Sensorlopes & Book 2 space combat

[Plankowner]

Cymew, it's not the grognardy thing (OK, maybe a bit) it's the experience. Most of us CT people have been doing or thinking about this stuff for 20+ years. It all sinks in after a while, kinda like Aqua Velva...

You now understand the PP rating table that WJP refered you to; see how easy that was, I knew you could do it. Sure you could.

 

[Plankowner]

Cymew, it's not the grognardy thing (OK, maybe a bit) it's the experience. Most of us CT people have been doing or thinking about this stuff for 20+ years. It all sinks in after a while, kinda like Aqua Velva...

You now understand the PP rating table that WJP refered you to; see how easy that was, I knew you could do it. Sure you could.

 

[Plankowner]

WJP, I like the idea of allowing the gunner to use his skill to get extra attacks; I might limit the number to 1/2 the Gunner skill, so that it doesn't become too powerful. That could even be an optional rule for NORMAL space combat. Adds more rolls, but definitely adds the PC into the boardgame...

Reducing combat round time is also a good idea. I don't think I would go down to the seconds though. Perhaps Close (1 minute), Short (5 minutes), Medium/Long/Vlong (15 minutes). This would allow for faster action at shorter ranges, but not make things too bad.

I don't actually like the big jump from Medium to Short, but I don't see any other way and still have everything divisible into the default round length.

One shot per minute might seem a little slow, but that can be explained by the recharge time requirement.

Wadaya think?

 

[Plankowner]

WJP, I like the idea of allowing the gunner to use his skill to get extra attacks; I might limit the number to 1/2 the Gunner skill, so that it doesn't become too powerful. That could even be an optional rule for NORMAL space combat. Adds more rolls, but definitely adds the PC into the boardgame...

Reducing combat round time is also a good idea. I don't think I would go down to the seconds though. Perhaps Close (1 minute), Short (5 minutes), Medium/Long/Vlong (15 minutes). This would allow for faster action at shorter ranges, but not make things too bad.

I don't actually like the big jump from Medium to Short, but I don't see any other way and still have everything divisible into the default round length.

One shot per minute might seem a little slow, but that can be explained by the recharge time requirement.

Wadaya think?

 

[Supplement Four]

Originally posted by Cymew:
The PP rating is one I miss. So, according to your method a Far Trader 200dton with M-1 and J-2 has a PP-B then?

Yes.

A Corsair 440dton, M-3, J-2 has a PP-J, right?

No, not on that one.

That would be PP F.

See, the PP has to give performace at least as high as either the M drive or the J drive.

To push a 400 ton vessel with an M-3 drive, that would require a PP F (see ... PP F gives performance 3). To push a 400 ton vessel with a J-2 drive, you need a PP D or E. But, we've got to cover the M-3, so we go with the higher drive.

The easiest way to figure this (and it's very simple) is just to pick the bigger drive number (either M drive or J drive), and see which code that is. Your PP will be the same code.

For example: a 1200 ton liner with M-3 and J-2. M-3 is bigger, so we look that up. 1000 ton vessel needs a PP Q to push that drive (better and more expensive vessels will have PP R-U, allowing them to take damage in combat).


Real quick.

I love LBB2.

The Computer model is actually in there.

Well then, with the quick calc for the PP code, you've got all you need to use those sensor rules.

Computer Model number.
PP code
Sensor Class.

Boom. You're done. You can use the sensor rules now, with MT ships.

 

[Supplement Four]

Originally posted by Cymew:
The PP rating is one I miss. So, according to your method a Far Trader 200dton with M-1 and J-2 has a PP-B then?

Yes.

A Corsair 440dton, M-3, J-2 has a PP-J, right?

No, not on that one.

That would be PP F.

See, the PP has to give performace at least as high as either the M drive or the J drive.

To push a 400 ton vessel with an M-3 drive, that would require a PP F (see ... PP F gives performance 3). To push a 400 ton vessel with a J-2 drive, you need a PP D or E. But, we've got to cover the M-3, so we go with the higher drive.

The easiest way to figure this (and it's very simple) is just to pick the bigger drive number (either M drive or J drive), and see which code that is. Your PP will be the same code.

