on the "Simpsons"
I bet If the Imperium was full of rival factions of Pokemon, then youd get some sales growth...
Bah! Youth! Wasted on the Young!
These darn kids today don't seem to have the will or attention span to sit and voluntarily do math, as in the old days... Curse of the Remote Control? That and the amount of reading I'm sure is intimidating... and then of course you have the often negative image that goes with RPGs. I ran out of toes and fingers counting how many gamers I know that are doppelgangers of the comic book guy on the "Simpsons"
I bet If the Imperium was full of rival factions of Pokemon, then youd get some sales growth...
Bah! Youth! Wasted on the Young!
grendelttroll
SOC-12
Oh, great. Great! Now, the only thing I can think about reading your post is Pikachus toting PGMP's!!!
Pika Pika!!!! <<BLAM!!!>>
Thank you so very much!! ::grumble:::
hunter
Ancient - Absent Friend
As long as they're licenced for Traveller or pass through QLI (which is licenced) for publishing, my guess is they would allow it.
Hunter could hop in on this question and answer it more formally
Just remember, licensing isn't free and you would have to agree to meet certain quality and content standards set by both Marc and myself. If you have a serious proposal, send it to me. I am interested.
Hunter
hunter
Ancient - Absent Friend
On the subject of 'new blood' I have a poll running on the main CotI page on just that very topic. So far with a small sample of voters, it's looking like about 11% of T20 buyers are new to Traveller. Also good news is that 45% of T20 buyers have come back to the game after an extended absence.
Hunter
Hunter
jalexandratos
SOC-8
I don't know about that. I see the youth in my FLGS and they're a pretty sophisticated bunch. Well some of them. The problem is that sci-fi doesn't do that well in this industry. Even Star Wars sales are lagging.Originally posted by Baron Saarthuran:
Also,
These darn kids today don't seem to have the will or attention span to sit and voluntarily do math, as in the old days... Curse of the Remote Control? That and the amount of reading I'm sure is intimidating... and then of course you have the often negative image that goes with RPGs. I ran out of toes and fingers counting how many gamers I know that are doppelgangers of the comic book guy on the "Simpsons"
I bet If the Imperium was full of rival factions of Pokemon, then youd get some sales growth...
Bah! Youth! Wasted on the Young!
People in general want to hack-n-slash, play superheroes or spys/agents. And they seem to want detail. Not only in creating characters, but also in game setting. Less work. Heck, I know I'm lazy.
I wish that the Gateway book was out by now, so that I could pimp that to other customers. However, it's only half of what today's roleplayer is looking for.
The other half, methinks that there may have to be some re-evaluation in presentation. Take a look at Mutants & Masterminds. It's smooth layout makes it literally flow into peoples' hands (and yes, it's also an excellent system).
Sometimes I wonder if giving the presentation a more Space Opera focus may not help as well. But that's just idle speculation.
trader jim
SOC-14 1K
hey - heres an idea - lets go to game stores - and beat the kids who wont play t20 with t20 books!!!!! or is this just a little to HARSH???
hhhmmmnnnn na, probably wouldnt work....darn it!!
hhhmmmnnnn na, probably wouldnt work....darn it!!
Gaming Glen
SOC-12
Not only do the youngsters just want to hack-n-slash (us "old" geezers just hack-n-cough
), but they want to do it with a half-(pick any monster) (pick any prestige class, they're all over powered) using two weapons (has to be a minimum of +3 Slayer of Anything) and having 10,000 hit points. Then they brag about killing the Tarrasque (the supposedly unkillable unique monster in D&D) at 5th level (one group did, although at 10th level, by a newbie DM *sigh*).
I guess elves and dwarves just don't cut it any more.
Tip: using the Tarrasque
The MM gives the only way to kill it. Of course every munchkin/powergamer knows the MM from cover to cover (they study this instead of school work). Change the description, in fact, write the entire creature down on a separate piece of paper so the players cannot see the MM page you're on (even I try to peek on occassion
). Change the way it can be killed. Then kill the party, who prepared themselves with the supposedly only way to kill it.
..durn whippersnappers..
not yet a geezer,
Glen
I guess elves and dwarves just don't cut it any more.
Tip: using the Tarrasque
The MM gives the only way to kill it. Of course every munchkin/powergamer knows the MM from cover to cover (they study this instead of school work). Change the description, in fact, write the entire creature down on a separate piece of paper so the players cannot see the MM page you're on (even I try to peek on occassion
..durn whippersnappers..
not yet a geezer,
Glen
The Hinterworlds Rambler
SOC-14 5K
My 39th/40th/26th/54th level Half Elf/Ogre Fighter/Magic-User/Cleric/Thief suggests the best way to best the Tarrasque is to dig a large hole in the ground, hide in it, and wait till it gets tired and goes back to sleep... Then you get all the fun of building a new kingdom in the lands it ravaged... that is, until it wakes up again...
You are one of the more amusing posters, Lord Glen... enjoy your five stars...
You are one of the more amusing posters, Lord Glen... enjoy your five stars...
I started out with Traveller right around the time when JTAS #6 was on the shelves as a new publication and Book 5 - High Guard 2nd Ed. was a relatively new release.
The problem....
1) The functional illiteracy rate is too high nowadays, too many younger people simply don't read.
