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Second Imperium SuperBattleship

Originally posted by Marvo:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by kafka47:
I understand that many decks will be similar but I would expect the whole thing to be detailed. Afterall, one way around it is to have catherdral celings and the area which would take up the most space would be the cargo bay, as I said to accomodate 2-4 cruisers.
As several people have pointed out, detailing an entire ship like this is totally impractical for one person. It might be possible if there were a team of people working on it, but for one person it would be a years work.

I did a quick calculation on just how big the deckplans for a ship this size would be. Using 1/4 inch graph paper, each page 8" x 10" it would be really huge. 200k = 400k squares. That's just over 17 x 17 pages if put in a square/rectangle. The area is about the same as my dining room, a tad over 11' x 14 '. If you draw this out as 'playable' deckplans then it becomes crazy. For 15mm multiple by about 2 and for 25mm, multiply the above numbers by 4. Got an empty basketball court anyone. :eek:


I don't think a real warship would have cathederal ceilings, too much wasted space. Unless of course it's just a political statement show ship. Doubling the height of the ceilings would probably mean the ship would be seriously under crewed and easy pickings in a real fight.
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</font>[/QUOTE]No, deckplans that would be large enough to include in an adventure (so therefore, don't go out to the basketball court just yet), as I said, I can be prepared to accept alot of reduncies and useless features like catheral celiengs but the biggest area must be cargo hold.

One solution would be do a cross section of the entire ship and detail key areas eg. Bridge, weapons control, low berths, mess halls, etc. Although, I could pull out T4 Naval Architect's Manual...that would be plagiarism.
 
I agree, ships this big stop being ships and become just scenery like the Deathstar, Star Destroyer or the Enterprise. If you're on board you'll only need maps of key areas like the bridge, engineering workbays, brig, typical quarters etc etc. It makes sense, mapping the entire ship is just madness.
Look on the bright side: You have a free hand regarding volumes and nobody can whinge that you've got half a ton too much fuel etc etc =)

I guess you can do thumbnails of the general layout of each deck to get the volumes right and to help get to grips with where each detailed floorplan section is in relation to each other.

I just finished a model of a Huron 50,000 dTon planetary bombardment vessel. That sucker's 200m across and 46m deep (some 15 decks) and I have no intention of doing deckplans!!!


Crow
 
Furthermore, don't forget about the MT write-up, gentlemen. How to divide the prizes as I am sure Mick. is amidable he is wanting to share some of the prize with Andrew (who once we get some colour and background - this bird will soar)
 
I'm perfectly happy to detail lots and lots of this ship (if it's cloudy outside sometimes I'm a deckplan-churnin' fool)- but I'm not sure this ship is the one Kafka wants, since as he said it's the only one he's seen submitted.

And again - in any case, (whether kafka uses it or not) the ship design will be available to everyone - so I'm keen to complete it so that others can use and enjoy it as much as possible.

'prizes', etc. don't really interest me and I'm happy to be working with Andrew to realize the design in 3d. The new snapshot looks lovely, Andrew.

And kafka - I'm a chick.
 
Originally posted by Andrew Boulton:
Y'know, I'd forgotten all about that table. Of course, it says the 3I hasn't reached TL16, even though the start of the chapter states that some worlds have. Which is what I said: the RoM didn't reach TL13, but some worlds may have.
I agree that some worlds may have reached TL 13, especially in specific technologies, but that wasn't what you said. You said that they had reached 12-13 and might have reached 14. Not quite the same thing. Likewise, the table may be wrong and certainly isn't conclusive. Butr it's more than just speculation.


Hans
 
Originally posted by Sigg Oddra:
Could it be that the MT table's wrong?
Certainly they could be, but is there any evidence to suggest that they are? (Well, yes, there is: some awful M0 adventures that I'd much rather were just forgotten ;) )

We know the Imperium didn't reach TL13 until 400. To me that suggests that there wasn't a whole lot of TL 13 relics around to reverse-engineer, let alone TL 14 stuff. Not to mention very few (i.e. none) TL13+ physics tectbooks.


Hans
 
Oops, sorry Mick. just following the role playing convention that Traveller was smart enough to avoid...real reason, I am at work and did not have time to do a proper search. Pls. accept my profuse appologies. Great work, btw. I do still think you ought to be rewarded both you and Andrew for doing the most work on this project.
 