For example: a 1200 ton liner with M-3 and J-2. M-3 is bigger, so we look that up. 1000 ton vessel needs a PP Q to push that drive (better and more expensive vessels will have PP R-U, allowing them to take damage in combat).


Real quick.

I love LBB2.

The Computer model is actually in there.

Well then, with the quick calc for the PP code, you've got all you need to use those sensor rules.

Computer Model number.
PP code
Sensor Class.

Boom. You're done. You can use the sensor rules now, with MT ships.

 

[Supplement Four]

Originally posted by Plankowner:
WJP, I like the idea of allowing the gunner to use his skill to get extra attacks; I might limit the number to 1/2 the Gunner skill, so that it doesn't become too powerful.

If we're using Book 2 combat, I don't think we have to worry about it becoming too powerful ... because only one gunner is assigned each turret.

If a ship has two turrets, then it's up to the gunners in those turrets to fire the weapons ... so, you'd need two gunners with good skill in each turret to take full advantage of what we're talking about here.

Also, remember the DM on the damage table.

If you taken even one extra shot, then the Power Plant hit (result 2 on the damage table) and the Criical hit (result 12 on the damage table) are not possible.

If you take three or more shots, then it is very likely that your low-powered laser shots will only result in Hull and Hold hits (which aren't that damaging to a vessel in combat).

Let's say you've got a Gunner-3 in a turret. If he takes all four of his allotted shots, then he's got -3 on all of his shots (11+ needed to hit! ... which makes it unlikely he'll even hit once!), and even if he does hit, his damage table will look like this:

</font><blockquote>code:</font><hr /><pre style="font-size:x-small; font-family: monospace;">4 Jump
5 Fuel
6 Hull
7 Hull
8 Hold
9 Computer</pre>[/QUOTE]If a 2 is rolled on the damage chart, then the modifier brings it up to a 5. If a 6 is rolled, then the DM brings it to a 9.

If a 12 is rolled, the DM brings it to a 9. If a 7 is rolled, the DM brings it to a 4.

So, Criticals are not possible, and it's unlikely a gunner will hit and do damage with a lower powered blast.

Players will have to use this tactic strategically.

Possible Problem: The "Jump" hit is actually more likely on this adjusted table. Throw a 7, and it's modified to 4.

Thought: We'll have to figure how this all effects ordance launch.

That could even be an optional rule for NORMAL space combat. Adds more rolls, but definitely adds the PC into the boardgame...

That's the beauty of Book 2 combat. It's focused on role playing. It can be just a board game, but it lends itself well to rpg-focused play.

Two nights ago, I ran a ship combat. We went something like three combat rounds, but MOST of the play during the night happened inside the players ship as they were reading and interpreting sensor readings, jumping into their vacc suits, dealing with the leak on the hatch to the boat bay when the air/raft housing took a hit.

There was a lot of gaming inside the ship--much more than the plotting that was done with the two ships on the hex board. I even had to pop out the deck plans for some aspects of play inside the PC's ship.

Book 2 combat. I don't know why any other version of Traveller didn't use it. It's definitely much more fun than any other Traveller space combat system I've seen.

Reducing combat round time is also a good idea. I don't think I would go down to the seconds though. Perhaps Close (1 minute), Short (5 minutes), Medium/Long/Vlong (15 minutes).

Just for easy figuring, I use a 15 minute space combat round in my game (15 minute space combat round and a 15 second personal combat round).

But, as you know, Book 2 space combat is really 16.67 minutes (1000 seconds).

Like you, I'd probably go with the minute thing. I was just keeping the 1000 seconds in there for purists.

 

[Supplement Four]

Originally posted by Plankowner:
WJP, I like the idea of allowing the gunner to use his skill to get extra attacks; I might limit the number to 1/2 the Gunner skill, so that it doesn't become too powerful.

If we're using Book 2 combat, I don't think we have to worry about it becoming too powerful ... because only one gunner is assigned each turret.

If a ship has two turrets, then it's up to the gunners in those turrets to fire the weapons ... so, you'd need two gunners with good skill in each turret to take full advantage of what we're talking about here.

Also, remember the DM on the damage table.

If you taken even one extra shot, then the Power Plant hit (result 2 on the damage table) and the Criical hit (result 12 on the damage table) are not possible.

