Building a ship from the crew up

[Terquem]

Have any of you ever built a ship (I’m going to try to use Book 5) for a specifically imagined crew size?

I have this idea for a new campaign focused on a Hospital Ship of the Interplanetary Relief Society (scouts) that will have the player characters assume roles among either the ship’s crew or the Field Ambulance assigned to the ship

I need the ship to be able to accommodate a small Battalion (modeled on the WWII, British Airborne Field Ambulance). The IRS Medical Battalion would be a Command HQ of 30, four sections of 20 individuals (80), and a support company of 60, for a total of 170.

The ship should be capable of Jump-2, fuel for two jumps if necessary, Maneuver-1, and have sufficient space for four 50dTon modular cutters (with six modules, including two field hospitals).

How would you decide the optimum dTon size of the ship built around this Battalion?

 

[whartung]

Decided your stateroom density for the mission, the extra supplies and resources needed (you going to have surgery bays, for example? How big are those?), and what ever other things you want to bring along.

That gives you your "minimum tonnage". On a "normal" ship, we'd call that "Cargo" as cargo is the empty space not used for "space ship stuff". In your case, YOU (your mission, your staff, your labs and hospital bays) are the cargo.

Now, you have your drive parameters, and you just need to build out a large enough ship to haul your "cargo" (i.e. you), then staff that up, add engineering, and be on your way.

So, simply, grab a ship builder spread sheet, determine your base dTon requirement, build a ship, set the jump and m drive number, and keep bumping tonnage up until the "Free space" matches you requirements.

Tada...a "custom fit".

So, for you, you need:

170 personnel, I'm going to say 10 officers. I'll be kind and double bunk the rest. So, 10 staterooms + 160 / 2, 80 staterooms. 10 + 80 = 90 staterooms * 4 = 360 tons in staterooms.

200 Dtons for the cutters, 180 Dtons for the modules. There's 380 more. You might be able to lose 30 Dtons and store modules on the cutters, and play 8 puzzle with the rest, but..I wouldn't. Oh, I guess we need to add 10%, so, 420.

Tossing in 50 tons of cargo space for "other". Fuel is net on the whole size.

So, 360 + 420 + 50 = 830.

According to my spreadsheet, you're looking at about 1800 tons.

TL 15 P1 M1 J2 720 tons of jump fuel. 1 Armor, Mod 6 computer, no weapons, or screens. (probably too big, but it's "nothing" anyways). Requires 11 actual ship crew. 831 cargo for you to build out, so you "just fit".

 

[McPerth]

Have any of you ever built a ship (I’m going to try to use Book 5) for a specifically imagined crew size?

I have this idea for a new campaign focused on a Hospital Ship of the Interplanetary Relief Society (scouts) that will have the player characters assume roles among either the ship’s crew or the Field Ambulance assigned to the ship

I need the ship to be able to accommodate a small Battalion (modeled on the WWII, British Airborne Field Ambulance). The IRS Medical Battalion would be a Command HQ of 30, four sections of 20 individuals (80), and a support company of 60, for a total of 170.

The ship should be capable of Jump-2, fuel for two jumps if necessary, Maneuver-1, and have sufficient space for four 50dTon modular cutters (with six modules, including two field hospitals).

How would you decide the optimum dTon size of the ship built around this Battalion?

You might be interested in the discussion following this post and Aramis' suggested solutions in this one and this other one regarding hospital ships...

 

[mike wightman]

Do you have any particular version of the Traveller ship building rules in mind?

 

[Terquem]

Thanks Whartung! those numbers are what I am coming up with also, but I think I might go a bit bigger, maybe settle on a 2000dT hull to start and see where I end up



I'm going with LBB Book 5 (1980 edition)

I think the medical Support ship is a bit too small for the medical staff I am thinking about, but Aramis' design seems to mirror what I was working on today

If I allow 20 senior staff staterooms and then 75 double occupancy staterooms for the medical "field ambulance" I get 380dT for medical staff, which I think for the time being I’ll round up to 400dT

Medical Staff 400dT

Just looking at the USNS Mercy and deriving some ideas from the facilities available on that ship I can come up with (off the top of my head)

o Casualty reception 30dT
o Trauma care 40dt
o Intensive care unit 20dT
o Main laboratory plus satellite lab 20dT
o Central sterile receiving 4dT
o Medical supply/pharmacy 24dT
o Physical therapy and burn care 8dT
o Dental services 4dT
o Optometry/lens lab 4dT
o Morgue 8dT
o Laundry 8dT
o Medical Imaging 8dT
o Surgery 30dT
o Recovery 12dT
o Patient Care Rooms 80dT

Medical facilities 300dT

So this could be my “Cargo” medical battalion and medical services of 700dT

 

[Terquem]

And, by the way, I am of course setting things in MTU, which is not too keen on the use of "low berths" (though they do exist).