Kafka - it's all good. No problem! When you're a woman gamer, you get used to folks mistaking you for a guy online.

If there are no other entrants, I'm happy to make sure the Ominous-class Super Battleship's design, deckplans, stats and illo's are sufficient to make your upcoming adventure a real success.

And thanks for the praise - I know that the sponsor of the contest needs to stay objective and avoid predisposition!
 
Agreed, that is beautiful Andrew. I am playing with the MT build of it and wonder if your modelling software does a volume breakdown? Just to check my rough estimates. By section would be especially handy (head, spine, disc, drives, midsection, and hanger) but even the rough total would be great. Thanks in advance if possible and no sweat if not. Again, that is cool. I guess I'll have to do the deck maps too then ;)
 
Originally posted by Andrew Boulton:
When they mistake you for a guy in real life, *then* you need to worry...
;) Or vice-versa as I've been, from behind because of my long hair. I must have a good figure from the back I guess
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Trust me, face to face, the beard kinda helps avoid mistaken gender assignment.
 
Andrew - rock ON! That looks lovely!

And I know you and I agree on the next tweak to the model - a lit, open hangar bay (maybe a few cruisers visible inside)...

I'm so glad you were motivated to model the ship.

Dan - since it's my design, I'm going to take the first crack at designing and laying out the basic plans and some interiors of a few key gaming sections, maybe even using 'SketchUp', the program with cool 3d/isomorphic deckplan possibilities... I'll be glad to keep you in the loop and we can collaborate on some of it, if you're so inspired.

And fortunately, I'm not often mistaken for a guy in real life - except perhaps when I'm playing sports (I'm a pretty fierce competitor).
 
Originally posted by mickazoid:
Dan - since it's my design, I'm going to take the first crack at designing and laying out the basic plans and some interiors of a few key gaming sections, maybe even using 'SketchUp', the program with cool 3d/isomorphic deckplan possibilities... I'll be glad to keep you in the loop and we can collaborate on some of it, if you're so inspired.
By all means do Micki, she's absolutely yours first and foremost. I eagerly await the continuing fleshing out of the Ominous and if you need any help design spec wise just holler.
 
Dan - I'll need lotsa help! And I don't wanna be overly 'territorial' at all - I wanna welcome all collaboration but also wanna make sure we don't wind up with divergent plans. Maybe a nice blocking-out of functional areas first, then a kind of 'cross-section', then localized blueprints.

And if you have any ideas, or thoughts about how to structure or differentiate the interior, please send 'em on over at any time, whatever the idea.

Thanks Dan, and Andrew, and Liam, and Kafka and everyone else who's chimed in. Please feel free to pass any and all ideas on.
 
Originally posted by mickazoid:
Dan - I'll need lotsa help! And I don't wanna be overly 'territorial' at all - I wanna welcome all collaboration but also wanna make sure we don't wind up with divergent plans. Maybe a nice blocking-out of functional areas first, then a kind of 'cross-section', then localized blueprints.

And if you have any ideas, or thoughts about how to structure or differentiate the interior, please send 'em on over at any time, whatever the idea.

Thanks Dan, and Andrew, and Liam, and Kafka and everyone else who's chimed in. Please feel free to pass any and all ideas on.
You're much welcome Micki, it was your original drawing that has earned much respect and interest. And again, thank you for it, and thank you kafka for starting this.

I agree with your outline of approach, it's the best way, and hashing out ideas in this thread is probably the best way to make a truly fine ship.

So, with the little I've started, in much the way you outlined, I've roughly blocked out the following areas:

Ship TL-12 with some solid TL9 and perhaps experimental TL13. Configuration 7 - irregular - (partially) streamlined - may skim fuel but not land. Heavy on Armor (factor 60 superdense). Full EM Masking (4000tons) and lots of commo and other electronics (full range multiple sets, some 8tons total)

Upper Command Section (above the spinal throat) - Flight Bridge (4000tons), Cutter Hanger (~500tons), and port and starboard stations for the external monorail cars to the aft section.

Lower Command Section (below the spinal throat) - Auxiliary Bridge (4000tons), Frozen Watch Racks and gear lockers (500tons?), Officers and Dignitaries quarters and commons (2000tons? this may have some double height conference rooms to impress), 2x 100ton Repulsor Bays (factor 6, to keep stuff from hitting the command center), and the auxiliary monorail car station to the mid section.