If you take three or more shots, then it is very likely that your low-powered laser shots will only result in Hull and Hold hits (which aren't that damaging to a vessel in combat).

Let's say you've got a Gunner-3 in a turret. If he takes all four of his allotted shots, then he's got -3 on all of his shots (11+ needed to hit! ... which makes it unlikely he'll even hit once!), and even if he does hit, his damage table will look like this:

</font><blockquote>code:</font><hr /><pre style="font-size:x-small; font-family: monospace;">4 Jump
5 Fuel
6 Hull
7 Hull
8 Hold
9 Computer</pre>[/QUOTE]If a 2 is rolled on the damage chart, then the modifier brings it up to a 5. If a 6 is rolled, then the DM brings it to a 9.

If a 12 is rolled, the DM brings it to a 9. If a 7 is rolled, the DM brings it to a 4.

So, Criticals are not possible, and it's unlikely a gunner will hit and do damage with a lower powered blast.

Players will have to use this tactic strategically.

Possible Problem: The "Jump" hit is actually more likely on this adjusted table. Throw a 7, and it's modified to 4.

Thought: We'll have to figure how this all effects ordance launch.

That could even be an optional rule for NORMAL space combat. Adds more rolls, but definitely adds the PC into the boardgame...

That's the beauty of Book 2 combat. It's focused on role playing. It can be just a board game, but it lends itself well to rpg-focused play.

Two nights ago, I ran a ship combat. We went something like three combat rounds, but MOST of the play during the night happened inside the players ship as they were reading and interpreting sensor readings, jumping into their vacc suits, dealing with the leak on the hatch to the boat bay when the air/raft housing took a hit.

There was a lot of gaming inside the ship--much more than the plotting that was done with the two ships on the hex board. I even had to pop out the deck plans for some aspects of play inside the PC's ship.

Book 2 combat. I don't know why any other version of Traveller didn't use it. It's definitely much more fun than any other Traveller space combat system I've seen.

Reducing combat round time is also a good idea. I don't think I would go down to the seconds though. Perhaps Close (1 minute), Short (5 minutes), Medium/Long/Vlong (15 minutes).

Just for easy figuring, I use a 15 minute space combat round in my game (15 minute space combat round and a 15 second personal combat round).

But, as you know, Book 2 space combat is really 16.67 minutes (1000 seconds).

Like you, I'd probably go with the minute thing. I was just keeping the 1000 seconds in there for purists.

 

[Supplement Four]

Originally posted by WJP:
Possible Problem: The "Jump" hit is actually more likely on this adjusted table. Throw a 7, and it's modified to 4.

Thought: We'll have to figure how this all effects ordance launch.

New Thought: What if we left the damage table as is and didn't modify it, but added some sort of penetration roll?

So, the procedure for Book 2 combat would be--

--Step 1-- Roll attack
--Step 2-- If successful, roll penetration
--Step 3-- If successful, roll damage on chart.

I'm borrowing this idea from High Guard.


Why do this?

1) It will erase DM problems on the Book 2 hit location chart (mentioned in the quote about Jump drive).

2) It will allow for armor to be used on Book 2 starships (we can import the armor rule as-is from High Guard).


We can make a single shot, with a DM on the penetration roll, so good that it's moot (which is why Book 2 skips penetration).

Armor could be used to protect vessels, even if a single shot is made (just like High Guard).

And, if multile, low-powered laser shots are made (shots made before the laser is fully charged as mentioned in my other post), then the DM associated with these shots will make it less likely that a ship penetrates and does damage.

A penetration table could look something like this (off the top of my head--we'll have to play with it):

</font><blockquote>code:</font><hr /><pre style="font-size:x-small; font-family: monospace;">2 Penetration
3 Penetration
4 Penetration
5 Penetration
6 Penetration
7 Penetration
8 Penetration
9 Penetration
10 Penetration
11 Penetration
12 Penetration
13 No Penetration
14 No Penetration
15 No Penetration
16 No Penetration
17 No Penetration
18 No Penetration
...etc...</pre>[/QUOTE]Example: Gunner makes single attack roll with his ship's laser. Since he rolls 2D on the penetration table, it's automatic penetration (if the attack throw was successful). This is why this step isn't used in Book 2 combat--it's moot. Single shots always penetrate if they hit.