I may still allow some space for a few low berths for use in emergencies

 

[dalthor]

Just for kicks, I did some T5 experimentation with building ships from the ground up -- see

http://www.travellerrpg.com/CotI/Discuss/showthread.php?t=32288

It was somewhat generic. I even uploaded a simple PDF version of the basics from that thread.

I had fun with it, but real-world has kept me from a LOT of the T5 stuff I would like to do...

 

[AnotherDilbert]

Presuming TL15 you need something like 2% [bridge] + 3% + 2% + 2% [drives] + 2 × 20% + 2% [fuel] = 51% of the ship for machinery plus a few percent for crew and odd ends, leaving about 45% of the ship for payload.

Add up your desired payload, divide by 0.45 and you have a rough estimate of the needed ship size.

Note that it would be 65% devoted to payload if you only needed fuel for one jump, needing a much smaller and cheaper ship for the same payload.


Also check if a 5000 Dt ship with Z-drives from LBB2 (which are perfectly OK in LBB5) might suit your needs, those standard drives are extremely economical. This would leave about 3500 Dt payload, or 2500 Dt payload with fuel for two jumps.

 

[AnotherDilbert]

GSbAG tenders this somewhat over-specified design:

3000 Dt streamlined hull with one or two permanently attached drop tanks.
Z-drives.
Can operate as:
Two tanks: J2/M2 with fuel for two jumps.
One tank: J3/M3 with fuel for one jump.
No tank: J1/M4 (requires a demountable tank in the cargo hold)

The larger hull enables us to provide generous space for the hard-working crew without the indignities of double bunking.
We have a full 800 Dt for the medical staff.
Another 800 Dt clinical facilities, including some hospitality areas for dependants.
A 500 Dt boat bay with space for e.g. four cutters, additional four modules, and perhaps 10 GCarrier ambulances.
200 Dt storage space.
Two turrets to discourage overzealous pirates.
All this for a mere MCr 1000.

USP (with two tanks)

A smaller ship with cramped quarters can be had for perhaps MCr 800, but we feel that the added space and operational flexibility is worth the small extra cost.

 

[Terquem]

That's a good design, thanks. Though I would remove the turrets (the setting does not require such weapons on a properly marked hospital ship of the IRS - literally no one wants to get on the wrong side of the IRS in this setting).

I didn't even consider GCarriers yet, and this is a good idea

I'll assign two to each of the shuttles which support field hospital modules (two of the four sections of the Battalion)

two will be assigned to the Battalion Command company

Two will be attached directly to the ships crew

and the last two will be kept in reserve (allowing for rotation out of service for repair when necessary).

I'm going to have to think about the drop tank configuration

 

[AnotherDilbert]

If you don't want the players to have too long legs you can just use a 5000 Dt hull with 2000 Dt fuel for 2 jumps. It will be MCr ~100 more expensive, if that matters.

You can keep the fuel for the additional jump in Collapsible tanks in a large cargo hold, giving the players some potential space to play with.

With generous spaces it's easier to make interesting deck plans.

 

[martletsquire]

Don't forget the crew space. You've got a medical unit all figured out with docs, nurses, attendants, cleaning/sterilization troopies, lab geeks, supply guys, admin pukes.

But you left out who runs the ship, and who flies the cutters. You may be able to have the flight crews of the cutters as part of your troop allocation, but ship crew should be separate.

Ship Captain - may or may not be covered by the Chief Surgeon/Chief Medico
Pilot(s)
Nav(s)
Bridge Flunkies
Ch Eng
Engineer Flunkies
Service Crew - non-medical side. Probably can be cut to minimum with assumption that med side will provide service crew, or not.
Cutter Pilots (one can be the senior pilot, or you could add a separate Flight commander depending)
Cutter Crew - non-medical side.