Spinal Weapon Section - with a little fudge this can be originally a TL12 Particle Accelerator (factor Q) replaced in some models with an experimental TL13 Meson Cannon (factor K) of the same size (~4445tons) and weight (14,000Mtons), drawing 250,000MW and costing MCr2,000

Mid Section - the root of the spinal weapon and whatever engineering space is needed and perhaps fuel.

Drives Section - Pretty obvious what goes here ;) I figure good old solid TL9 AntiGrav Thrusters (use less power for one) and 1G "feels" right given the size and mission. For jump TL12 J3 seems the way to go. Enough fuel for more than 3parsecs would be nice if there's room. Oh, and fuel purifiers of course.

Weapons Disc - I figure 8x 100ton Missile Bays (factor 9) and perhaps missile storage in the remaining volume. I had toyed with the idea of making it a deployable (saucer-streamlined) escape boat with a minimal landing thruster and powerplant (perhaps limited to the power allotted to the missile bays). In an emergency, evacuation to the emptied missile magazines would allow the entire complement to land on a world. Problem with that is the hanger opening through the middle.

Hanger Section - I guesstimate some 30,000tons of open hanger space for a number of possible uses. On the leading edge of the Hanger Section would be the enlisted crew quarters and commons. Below the hanger deck would be more cargo space, vehicle bays, and workshops. Above the hanger space I'm not sure, perhaps fuel. The back end of the hanger space would be the fuel scoops and purifiers, with the fuel tanks and feed running up the back of the hanger section.

Anyway, that's the way I was picturing it, subject to actual design constraints. Of course there's room for a lot (a whole lot) more weapons, either in the form of more Bay Weapons and/or Turrets. Perhaps on the upper Hanger Section and/or upper and lower Drives Section and/or Mid Section, and/or even the upper Command Section.
 
Dan:

HUGE!

Great thoughts. Almost everything seems a total winner. Here are my responses.

Throughout:

* A crapload of lifeboat stations (IMTU, I personally find the idea of convertible 'air/rafts' and vacc suits being usable for re-entry ludicrous and the best way to become a charcoal briquet. Anti-grav or no, gravity should be properly feared and respected). Perhaps the spinal section can contain the bulk of the lifeboat arrays, incorporated into the spans that enclose the rounded rects.

* Small beam weapon mounts like little pimples all over the thing

* Interior space for labs / brig / combat training / recreation

* Same question I always have for Traveller ships - in a milieu without replicators, where do they store the food and water???

Command Section:

* Spinal Weapon aperture at the front of the section? Would that mean a noisy bridge, with all the 'KAFWOOOM!'s?

Mid Section:

* Love the idea of a ventral ball turret, like in the old WWII bombers, or for the spinal mount's aperture to point downwards and emerge from midship (not a must, just an idea). The ship ain't landing, so the bottom surface can be 'all-business'. And these kinds of mounts, on the hangar and midsection, can service the ship's port side, which faces away from the large main gun platform.

Hangar Section:

* small vessel mounts / large vessel umbilicals can be deployed from the top or bottom of the section, so that vessels can be docked without occupying the main bay. There's a rules snippet in HG or LBB2 about how 'irregular/distributed' hulls permit this. It would mean the ship has 1-2 'carrier decks' as well as the hangar itself. It would also make the surfaces nice and noisy, with grapples, umbilicals, docking ports, airlocks, etc. chunked all over the place like the top of an 'everything' bagel.

* I think the fuel tanks and feeds would look cool if their shapes were distinguishable on the ship's silhouette. Perhaps the back of the hangar section, posterior to the scoops, resemble a lattice of pipes/tubes half-submerged into the surface, rather than having everything too neatly tucked away within.

* Ideal place for a few more bay turrets / beam mounts, to protect the 'weak' port side of the ship.

* Liked your thought about detaching the dish, but I think this ship is a one-piece. Detachability is, to me, unecessary for such an 'unsinkable' ship as Titanic ;)

* An inset observation/control dome emerging from the ceiling of the hangar bay, to permit airspace control and management of landing/disembarking vessels.

This ship's interiors are going to be fun to mock up. The hangar will be especially fun, I think. Death-Star-like, with lots and lots of room.

Thoughts? And thanks!
 
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