Example: But, let's say a Gunner-3 takes three shots with his beam laser. That would be three attack rolls using a -2DM to hit (10+ needed to hit).

On any hit, that would be a +2DM on the penetration chart. So, penetration rolls of 11 or 12 would do no damage.


Example: Let's throw armor into the mix, from High Guard. Add the armor factor (I'll have to chech HG armor factors--it's been a long time since I've looked at them) to the penetration roll. If the total is 13+, then the ship's armor protected the ship, and there's no damage roll.


Example: We can add sand into the mix as well. The -3DM Book 2 gives us for a laser firing into a Sand cloud could also be used on the penetration chart. Sand would be -3DM to hit (the laser beam being refracted and dispersed by the reflective/ablative sand), and a +3DM would be used on the penetration chart.

So, if the Gunner-3 above took three shots at a target protected by a sand cloud, then his DM to hit would be a whopping -5 (-2 for taking three shots, -3 for the sand cloud). And, his DM on the penetration chart would be +5. So, rolls of 8+ on the penetration chart would do no damage.


What do you think of this...?

I kinda like it.

It needs to be tweaked a bit. And, we need to consider missiles. But, I like the germ of the idea.

Thoughts?

 

[Supplement Four]

Originally posted by WJP:
Possible Problem: The "Jump" hit is actually more likely on this adjusted table. Throw a 7, and it's modified to 4.

Thought: We'll have to figure how this all effects ordance launch.

New Thought: What if we left the damage table as is and didn't modify it, but added some sort of penetration roll?

So, the procedure for Book 2 combat would be--

--Step 1-- Roll attack
--Step 2-- If successful, roll penetration
--Step 3-- If successful, roll damage on chart.

I'm borrowing this idea from High Guard.


Why do this?

1) It will erase DM problems on the Book 2 hit location chart (mentioned in the quote about Jump drive).

2) It will allow for armor to be used on Book 2 starships (we can import the armor rule as-is from High Guard).


We can make a single shot, with a DM on the penetration roll, so good that it's moot (which is why Book 2 skips penetration).

Armor could be used to protect vessels, even if a single shot is made (just like High Guard).

And, if multile, low-powered laser shots are made (shots made before the laser is fully charged as mentioned in my other post), then the DM associated with these shots will make it less likely that a ship penetrates and does damage.

A penetration table could look something like this (off the top of my head--we'll have to play with it):

</font><blockquote>code:</font><hr /><pre style="font-size:x-small; font-family: monospace;">2 Penetration
3 Penetration
4 Penetration
5 Penetration
6 Penetration
7 Penetration
8 Penetration
9 Penetration
10 Penetration
11 Penetration
12 Penetration
13 No Penetration
14 No Penetration
15 No Penetration
16 No Penetration
17 No Penetration
18 No Penetration
...etc...</pre>[/QUOTE]Example: Gunner makes single attack roll with his ship's laser. Since he rolls 2D on the penetration table, it's automatic penetration (if the attack throw was successful). This is why this step isn't used in Book 2 combat--it's moot. Single shots always penetrate if they hit.


Example: But, let's say a Gunner-3 takes three shots with his beam laser. That would be three attack rolls using a -2DM to hit (10+ needed to hit).

On any hit, that would be a +2DM on the penetration chart. So, penetration rolls of 11 or 12 would do no damage.


Example: Let's throw armor into the mix, from High Guard. Add the armor factor (I'll have to chech HG armor factors--it's been a long time since I've looked at them) to the penetration roll. If the total is 13+, then the ship's armor protected the ship, and there's no damage roll.


Example: We can add sand into the mix as well. The -3DM Book 2 gives us for a laser firing into a Sand cloud could also be used on the penetration chart. Sand would be -3DM to hit (the laser beam being refracted and dispersed by the reflective/ablative sand), and a +3DM would be used on the penetration chart.

So, if the Gunner-3 above took three shots at a target protected by a sand cloud, then his DM to hit would be a whopping -5 (-2 for taking three shots, -3 for the sand cloud). And, his DM on the penetration chart would be +5. So, rolls of 8+ on the penetration chart would do no damage.


What do you think of this...?

I kinda like it.

It needs to be tweaked a bit. And, we need to consider missiles. But, I like the germ of the idea.

Thoughts?

