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FFW (CT/MT): Zhodani equivalent to the Hind-D concept?

MT RG? You mean Referee's Manual?

Ah, yes, typo, should have read "RM", oops :rolleyes:

1 Dton = 13.5 m³.

Yep, follow that :)

60 m³ / 13.5 m³ = 4.444 Dton.

Yep, follow that as well :)

4.444 Dton × 2 squares/Dton ≈ 9 squares.

Rounded up, yep, follow :)

3 m deck height is good for ships where people live, but too high for small craft and vehicles where people sit for awhile. Making a small craft less than 3 m high has the added bonus of making it fit on a single deck on a starship with 3 m deck height.

Possibly, but I'd say this craft is likely about the same height off the ground, on its skids, as a Hind-D. Having looked over the diagram you linked to of the Hind-D earlier, I note that the crew compartment is shorter than the 3m standard deckplan height. This said, most hanger decks are a fair bit taller than 3m ;)

Zhodani tend to be a little taller than the average Imperial Human; even so, it's a valid observation regarding the crew compartment height issue..

You don't have to use 3 m deck height, it's just good for humans and makes deck plans easy with 2 squares/Dton. E.g. K'kree ships presumably require higher ceilings.

True. Without making everyone walk like crabs for the rest of time, I'm going to arbitrarily set the internal height of the crew deck at 2m, with the next 2m-worth of deck split above and/or below it being inaccessible machinery, plant and drive spaces.

Now I gotta figure out how many squares of deckplan I've got to play with. I always did hate maths (Mental Abuse To HumanS :rant: ), it always finds a way to give me explosive headaches :( !

TERRA/SOL (0207-A867A69-F) ... Date UNKNOWN ERROR

¶ A non-nuclear massive explosion event was witnessed this evening.

¶ A bright flash, followed by an incredibly loud double bang, was detected some ten miles south of London, the Capital of England.

¶ No damage or injuries have been detected at this time. Enquiries by police and first responders continue.

𝛀

:rofl:
 
No, sorry, I STILL can't figure this out. I CANNOT figure out how to draw a 2m2 seat on the plans that masses 0.02 tons. It just gets all tied up in my head. :rant:

I should also note that again that I have NEVER done well in maths. Words, yes, I'm rather good - better than average, apparently - but numbers? They make my head hurt. Seriously. So, if someone can help me reconcile this drawing conceptualisation failure that I have, I'd appreciate it. Failing that, I'll have to admit defeat (again, dammit), and go back to a more straightforward shipbuilding system with less flexibility, that being CT book 5.
 
3772-22ed4ff7-medium.jpg
 
I CANNOT figure out how to draw a 2m2 seat on the plans that masses 0.02 tons.

Mass is irrelevant to deck plans. You only have to worry about volume. Divide volume by chosen deck height to get floor area, which is the only thing you have to worry about when drawing 2D deck plans. Each square is 1.5 m × 1.5 m = 2.25 m².

Assuming 2 m deck height:
• The entire craft is 20 Dt = 270 m³.
• Crew compartment is 8 m³, divide by 2 m deck height to get 4 m² floor area, ~2 squares.
• Passenger/cargo compartment is 69 m³, so 34.5 m² floor area, divide by 2.25 to get ~15 squares.
• Airlock is is 3 m³, so 1.5 m² floor area, round up to get ~1 square.
• Engineering (drive, power) is 117 m³, so 58.5 m² floor area, but inaccessible, so hidden?
• Weapons & magazines are 32 m³.
• The rest, 41 m³, is distributed equipment and fuel, that we can fill into nooks and crannies.


If we arrange it somewhat like a Hind, we get:
4hlH4Uu.png

The gunner sits in front, atop the chin laser turret.
The pilot sits behind, elevated.
The gunner and pilot has crawl access to each other and the airlock.
The passenger/cargo compartment fills the centre of the craft.
Avionics, sensors, computers, and controls mostly fills out the nose cone.
Power and drives atop and behind the passenger compartment.
 
If we reduce the number of troops carried to say, 16 (a section, not a platoon), and increase the cargo, Two or more grav bikes could also be carried for the section recce guys (and also for pully-hauly type tasks). Further, if as a result of reducing the troops, we could reduce the width to two squares maximum (thus further plagiarising the Hind outline ;) ). Plausible/Possible?
 
Also - fiddling with Shipyard 1.3 just now, I get a 35-ton design as follows, with ONE fusion gun, and a larger and much less capable craft...