I would also add in a small security unit, maybe 5 to 10, to provide both physical security and an internal reaction force for crazed patients

So, that would be at least 16, maybe up to 30 or more additional personnel to provide quarters for (At least 3 maybe 5 single occupancy, the rest double occupancy.)

Terquem also brought up Patient Care Rooms (at 80t) but I would also add in another 80-160dt for additional patient (single/double/ward?) space and to allow extra 'specialists' or visitors to have bunk rooms. Or for 'Quarantine Rooms' or other fun.


I guess the question I should have asked is does this ship go to the location and treat at the spot (thus ship's crew could be med crew and doesn't need lots of interior space for patient rooms, or it is meant to be a hospital/mash unit/transport ship thus requiring extra space for lots of patients at various levels of care and non-patient extras.

 

[Terquem]

I hope to have my first run at a 4000dT design (LBB5) done today taking in all the ideas presented

Thank you

I'll work out the ship's crew, and final details

This ship does not provide medical long term care, but is a response unit dispatched to crisis situations, usually to supplement larger operations.

The ship will be designed at TL12, with the story being that it is a converted merchant vessel (the IRS, by agreement with the UCoIG and CoIT the two other major players in this setting, does not commission new ships but is only allowed to take ownership of other vessels to fill it's fleet).

I haven't decided on the ship's name but the cutters will be named after famous hospital ships of the past.

 

[whartung]

This ship does not provide medical long term care, but is a response unit dispatched to crisis situations, usually to supplement larger operations.

Well, that's the funny thing, right?

Unless you're cost sensitive, no ship is particularly faster than another, whether big or small.

If you have a "lot" of hot spots, then, sure, several small ships spread thin can work.

But if not, does a smaller ship really make any sense?

I mean, consider what we sent to Haiti after the earthquake. An aircraft carrier, a Hospital Ship, and several Landing Ships filled with Marines.

The first responders were the CVN and Hospital Ship. The CVN is a pretty much "universal ship" with just stupid amounts of capability. Do you make CVNs to respond to crisis? No. But if you have a crisis, may as well send a CVN if you have one handy, not as if it really costs any less than to have it just floating around in the Atlantic running drills.

"Hi, we've brought 5000 bored sailors, a bunch of fixed and rotary aircraft and, oh, a nuclear power plant. How can we help? Would you like some clean water? Brewed it fresh this morning!"

The point being, rather than having a smaller dedicated ship, you can have multi-mission capable ships that can fill that role while having larger, specialized hospital ships and missions.

 

[Terquem]

The IRS does not have many other missions

They primarily provide relief to ships that are stranded, either in the Aetherspace (something in MTU) or too far from fuel to make it to where they need to be because of Aetherslide accidents

They have clandestine missions, not much would be known about these missions to the PCs at the start of the campaign

But, rather than try to explain this campaign and its setting I'll just say that the IRS has a very diverse fleet, made up of ships they can "get their hands on a the bargain basement price"

 

[Terquem]

After betting up this design for a couple of days, this is the one thing I am sure of

Book 2 > Book 5

I sort of had my mind set on Book 5, but the mass requirements for the drives and power plant keep making me squirm.

Going to have to rethink this.

 

[kilemall]

USN hospital ships for comparison-


http://www.navalorder.org/articles/2016/8/28/an-overview-of-hospital-ships

 

[AnotherDilbert]

After betting up this design for a couple of days, this is the one thing I am sure of

Book 2 > Book 5

Using the LBB5 system you have access to the exactly same drives as in LBB2 and a lot more options too. It's only the top few LBB2 drives that are far superior to LBB5 drives.

 

[Terquem]

there is a difference in the tonnage the drives occupy

 

[AnotherDilbert]

? No?

It is possible to include standard drives (at standard prices) from Book 2 if they will otherwise meet the ship's requirements; such drives use fuel as indicated by the formulas in Book 2.

You can use the LBB2 drives in a LBB5 ship.

You can also use LBB5 drives, whatever you think is more advantageous for the ship.


The ship I posted earlier is an example of an LBB5 ship with LBB2 drives.