 

[Supplement Four]

With regards to the penetration roll thingy above...


RANGE: One thought, with regards to range (what this thread was originally all about), is that a beneficial negative DM be used on the penetration chart (instead of extra attacks) the closer a ship is to it's enemy.


So, the closer a ship is to its enemy, the less effective its defenses will be.

I'm thinking something like:

Close Range: -4DM on Penetration Chart
Short Range: -2DM on Penetration Chart
Medium Range: -1DM on Penetration Chart
Long Range: +0DM on Penetration Chart
Very Long Range: +1DM on Penetration Chart

I'm using the ranges from my sensor rules above (which makes sense, given the sensing capability of a vessel). But, if a CT player is not using my sensor rules, then we could easily just assign some blanke hex-range numbers to each category (something like Close = same hex; Short = 1 hex; Medium = 2-10 hexes; Long = 11-15 hexes; Very Long = 16+ hexes).

 

[Supplement Four]

With regards to the penetration roll thingy above...


RANGE: One thought, with regards to range (what this thread was originally all about), is that a beneficial negative DM be used on the penetration chart (instead of extra attacks) the closer a ship is to it's enemy.


So, the closer a ship is to its enemy, the less effective its defenses will be.

I'm thinking something like:

Close Range: -4DM on Penetration Chart
Short Range: -2DM on Penetration Chart
Medium Range: -1DM on Penetration Chart
Long Range: +0DM on Penetration Chart
Very Long Range: +1DM on Penetration Chart

I'm using the ranges from my sensor rules above (which makes sense, given the sensing capability of a vessel). But, if a CT player is not using my sensor rules, then we could easily just assign some blanke hex-range numbers to each category (something like Close = same hex; Short = 1 hex; Medium = 2-10 hexes; Long = 11-15 hexes; Very Long = 16+ hexes).

 

[Supplement Four]

There's a lot of thoughts popping around here.

So, to clear this up a bit, what I'm brainstorming/babble about is:


THOUGHT 1: That a Penetration roll is required when a hit is made on an enemy vessel. (This also makes it easy to bring in the "armor" rules from High Guard into Book 2 space combat.)


THOUGHT 2: That Range to a target (either based on my sensor rule ranges or some chosen set number of hexes) will make penetration easier (thus making sand, armor, and other defenses less effective at closer range).


THOUGHT 3: That gunners can use thier skill level to govern how many shots they can take in a round. And, if extra shots are made during the space combat round, both the attack throw and penetration roll have a penalty DM assigned to them.

 

[Supplement Four]

There's a lot of thoughts popping around here.

So, to clear this up a bit, what I'm brainstorming/babble about is:


THOUGHT 1: That a Penetration roll is required when a hit is made on an enemy vessel. (This also makes it easy to bring in the "armor" rules from High Guard into Book 2 space combat.)


THOUGHT 2: That Range to a target (either based on my sensor rule ranges or some chosen set number of hexes) will make penetration easier (thus making sand, armor, and other defenses less effective at closer range).


THOUGHT 3: That gunners can use thier skill level to govern how many shots they can take in a round. And, if extra shots are made during the space combat round, both the attack throw and penetration roll have a penalty DM assigned to them.

 

[Supplement Four]

And, here's an idea for the Penetration table: We'll throw in a chance for an extra damage roll to be made if the Penetration table throw is low.

Something like--

</font><blockquote>code:</font><hr /><pre style="font-size:x-small; font-family: monospace;">2 Penetration Extra damage throws = Gunner skill
3 Penetration +1 damage throw
4 Penetration
5 Penetration
6 Penetration
7 Penetration
8 Penetration
9 Penetration
10 Penetration
11 Penetration
12 Penetration
13+ No Penetration</pre>[/QUOTE]DMs to the penetration would be:

</font><blockquote>code:</font><hr /><pre style="font-size:x-small; font-family: monospace;">+3DM Sand
+DM Armor
+/-DM Range
-DM Low-Charge Laser Penalty (Multiple shots)</pre>[/QUOTE]AND I'm thinking that a gunner, IF he only takes one shot in a round with a weapon, can use his SKILL level as a beneficial DM on the penetration table.

So, a Gunner-3 takes a single shot with a laser and hits during the round. His penetration roll is rewarded with a -3DM DM (making it more likely he'll get a 2 or 3 result, giving him more damage opportunities).