Code:
Ship: ZN Number
Class: Merihem-C
Type: Assalt gig
Architect: Roger Stenning
Tech Level: 14

USP
         GS-0104621-100000-05000-0 MCr 30.608 35 Tons
Bat Bear                    1      Crew: 1
Bat                         1      TL: 14

Cargo: 2.250 Crew Sections: 1 of 1 Fuel: 1 EP: 2.100 Agility: 0
Fuel Treatment: Fuel Scoops and On Board Fuel Purification

Architects Fee: MCr 0.306   Cost in Quantity: MCr 24.486


Detailed Description
  (High Guard Design)

HULL
35.000 tons standard, 490.000 cubic meters, Needle/Wedge Configuration

CREW
1 Officer

ENGINEERING
Jump-0, 4G Manuever, Power plant-6, 2.100 EP, Agility 0

AVIONICS
Bridge, Model/2 Computer

HARDPOINTS
1 Hardpoint

ARMAMENT
1 Dual Mixed Turret with: 1 Fusion Gun (Factor-5).

DEFENCES
Armoured Hull (Factor-1)

CRAFT
None

FUEL
0.075 Tons Fuel (0 parsecs jump and 1 days endurance)
On Board Fuel Scoops, On Board Fuel Purification Plant

MISCELLANEOUS
17 Acceleration Couches, 2.250 Tons Cargo

USER DEFINED COMPONENTS
None

COST
MCr 30.914 Singly (incl. Architects fees of MCr 0.306), MCr 24.486 in Quantity

CONSTRUCTION TIME
18 Weeks Singly, 14 Weeks in Quantity

COMMENTS



Merihem-C Class Assalt gig

Book 5 Crew Breakdown
Command section: 1 officer;
Engineering section: 0 officers and 0 ratings;
Service section: 0 officers and 0 ratings;
Medical Section: 0 officers and 0 ratings
HULL
Hull: 0.000 Td; MCr 4.200
Armour Factor-1: 0.700 Td; MCr 0.280

ENGINEERING
M-Drive Factor-4: 3.850 Td; MCr 1.925
J-Drive Factor-0: 0.000 Td; MCr 0.000
P-Plant Factor-6: 4.200 Td; MCr 12.600; +2.100 EP

FUEL
P-Fuel: 1.000 Td; MCr 0,000
J-Fuel: 0.000 Td; MCr 0.000
Scoops: 0.000 Td; MCr 0.000
Purification: 4.000 Td; MCr 0.028
L-Hyd Drop Tanks: 0.000 Td; MCr 0.000

AVIONICS
Bridge: 7.000 Td; MCr 0.175
Computer Model/2: 2.000 Td; MCr 9.000; -0 EP

WEAPONRY
1 x Mixed Turrets: 2.000 Td; MCr 2.000

SCREENS

CRAFT

ACCOMODATIONS
16 x Couches: 8.000 Td; MCr 0.400
Cargo: 2.250 Td; MCr 0.000

USER DEFINED
 
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Specific response on the Mental Abuse To HumanS (MATHS) aspect, and diagrams...

Mass is irrelevant to deck plans. You only have to worry about volume. Divide volume by chosen deck height to get floor area, which is the only thing you have to worry about when drawing 2D deck plans. Each square is 1.5 m × 1.5 m = 2.25 m².

See, this is why plain English is required in rules sets. If it had explained it like this, I WOULD have gotten (to use an Americanism) it the first time around! Thanks :D

Assuming 2 m deck height:
• The entire craft is 20 Dt = 270 m³.
• Crew compartment is 8 m³, divide by 2 m deck height to get 4 m² floor area, ~2 squares.
• Passenger/cargo compartment is 69 m³, so 34.5 m² floor area, divide by 2.25 to get ~15 squares.
• Airlock is is 3 m³, so 1.5 m² floor area, round up to get ~1 square.
• Engineering (drive, power) is 117 m³, so 58.5 m² floor area, but inaccessible, so hidden?
• Weapons & magazines are 32 m³.
• The rest, 41 m³, is distributed equipment and fuel, that we can fill into nooks and crannies.

Yes, makes sense, and yes to the engineering bits being inaccessible except on the ground or in a hanger (like, indeed, the Hind!)

