What the "High Guard Fix" does to canon LBB2 ships

[Grav_Moped]

Basically it's a square tube with drive pods to the sides, all covered by a streamlined shell. The fuel is between the streamlined shell and the tube, the dark grey in the cross-sections.

Which lines up with the idea that "streamlining" is something added to the basic "unstreamlined" hull.

It's a weird concept, but LBB2 is gonna LBB2.

 

[Grav_Moped]

I give them Half-credit. They DID separate engineering in an identifiable way, but does that really strike you as a 350 dT / 50 dT Standard 400 Ton Hull division for you to outfit with whatever drives/PP you select to install in the 50 ton exclusive ENGINEERING SECTION?

Kinda. The Jump and Maneuver Drives go in the nacelles, power plant on top. The Size D drives are just packed in tighter and are thus harder to work on.

 

[atpollard]

Hands down, I agree that the Type R comes a LOT closer than most “Official” designs … and the Type S probably misses by the farthest (Excepting the ship that is double the listed tonnage).

 

[Spinward Flow]

Hands down, I agree that the Type R comes a LOT closer than most “Official” designs … and the Type S probably misses by the farthest (Excepting the ship that is double the listed tonnage).

The Far Trader may have "too many squares" on its deck plans ... but the Type-J Seeker is seriously lacking in excuses for both its deck plans AND its starship construction accounting for tonnage.

Try building a Type-J using LBB2.77 or LBB2.81 or TTB using the specifications in the write up text for the Type-J in LBB S7 and see how far you get.

Spoiler alert: the results are NOT PRETTY ...

 

[Grav_Moped]

Don’t remember, do remember the mayday plans had the bulkheads.

Snapshot.

 

[Condottiere]

Traveller spacecraft design has evolved in different editions.

While I like Fire Fusion Steel, it's more of a metastasis.

 

[AnotherDilbert]

The Far Trader may have "too many squares" on its deck plans ... but the Type-J Seeker is seriously lacking in excuses for both its deck plans AND its starship construction accounting for tonnage.

Yes, the Seeker is two Dt off, and the Far Trader is 12 Dt off after half-hearted conversion from LBB2'77 to LBB2'81.

Even some ships in LBB2'81 are a bit off, it's more or less Traveller tradition...

 

[kilemall]

Snapshot.

Yes right.

 

[kilemall]

Which lines up with the idea that "streamlining" is something added to the basic "unstreamlined" hull.

It's a weird concept, but LBB2 is gonna LBB2.

More like the hull and internals have to conform to the needs of streamlining along with reentry heat handling of one sort of another. Maybe you allow air raft floating up and down for close structure types, but anything at speed especially supersonic up needs it.

 

[AnotherDilbert]

More like the hull and internals have to conform to the needs of streamlining along with reentry heat handling of one sort of another. Maybe you allow air raft floating up and down for close structure types, but anything at speed especially supersonic up needs it.

LBB2 has other ideas:

LBB2'77, p15:
_ _ Atmospheric Streamlining: A starship may be streamlined when constructed, allowing it to enter atmospheres for landings. Such vessels are then not restricted to orbital unloading, and dependence on shuttles for cargo and passenger transfer. Such streamlining costs CR 1,000,000 per 100 tons of hull displacement, and must be included when the ship is constructed. Atmospheric streamlining is an option, and may be added to or deleted from standard designs.

It's a construction time option, nothing major...

 

[atpollard]

It's a construction time option, nothing major...

Which is actually a crazy thought. Imagine deciding at the last minute ...

Customer: "You know what, I'd like my '57 Chevy Replicar to be capable of Hypersonic Speeds."
Mechanic: "No problem, We'll just order a bolt on kit and add it to your bill."

(Only the reality is worse ... you want the Apollo LM to be able to LAND on Earth with a "nothing major" modification!)
LBB5 came closer on that one ... some ships CAN BE streamlined and some ships CANNOT BE streamlined.

 

[infojunky]

Even some ships in LBB2'81 are a bit off, it's more or less Traveller tradition...

yep, then add in all the one off bites mentioned in published designs.

 

[mike wightman]

it's hard to be specific, because you don't have many options to leverage.

But if it's a minimum volume, how that's accomplished, caveat being it needs a lanthanum grid, that should cover all the angles.

There is only a lanthanum hull grid in MegaTraveller, no other edition mentions a lanthanum hull grid. Classic Traveller, Mongoose Traveller and other editions mention a network of cabling within the hull to maintain the jump field, but they also specifically state that lanthanum is used in the inner drive coils inside the jump engine itself.

Lanthanum: A rare earth element, the first of the inner transition metals. Vital
to the construction of the inner coils of interstellar jump drive units

 

[mike wightman]

Where is the official reference to the “lanthanum grid”?
I know Traders and Gunboats has the cables as part of the jump tug (or whatever they called it) for towing rocks through jump.

It is in MegaTraveller, and only MegaaTraveller. In ever other edition the hull cabling is not materially defines but the lanthanum is defined as being used inside the jump engine to make drive coils.

 

[AnotherDilbert]

Which is actually a crazy thought. Imagine deciding at the last minute ...

Customer: "You know what, I'd like my '57 Chevy Replicar to be capable of Hypersonic Speeds."
Mechanic: "No problem, We'll just order a bolt on kit and add it to your bill."

(Only the reality is worse ... you want the Apollo LM to be able to LAND on Earth with a "nothing major" modification!)
LBB5 came closer on that one ... some ships CAN BE streamlined and some ships CANNOT BE streamlined.

It could be interpreted as a bit of cowling to make sure nothing falls off the hull at moderate speed, more like the hood to cover the engine bay and a spoiler to generate downforce on a car.

Since we have powered descents in Traveller we don't have to enter the atmosphere at orbital speeds like the shuttle, we can enter the atmosphere a bit more gently (like current reusable rockets?).

 

[mike wightman]

We have yet to see Space X recover an orbital speed component - the first stage and recoverable fairings never get close to orbital velocity. We will find out soon enough if Starship can actually fly to orbit and back again (although the descent is more falling with style than flying).

 

[atpollard]

although the descent is more falling with style than flying

... I love it!

 

[mike wightman]

Has anyone ever built LBB2 ships by welding together standard hulls?

For example, instead of building a 400t ship using a 400t standard or custom hull, build it using four standard 100t hulls, or two 100t hulls and a 200t hull.

 

[AnotherDilbert]

Not for new built ships, but there is always salvage, like the Covenanter-class.

 

[Condottiere]

The idea of welding together hulls has popped up from time to time.

Canonically, it's not mentioned as an option in High Guard.