2) When the later versions of Traveller came out, like Mega Traveller, many of the rules got too cluttered and complicated with minutae and it slowed down the action and the enjoyment
3) There has been a lack of real computer integration into Traveller. Yes, there was a game that cam out a long time ago but the entire system really kind of needs to be moved as much onto the computer world as possible. I myself still enjoy the older books (though I've not tried d20 Traveller yet), but so many today are computer oriented.
Just look at where the interest is going. Traveller needs to be made so it's easy for one person to play or easy to play with others over the web.
It's going to be adapt or die, simple as that.
What the odd thing is, is that it hasn't been done yet. Since Snapshot and Mayday came out (both of which I still prefer to use), Traveller has been more and more structured like a computer game that was put on paper. Hence, taking such a game and putting it on a computer is quite feasable.
There are many aspects to this. Not only the obvious ships and space combat but things like commerce, fighting on ships, travelling through starports, etc. Since the designs all follow such a set of standardized rules for size, space, and fittings, such a computer environment would grow exponentially via third party and user/freeware contributions. It would also link vast numbers of players into campaigns like never before.
This is already happening on a titanic scale with in a similar form with some of the high speed, brainless shoot'em up type games.
Just look at the huge universe that could be created overnight by people working on the Spinward Marches if they all had standardized tools and formats to create such a universe on the web, linked together for all to travel in.
In theory, you could take a character, go out onto the web and hook up with groups of characters, and whole groups of adventurers on one campaign could possibly even run into groups on another campaign, enabling interactions and tangents like never before.
Since Traveller fans have always been something of a brainy, educated crowd, I'm sure something could be done along those lines.
It's either that or eventually watch Traveller go the way of the Atari ST and the Commodore Amiga.
The problem....
1) The functional illiteracy rate is too high nowadays, too many younger people simply don't read.
2) When the later versions of Traveller came out, like Mega Traveller, many of the rules got too cluttered and complicated with minutae and it slowed down the action and the enjoyment
3) There has been a lack of real computer integration into Traveller. Yes, there was a game that cam out a long time ago but the entire system really kind of needs to be moved as much onto the computer world as possible. I myself still enjoy the older books (though I've not tried d20 Traveller yet), but so many today are computer oriented.
Just look at where the interest is going. Traveller needs to be made so it's easy for one person to play or easy to play with others over the web.
It's going to be adapt or die, simple as that.
What the odd thing is, is that it hasn't been done yet. Since Snapshot and Mayday came out (both of which I still prefer to use), Traveller has been more and more structured like a computer game that was put on paper. Hence, taking such a game and putting it on a computer is quite feasable.
There are many aspects to this. Not only the obvious ships and space combat but things like commerce, fighting on ships, travelling through starports, etc. Since the designs all follow such a set of standardized rules for size, space, and fittings, such a computer environment would grow exponentially via third party and user/freeware contributions. It would also link vast numbers of players into campaigns like never before.
This is already happening on a titanic scale with in a similar form with some of the high speed, brainless shoot'em up type games.
Just look at the huge universe that could be created overnight by people working on the Spinward Marches if they all had standardized tools and formats to create such a universe on the web, linked together for all to travel in.
In theory, you could take a character, go out onto the web and hook up with groups of characters, and whole groups of adventurers on one campaign could possibly even run into groups on another campaign, enabling interactions and tangents like never before.
Since Traveller fans have always been something of a brainy, educated crowd, I'm sure something could be done along those lines.
It's either that or eventually watch Traveller go the way of the Atari ST and the Commodore Amiga.
Keklas Rekobah
SOC-14 1K
Now for my twenty millicredits worth...
I do something strange; I actually ask people why they do not play Traveller in any form. Their answers:
1) It takes too long to set up a game.
2) Too much hard science / Too much like school.
3) You can not start with a super character / You have to earn your character's advancement.
4) It's not like Babylon 5 / Stargate / Star Trek / Star Wars / etc.
5) It's too much like Babylon 5 / Stargate / Star Trek / Star Wars / etc.
6) No magic or magic items.
7) I can't use my 30th level Half-Irdu Half-Drow RangerMageThief with his +5/+5 Mace of disintegration, +5 Stealth Armor, 27 memorized spells, and Blue Dragon familiar.
8) The GM won't let me play Yu-Gi-Oh.
9) I'm already playing an RPG - Magic the Gathering!
10) My AD&D character will not transfer.
I do something strange; I actually ask people why they do not play Traveller in any form. Their answers:
1) It takes too long to set up a game.
2) Too much hard science / Too much like school.
3) You can not start with a super character / You have to earn your character's advancement.
4) It's not like Babylon 5 / Stargate / Star Trek / Star Wars / etc.
5) It's too much like Babylon 5 / Stargate / Star Trek / Star Wars / etc.
6) No magic or magic items.
7) I can't use my 30th level Half-Irdu Half-Drow RangerMageThief with his +5/+5 Mace of disintegration, +5 Stealth Armor, 27 memorized spells, and Blue Dragon familiar.
8) The GM won't let me play Yu-Gi-Oh.
9) I'm already playing an RPG - Magic the Gathering!
10) My AD&D character will not transfer.
Keklas Rekobah
SOC-14 1K
I should include another reason given for not playing Traveller:
11) "I'd have to either know math or use a calculator, and their too expensive."
---------------
"When you have secured the sector, always remeber to inform the enemy."
11) "I'd have to either know math or use a calculator, and their too expensive."
---------------
"When you have secured the sector, always remeber to inform the enemy."