If we arrange it somewhat like a Hind, we get:
4hlH4Uu.png

The gunner sits in front, atop the chin laser turret.
The pilot sits behind, elevated.
The gunner and pilot has crawl access to each other and the airlock.
The passenger/cargo compartment fills the centre of the craft.
Avionics, sensors, computers, and controls mostly fills out the nose cone.
Power and drives atop and behind the passenger compartment.

If we stick the airlock below the pilot, he can get to the cockpit seat via a hatch in the cockpit floor/airlock ceiling (seat move back on runners for access/egress); the same with the gunner to his rear (seat back flops back for access/egress). Doing this with the airlock also removes the problem of a wide cockpit assembly neck to one side of the Gig.

Option: Move the airlock fully into the cargo space, give the pilot and gunner crawl access directly into the cargo compartment, add some of the gubbins (magazine and whatnot) under the cockpit area, that simplified the layout aspect while retaining the overall concept of shape.

It's getting there, thanks :D
 
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If we reduce the number of troops carried to say, 16 (a section, not a platoon), and increase the cargo, Two or more grav bikes could also be carried for the section recce guys (and also for pully-hauly type tasks). Further, if as a result of reducing the troops, we could reduce the width to two squares maximum (thus further plagiarising the Hind outline ;) ). Plausible/Possible?

Certainly, just make the passenger/cargo compartment, say, 2 × 8 squares instead. The craft becomes narrower and longer.

We have full life support included, so water, plumbing, etc. We could easily include a fresher and snack bar in a nook to increase mission duration and comfort.
 
Certainly, just make the passenger/cargo compartment, say, 2 × 8 squares instead. The craft becomes narrower and longer.

We have full life support included, so water, plumbing, etc. We could easily include a fresher and snack bar in a nook to increase mission duration and comfort.

Chuckle I have yet to see any troop transport (aside from a 4-ton truck and a Landie!) that didn't have, at the very least, a Boiling Vessel to make a hot drink! By all means, a coffee station or similar could work (just remember to stick gimbaled cup holders in the cockpit and gunnery areas!). As to the fresher, the Herkybird has really primitive "facilities" (see http://airlinepilotguy.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/04/Restroom_on_a_C-130_Aircraft.pdf). One can only hope the Zhodani are more forgiving of their people, and install a better facility on their craft! :rofl:
 
Updated blurb for this craft:

Jane's Combat Ships of the Zhodani Consulate said:
Early on in the 5th Frontier War, it was clear that the Zhodani had something in the armoury that was allowing their forces to pacify invaded planets more quickly than had been theorised in pre-war estimates.

One channel of thought was that a new class of weapon was the cause, but of the few troops that escaped, most were adamant: A new class of assault boat was the cause.

The Imperial Interstellar Scout Service, in its war role as military scouts, had managed to take a number of images of these craft shortly thereafter, and it was determined that it was an unknown form of Strike Gig, with unusually wide armament and cargo/lift capabilities.

Initially identified by the Imperial Navy Reporting Name "Merihem" (from the old Earth mythological Merihem, the 'Purveyor of Pestilence'), Imperial Troops came to know it by another name altogether: The "Skyvan", after a popular Naasirka (Spinward Marches) model of low-cost light grav transport with a vaguely similar side-on aspect.

The Zhodani 'Skyvan' (their name for it: Zhotpinzh, which translates, oddly enough, and in an interstellar coincidence, to 'Skytruck') however, boasts a trainable triple chin turret and several in-atmosphere turreted fusion canons, and the ability to carry up to thirty battle-armoured troops and light cargo, all at the same time, without major refitting between roles.

When images of the craft appeared in Solomani-controlled space, military historians made the connection between the Merihem and an old-Earth combat aircraft known as the Hind-D, a turbine powered assault helicopter used first by a nation known as the "Soviet Union".

There are currently five version of the Merihem assault gig.

  • Two man crew, 10 passengers or 5 Dton cargo, heavy armour, One turret, 1.5 Dton free for other armaments.
  • Two man crew, 25 passengers, 12.5 Dton cargo, heavy armour, One turret with a fusion gun, 2.5 Dton free for other armaments.
  • Two man crew, 25 passengers, 6 m3 cargo, one space turret and Five in-atmosphere gun turrets (Heavy Fusion, 2 Pulse Fusion, 2 Pulse Laser PD).
  • Two man crew, 30 passengers, 9 m3 cargo, One space turret (PD capable), Four gun turrets (4 High RoF Pulse Fusion point defence capable).
  • This is the export version sold by the Zhodani to their client states, which is a slower (subsonic) version of the Merihem-B, with increased cargo capacity; Two man crew, 60 passengers, 15 m3 cargo, heavy armour, One space turret (PD capable), Four gun turrets (4 High RoF Pulse Fusion point defence capable).

