What the "High Guard Fix" does to canon LBB2 ships

[kilemall]

Solar sail, or solar panel, extensions, and since we're at classic, coated or implanted lanthanum grid.

Volume enclosed with fuel condom, though those extensions that recreational vehicles have could also work.

Pufferfish small craft jump?

 

[Condottiere]

it's hard to be specific, because you don't have many options to leverage.

But if it's a minimum volume, how that's accomplished, caveat being it needs a lanthanum grid, that should cover all the angles.

 

[Condottiere]

I forget, you could cover it with a jumpnet, or just blow up the fuel condom, attach it to the back and cover that with the jump net.

It's just with the slideout option you have more usable space.

 

[atpollard]

Type R. Its drives (Size C) are bigger than they need to be for rating-1, but even then the engine room fits Size D drives (rating-2).

Does the Type R have a bulkhead that separates the ENGINEERING SECTION from the remainder of the ship on the Deckplans? (I don’t remember them well enough).

 

[atpollard]

it's hard to be specific, because you don't have many options to leverage.

But if it's a minimum volume, how that's accomplished, caveat being it needs a lanthanum grid, that should cover all the angles.

Where is the official reference to the “lanthanum grid”?
I know Traders and Gunboats has the cables as part of the jump tug (or whatever they called it) for towing rocks through jump.

 

[atpollard]

Engineering 25

W00T! Engineering with wasted space.

 

[AnotherDilbert]

While I agree in principle, doesn't LBB5 actually represent more "Scout/Military" ships and LBB2 represent more "Civilian" ships ... so that logic should allow UNREFINED FUEL in LBB5 ships (where Fuel Purifiers are available in the rules). The Type S being a LBB2 exception to the Civilian Majority ship paradigm.

They are just two different design (& combat) systems, both can do weapons and both can do staterooms and cargo holds equally well.

If you want a in-game explanation, one is based on off-the-shelf components, the other on custom components.

Both differentiate between ships that can and cannot use unrefined fuel, one by a specified component, the other by Referee fiat.

 

[AnotherDilbert]

Where is the official reference to the “lanthanum grid”?

Library Data:

Lanthanum: A rare earth element, the first of the inner transition metals. Vital to the construction of the inner coils of interstellar jump drive units.

JTAS#24:

Starship hulls contain as an integral part of their structure a network of wiring which maintains the jump field around the ship.

So, no lanthanum grid, but both lanthanum and grid needed...

Also see:

A4, p43:
Zuchai Crystal: These crystals form the raw material for a vital focussing ele- ment in jump drives.

I know Traders and Gunboats has the cables as part of the jump tug (or whatever they called it) for towing rocks through jump.

Not S7, it's in S9.

 

[AnotherDilbert]

Has anyone EVER successfully used FF&S?

Thus the vast number of Fan Designed T5 ships (just like all the Fan Designed Ships for FF&S)

It's possible to use them, it's just fiddly with lots of easy-to-forget obscure components requiring lots of documentation. In effect you need computer support, with a decent program or spreadsheet it's not all that more difficult than CT.

... There is a REASON LBB2 and LBB5 remain popular for designing Starships [Mongoose figured that out].

Agreed, the level of detail is reasonable, therefore usability is good.

 

[kilemall]

Does the Type R have a bulkhead that separates the ENGINEERING SECTION from the remainder of the ship on the Deckplans? (I don’t remember them well enough).

Don’t remember, do remember the mayday plans had the bulkheads.

 

[AnotherDilbert]

Does the Type R have a bulkhead that separates the ENGINEERING SECTION from the remainder of the ship on the Deckplans? (I don’t remember them well enough).

Yes, the drives are clearly separated to the sides of the fuselage, but there is no free (wasted) space in the deckplans.

 

[AnotherDilbert]

W00T! Engineering with wasted space.

Of course. The official Subbie also has that, but doesn't list is specifically.

 

[atpollard]

Of course. The official Subbie also has that, but doesn't list is specifically.

As a practical matter, it is a crazy rule that is hard to justify when SOME of the Bridge tonnage probably NEEDS to be in Engineering and why, exactly, can’t fuel tanks be placed in the unused space? Or a hanger for the Air/raft?

It almost implies that Engineering is radioactive and dangerous … but NOTHING else seems to say that.

 

[Grav_Moped]

Does the Type R have a bulkhead that separates the ENGINEERING SECTION from the remainder of the ship on the Deckplans? (I don’t remember them well enough).

Yes. (Three connected drive bays -- one in each wing root, and connected over the cargo hold tunnel by the power plant in the aft top deck).

 

[atpollard]

It's possible to use them, it's just fiddly with lots of easy-to-forget obscure components requiring lots of documentation. In effect you need computer support, with a decent program or spreadsheet it's not all that more difficult than CT.

… and yet there ARE so very few.

 

[atpollard]

Yes. (Three connected drive bays -- one in each wing root, and connected over the cargo hold tunnel by the power plant in the aft top deck).

I give them Half-credit. They DID separate engineering in an identifiable way, but does that really strike you as a 350 dT / 50 dT Standard 400 Ton Hull division for you to outfit with whatever drives/PP you select to install in the 50 ton exclusive ENGINEERING SECTION?

 

[AnotherDilbert]

As a practical matter, it is a crazy rule that is hard to justify when SOME of the Bridge tonnage probably NEEDS to be in Engineering and why, exactly, can’t fuel tanks be placed in the unused space? Or a hanger for the Air/raft?

It almost implies that Engineering is radioactive and dangerous … but NOTHING else seems to say that.

I have never seen it as more than an artificial limit, to reduce the usability of the cheap hulls.

But Snapshot has (very old) deckplans with Engineering inaccessible, mostly sticking out of the hull. That would support the dangerous idea?

 

[atpollard]

So, no lanthanum grid, but both lanthanum and grid needed...

The grid could be ferrous … making those S9 cables Steel or Crystaliron. (Just WAG speculation).

 

[AnotherDilbert]

I give them Half-credit. They DID separate engineering in an identifiable way, but does that really strike you as a 350 dT / 50 dT Standard 400 Ton Hull division for you to outfit with whatever drives/PP you select to install in the 50 ton exclusive ENGINEERING SECTION?

If we count squares, the power plant section is ~20 Dt and each wing root is about ~15 Dt, for a total of roughly 50 Dt. But it is filled, there is no wasted space.

Over all the Subbie is within shouting distance of correct tonnage, unlike most designs in S7.

 

[AnotherDilbert]

They DID separate engineering in an identifiable way, but does that really strike you as a 350 dT / 50 dT Standard 400 Ton Hull division for you to outfit with whatever drives/PP you select to install in the 50 ton exclusive ENGINEERING SECTION?

It's not that far off. I made a customisable version of the Subbie explicitly on the idea of dividing the hull into sections of 50 Dt each: One drive, one fuel, one bridge/crew, 5 free (here with one section furnished for passengers):

Basically it's a square tube with drive pods to the sides, all covered by a streamlined shell. The fuel is between the streamlined shell and the tube, the dark grey in the cross-sections.

It's reasonably close to 300 Dt + 50 Dt engineering + 50 Dt fuel, and reasonably close to the S7 Subbie.