In effect, this is the gunner using his skill to "aim" and do more damage to an enemy.

I'm really liking this... thoughts?

 

[Supplement Four]

And, here's an idea for the Penetration table: We'll throw in a chance for an extra damage roll to be made if the Penetration table throw is low.

Something like--

</font><blockquote>code:</font><hr /><pre style="font-size:x-small; font-family: monospace;">2 Penetration Extra damage throws = Gunner skill
3 Penetration +1 damage throw
4 Penetration
5 Penetration
6 Penetration
7 Penetration
8 Penetration
9 Penetration
10 Penetration
11 Penetration
12 Penetration
13+ No Penetration</pre>[/QUOTE]DMs to the penetration would be:

</font><blockquote>code:</font><hr /><pre style="font-size:x-small; font-family: monospace;">+3DM Sand
+DM Armor
+/-DM Range
-DM Low-Charge Laser Penalty (Multiple shots)</pre>[/QUOTE]AND I'm thinking that a gunner, IF he only takes one shot in a round with a weapon, can use his SKILL level as a beneficial DM on the penetration table.

So, a Gunner-3 takes a single shot with a laser and hits during the round. His penetration roll is rewarded with a -3DM DM (making it more likely he'll get a 2 or 3 result, giving him more damage opportunities).

In effect, this is the gunner using his skill to "aim" and do more damage to an enemy.

I'm really liking this... thoughts?

 

[Supplement Four]

Example: Brace has Gunner-2, and he's sitting in a dual beam laser turret. The ship is engaging a target at Long range. Brace makes two attacks (one attack with each beam laser) against the target.

This is a standard Book 2 example. Brace will hit on 8+ (provided no programs or such provide DMs).

One of he beam lasers hit. One doesn't.

For the one that hits, Brace rolls 2D on the penetration chart.

Since he only took one shot with the beam laser, he can use his skill (-2) on the penetration chart. The DM at Long range is +0. And, the target is not protected by sand or armor.

Brace rolls 2D -2 on the penetration chart. If the result is 2 or 3, then Brace will be rewarded with extra damage rolls on the Book 2 starship damage table. Otherwise, the damage is a single roll on the damage table, per normal Book 2 rules.

==================================


Example: Next round, range is decreased to Medium. Brace fires both beam lasers again, singly. Medium range provides a +1DM to hit, but there are no other programs (gunner interact or such) that will provide other DMs.

So, Brace gets two attacks at +1, so he needs 7+ to hit.

Again, one beam laser hits. One doesn't.

Brace will roll on the penetration chart for the laser that hits.

His DMs are: -2DM for his skill; -1DM for Range.

He throws 2D -3 on the penetration chart. A 2 or 3 result will provide extra damage throws. Otherwise, the hit is resolved normally.

================================


Example: Next round, Brace decides to try two attacks with only one of his beam lasers (so, he's getting one beam laser with two attacks, and one with a single attack).

The enemy has managed to put up a sand cloud.

One beam laser will be made with an attack roll of 2D for 8+ (DMs: +1 for range; -3 for sand).

One beam laser will be made with two attack rolls of 2D for 8+ (DMs: +1 for range; -3 for sand; -2 for two low-powered shots).

First attack roll: 2D -2 for 8+.
Second attack roll: 2D -4 for 8+.
Third attack roll: 2D -4 for 8+.

Brace scores two hits: One for the First attck roll, and one on the third.

Penetration roll on the first attack roll is: 2D or 12-. DMs: -1 for Range; +3 for Sand; -2 for Skill. Penetration roll is 2D for 12- (and a result of 2 or 3 provides extra damage rolls on enemy).

Penetration roll for the second attack roll is: 2D for 12-. DMs: -1 for Range; +3 for Sand; +2 for Low-Powered shot. Penetration roll is 2D +4 for 12- (and extra damage results are not possible because a 2 or 3 cannot result).

 

[Supplement Four]

Example: Brace has Gunner-2, and he's sitting in a dual beam laser turret. The ship is engaging a target at Long range. Brace makes two attacks (one attack with each beam laser) against the target.

This is a standard Book 2 example. Brace will hit on 8+ (provided no programs or such provide DMs).