In border systems, up to J-6 from the Zhodani/Third Imperium border, Zhodani forces now (since shortly before the FFW) exclusively utilise the Merihem-D. Older models can still be found in Zhodani use closer to the Core of the Consulate, but it is expected that these will be phased out of the combat role by 1115, or re-roled as First Responder vehicles (they are ideally suited to be de-armed, and repurposed to the air ambulance role, for example).
 
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...or rather, I would be using CC, if the
censored2.gif
thing hadn't just killed itself with some kind of corruption, dammit
yikes.gif


Time to see if the budget will allow the procurement of the full, fresh CC3+ with the Cosmographer 3 add-on, rather than the upgrade, which I'm sure has
censored.gif
this copy (remember, non-standard installation due to Linux/Wine).

I may have to wait a few weeks. Bills over the next fortnight. Mutter mutter wibble #beinganadultsucksattimes :rant:
 
Well, I managed to waste an entire day fixing my CC2 installation, brought it back up to CC3, added Cosmographer 3, and you guessed it, I still can't get it to provide the basic traveller symbol set that it came with. :nonono:

So, back to old school deckplanning. Fireworks MX.

I may have something workable this time next century :rant:
 
Right, ditched the idea of using Fireworks, went back to an old standby, Floorplan Plus 3D, an old Windows 3 program, which runs well enough under Linux/Wine. Dumped the output into PSP, and voila, I give you the latest version of the Merihem-C.

Notes:

  • This is a VERY rough diagram of the Merihem-C version. The very final version will be a darn sight tidier; this is, after all, a WIP (Work In Progress) ;)
  • both headroom inside the gig troop deck, and the increased number of troop seats ;)
  • Access to cockpit and gunners chairs via rather thin crawlways into the common airlock via iris valves.
  • Access from troop deck to outside via either the airlock, or sealed sliding doors, which can only open when pressure is equalised with the outside of the gig; likewise the seal door at the back leads to a loading ramp, which again can only be opened when pressure is equalised with the outside of the gig.

Merihem-c_strike_gig.png


Updated blurb for this craft:

Jane's Combat Ships of the Zhodani Consulate said:
Early on in the 5th Frontier War, it was clear that the Zhodani had something in the armoury that was allowing their forces to pacify invaded planets more quickly than had been theorised in pre-war estimates.

One channel of thought was that a new class of weapon was the cause, but of the few troops that escaped, most were adamant: A new class of assault boat was the cause.

The Imperial Interstellar Scout Service, in its war role as military scouts, had managed to take a number of images of these craft shortly thereafter, and it was determined that it was an unknown form of Strike Gig, with unusually wide armament and cargo/lift capabilities.

Initially identified by the Imperial Navy Reporting Name "Merihem" (from the old Earth mythological Merihem, the 'Purveyor of Pestilence'), Imperial Troops came to know it by another name altogether: The "Skyvan", after a popular Naasirka (Spinward Marches) model of low-cost light grav transport with a vaguely similar side-on aspect.

The Zhodani 'Skyvan' (their name for it: Zhotpinzh, which translates, oddly enough, and in an interstellar coincidence, to 'Skytruck') however, boasts a trainable triple chin turret and several in-atmosphere turreted fusion canons, and the ability to carry up to thirty battle-armoured troops and light cargo, all at the same time, without major refitting between roles.

The design philosophy behind it was a requirement for an armoured grav-engine equipped small assault craft, capable of swift interface from orbit to ground in most non-insidious atmospheres, and able to work with friendly ground forces to dominate and/or suppress the armoured battlefield in small flights (four or five Zhotpinzh craft in a flight), carrying anything from a fire team to a full platoon of armoured troops at the same time, with their standard equipment as cargo.

It also had to be capable of hauling limited but ungainly cargo via underslung loading (cargo hooks are located on the underside of the craft), such as battlefield artillery, ground-launched missile launchers, fuel bottle cartridge packs, and other large supply items.

Engines, power plant, and most electronics, would be located either on the top of the craft, which is less vulnerable to ground fire from the front, or in the nose, adding to the flight crews protection.

The main weapon of the craft, a single ships laser canon, is mounted in a chin turret, and directed by a helmet-mounted system in the front of the craft, by a gunner, who also has overall control of the other craft weapon systems, four individually-mounted infantry-level fusion guns in their vehicle-mounted role.

The Triple turret is the primary weapon system, intended for use against small craft, armoured vehicles such as grav tanks, APCs, SP Artillery/Ortillery, and similar; the fusion canons, all rapid fire versions, are for both infantry suppression and anti-air artillery/missile attacks. The turret also mounts a sandcaster, mostly for defence against laser weaponry in micro-gravity environments, but also of use close up in the anti-personnel target role, and less so against ground-based laser weaponry.

Refuelling follows the now-standard Zhodani small craft method: An eight-litre bottle 'cartridge' of H2, which is changes from within the craft, in the troop/cargo deck area (open a hatch, twist to unlock, drop old cartridge, insert new, twist to lock, close hatch).

Crew access is either by opening cockpit 'windows' (Gunner to port, Pilot to left), or via pressurised access from the airlock via admittedly tight crawl ways, with cockpit seat backs folding down to the rear to permit the crew to gain their seats.

Troops gain access either through the airlock, or via +3 Atmosphere over-pressure-rated sealable troop doors port, starboard, and aft. The cockpits are rated the same as the troop/cargo deck, at +3 Atmosphere over pressure; in the normal course of events, the craft is kept to +5% overpressue, in case a compromised pressure seal in an NBC environment.

When images of the craft appeared in Solomani-controlled space, military historians made the connection between the Merihem and an old-Earth combat aircraft known as the Hind-D, a turbine powered assault helicopter used first by a nation known as the "Soviet Union".

There are currently five version of the Merihem assault gig.

  • Two man crew, 10 passengers or 5 Dton cargo, heavy armour, One turret, 1.5 Dton free for other armaments.
  • Two man crew, 25 passengers, 12.5 Dton cargo, heavy armour, One turret with a fusion gun, 2.5 Dton free for other armaments.
  • Two man crew, 25 passengers, 6 m3 cargo, one space turret and Five in-atmosphere gun turrets (Heavy Fusion, 2 Pulse Fusion, 2 Pulse Laser PD).
  • Two man crew, 30 passengers, 9 m3 cargo, One space turret (PD capable), Four gun turrets (4 High RoF Pulse Fusion point defence capable).
  • This is the export version sold by the Zhodani to their client states, which is a slower (subsonic) version of the Merihem-B, with increased cargo capacity; Two man crew, 60 passengers, 15 m3 cargo, heavy armour, One space turret (PD capable), Four gun turrets (4 High RoF Pulse Fusion point defence capable).

In border systems, up to J-6 from the Zhodani/Third Imperium border, Zhodani forces now (since shortly before the FFW) exclusively utilise the Merihem-D. Older models can still be found in Zhodani use closer to the Core of the Consulate, but it is expected that these will be phased out of the combat role by 1115, or re-roled as First Responder vehicles (they are ideally suited to be de-armed, and repurposed to the air ambulance role, for example).

Corrections / critique appreciated :)
 
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You could afford another two squares in the passenger cargo compartment. Passenger + Cargo + Airlock is 60 + 9 + 3 = 72 m³; 72 m³ / 1.875 m = 38.4 m² ≈ 17 squares.


I would remove the extra square between the pilot and the airlock? Or is that too stocky?


If you want a chin turret below the gunner I would raise the gunner (and hence pilot) a bit; for ease of access you probably want the passenger/cargo compartment close to the ground.
 
You could afford another two squares in the passenger cargo compartment. Passenger + Cargo + Airlock is 60 + 9 + 3 = 72 m³; 72 m³ / 1.875 m = 38.4 m² ≈ 17 squares.

I was including the ramp area, but yeah, makes sense. I'll make the ramp itself a pressure-bearing door, much like a herkybird.

I would remove the extra square between the pilot and the airlock? Or is that too stocky?

A bit; also, I was sticking all the avionics and life support (such as it is) in there!

If you want a chin turret below the gunner I would raise the gunner (and hence pilot) a bit; for ease of access you probably want the passenger/cargo compartment close to the ground.

Hmm. Good point; looking at photos of the Hind-D, it does have a bit of a flat base, aside from the actual gun mounting on the chin. I'll give that another try :)

Results in the next hour or two tops (I'm on furlough, gotta find SOMETHING to do, aside from crawling the walls ;) )
 
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