One of he beam lasers hit. One doesn't.

For the one that hits, Brace rolls 2D on the penetration chart.

Since he only took one shot with the beam laser, he can use his skill (-2) on the penetration chart. The DM at Long range is +0. And, the target is not protected by sand or armor.

Brace rolls 2D -2 on the penetration chart. If the result is 2 or 3, then Brace will be rewarded with extra damage rolls on the Book 2 starship damage table. Otherwise, the damage is a single roll on the damage table, per normal Book 2 rules.

==================================


Example: Next round, range is decreased to Medium. Brace fires both beam lasers again, singly. Medium range provides a +1DM to hit, but there are no other programs (gunner interact or such) that will provide other DMs.

So, Brace gets two attacks at +1, so he needs 7+ to hit.

Again, one beam laser hits. One doesn't.

Brace will roll on the penetration chart for the laser that hits.

His DMs are: -2DM for his skill; -1DM for Range.

He throws 2D -3 on the penetration chart. A 2 or 3 result will provide extra damage throws. Otherwise, the hit is resolved normally.

================================


Example: Next round, Brace decides to try two attacks with only one of his beam lasers (so, he's getting one beam laser with two attacks, and one with a single attack).

The enemy has managed to put up a sand cloud.

One beam laser will be made with an attack roll of 2D for 8+ (DMs: +1 for range; -3 for sand).

One beam laser will be made with two attack rolls of 2D for 8+ (DMs: +1 for range; -3 for sand; -2 for two low-powered shots).

First attack roll: 2D -2 for 8+.
Second attack roll: 2D -4 for 8+.
Third attack roll: 2D -4 for 8+.

Brace scores two hits: One for the First attck roll, and one on the third.

Penetration roll on the first attack roll is: 2D or 12-. DMs: -1 for Range; +3 for Sand; -2 for Skill. Penetration roll is 2D for 12- (and a result of 2 or 3 provides extra damage rolls on enemy).

Penetration roll for the second attack roll is: 2D for 12-. DMs: -1 for Range; +3 for Sand; +2 for Low-Powered shot. Penetration roll is 2D +4 for 12- (and extra damage results are not possible because a 2 or 3 cannot result).

 

[Supplement Four]

Let's look at Plankowner's "playin' possum" scenario using this new idea of penetration and gunner-influenced multiple attacks...

Originally posted by Plankowner:
Players are approaching a vessel that sent out a distress call that it's maneuver drive is damaged. During their entire approach, no maneuvering is performed by the target vessel.

Players go ACTIVE on sensors and obtain a sensor lock at LONG range (for them). From the sensor data, the Navigator determines the following information about the Target vessel.

Size: 200 tn
Configuration: A1 Free Trader
1 Turret (unpowered)
Power Plant A operating at normal capacity
Maneuver Drive down
Jump Drive down
Transponder Active with Signal GK

OK, the Player captain decides to approach.
When he gets within 10Kkm, the Target vessel unloads a triple laser turret on the Players.

Who gets initiative? How much warning would the players have? What would you do differently on this approach? If I left out something about the sensor rules, please ask/fill in the data.

Curious minds want to know.

(EDIT: I (WJP) edited this example from "missiles" to "lasers" because we haven't tackled how to handle missiles yet with these rules. Let's look at Plankowner's scenario with a triple laser turret, instead, shall we?)
[/QB][/QUOTE]

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The players are approaching the ship playing possum. I'd say the possum ship has initiative, since the players can do little (and have little time) when the possum ship opens up with it's lasers.


Here's how the scenario would play out with the rules I'm proposing in this thread--

Gunner on the possum ship is Gunner-1.

This means he can take three normal attack throws, or he can fire one, two, or three of the beam lasers twice in the round at a penalty.

I'm assuming the possum ship is not running any program that might add other DMs than what I'm mentioning here (Gunner Interact, for example, is not being used).

The normal attack roll is 8+.

Range DM is +4.

So, the possum gunner can roll:

3 single attacks (one attack per laser) at: 2D +4.

--or--

6 attacks (two attacks per laser) with a -1DM to each attack: 2D +3.

The possum gunner can pick on or the other...or any combination (he can fire one of the lasers once while firing the other two twice).

SOMETHING TO CONSIDER is the effect this will have on the penetration roll.

Penetration throw is 2D for 12-. Result of "2" equals a number of extra damage throws equal to the gunner's skill (in this case, it's one extra throw). Result of "3" equals one extra damage throw. Result of "4-12" means no extra damage throws. And a result of "13+" means no damage applied eventhough the laser hit.

Hits made with a single shot from the laser are thrown for penetration with 2D for 12-, with DMs: -1 for skill; -4 for range.

Hits made with the double low-power shots are made with a penetration roll of 2D for 12-, with DMs: -4 for range; +1 for low power shot.

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Given all this, if I were the possum gunner, I'd fire all three lasers in the double fire mode.

I'd get: 6 attack throws at 2D for 5+.

And, on each hit, my penetration throws would be: 2D -3 for 12-, which makes it fairly likely that I'd get an extra damage throw.


====================================
FOLKS! I THINK THIS WORKS!

That's a hell of a hit to take when you approach a ship ... that THAT'S what we were looking for. We're trying to make space combat more deadly the closer two ships are together.

I like this A LOT.

Thoughts?

 

[Supplement Four]

Let's look at Plankowner's "playin' possum" scenario using this new idea of penetration and gunner-influenced multiple attacks...

Originally posted by Plankowner:
Players are approaching a vessel that sent out a distress call that it's maneuver drive is damaged. During their entire approach, no maneuvering is performed by the target vessel.

Players go ACTIVE on sensors and obtain a sensor lock at LONG range (for them). From the sensor data, the Navigator determines the following information about the Target vessel.

Size: 200 tn
Configuration: A1 Free Trader
1 Turret (unpowered)
Power Plant A operating at normal capacity
Maneuver Drive down
Jump Drive down
Transponder Active with Signal GK

OK, the Player captain decides to approach.
When he gets within 10Kkm, the Target vessel unloads a triple laser turret on the Players.

Who gets initiative? How much warning would the players have? What would you do differently on this approach? If I left out something about the sensor rules, please ask/fill in the data.

Curious minds want to know.

(EDIT: I (WJP) edited this example from "missiles" to "lasers" because we haven't tackled how to handle missiles yet with these rules. Let's look at Plankowner's scenario with a triple laser turret, instead, shall we?)
[/QB][/QUOTE]

----------------------------------

The players are approaching the ship playing possum. I'd say the possum ship has initiative, since the players can do little (and have little time) when the possum ship opens up with it's lasers.


Here's how the scenario would play out with the rules I'm proposing in this thread--

Gunner on the possum ship is Gunner-1.

This means he can take three normal attack throws, or he can fire one, two, or three of the beam lasers twice in the round at a penalty.

I'm assuming the possum ship is not running any program that might add other DMs than what I'm mentioning here (Gunner Interact, for example, is not being used).

The normal attack roll is 8+.

Range DM is +4.

So, the possum gunner can roll:

3 single attacks (one attack per laser) at: 2D +4.

--or--

6 attacks (two attacks per laser) with a -1DM to each attack: 2D +3.

The possum gunner can pick on or the other...or any combination (he can fire one of the lasers once while firing the other two twice).

SOMETHING TO CONSIDER is the effect this will have on the penetration roll.

Penetration throw is 2D for 12-. Result of "2" equals a number of extra damage throws equal to the gunner's skill (in this case, it's one extra throw). Result of "3" equals one extra damage throw. Result of "4-12" means no extra damage throws. And a result of "13+" means no damage applied eventhough the laser hit.

Hits made with a single shot from the laser are thrown for penetration with 2D for 12-, with DMs: -1 for skill; -4 for range.

Hits made with the double low-power shots are made with a penetration roll of 2D for 12-, with DMs: -4 for range; +1 for low power shot.

------------------------

Given all this, if I were the possum gunner, I'd fire all three lasers in the double fire mode.

I'd get: 6 attack throws at 2D for 5+.

And, on each hit, my penetration throws would be: 2D -3 for 12-, which makes it fairly likely that I'd get an extra damage throw.


====================================
FOLKS! I THINK THIS WORKS!

That's a hell of a hit to take when you approach a ship ... that THAT'S what we were looking for. We're trying to make space combat more deadly the closer two ships are together.

I like this A LOT.

Thoughts?