Yes, yes, I can see the prices for new drives and computers and such in the books. But how much do you think it should cost for ordinary starship remodeling? I've got a PC crew who want to move around the thin partition walls in their starship, creating more circulation space. They also want to: remove all the walls for one room and create an open bar area; move a fresher down a hallway; close off an airlock; and so on. I don't remember much about how much cosmetic changes cost in any of the books, in any edition. It's just never come up. What do the boards think?
Starship Remodeling
- Thread starter AlHazred
- Start date
Icosahedron
SOC-14 1K
If you don't want that much maths, Take the price of accommodation for a common design ship to be Cr100k per ton, figure the tonnage your works affect and go with, say, 10% to 30% depending whether the work is 'tweaks', 'changes' or 'upheavals'.
Or insert your own figures as you feel appropriate.
Or insert your own figures as you feel appropriate.
Darley51
SOC-9
Here's a little thought experiment for you:
The International Building Code makes a table for estimating costs for new construction (actually it's to calculate an appropriate building permit/plans review fee to cover costs associated with new development, but that's irrelevant to what I'm positing for you).
ANYWAY.... the chart lists cost per SQUARE FOOT based on the occupancy use (Assembly, Business, Factory, Hazardous, Residential, Etc) and building type (non-combustible/protected steel; unprotected non-combustible; ordinary (concrete/masonry); heavy timber; wood frame) - this is extremely simplified... I know nothing about ship construction (or how to relate the IBC to it), but this is an okay place to start.
I suggest the following:
1) Upgrade to square meters (let's be simple, so multiply by 10 and call it even)
2) Use Type I, H4 (the ship carries hazardous cargo in a hazardous environment.... ) - but you could use any of the sets for something (R3 for repair/modification of a stateroom, Assembly type for the bar/crew lounge etc... whatever fits logically into what you are doing (consider the ship a multi-use occupancy... but for ease of use H4 is what I use).
3) Add the standard Naval Architect Fees to draw up the plans, apply for the permit, have the plans reviewed and approved, and any necessary inspections before completion/final approval of the project... anywhere from 1 - 10%
REMEMBER: the shipfitters union at the shipyard won't work on your vessel without approved, permitted plans... shipboard (starport/military) inspectors will also examine any and all work done to maintain space worthiness, etc - and of course your remodelling plans and permit become a permanent part of the ship (for future spot inspections) - what do you think the military looks at when doing a board and inspect op?
Oh, and don't forget... your next stop in port to repair battle damage? Any concealed spaces (DM to find?), field repairs, installations, or modifications can be inspected and evaluated for code compliance (and perhaps a correction notice and fine to require upgrades?)
You don't need to use the bureaucracy part of this suggestion, but it can be used for additional flavor/realism/adventure/etc.
What do you think?
The International Building Code makes a table for estimating costs for new construction (actually it's to calculate an appropriate building permit/plans review fee to cover costs associated with new development, but that's irrelevant to what I'm positing for you).
ANYWAY.... the chart lists cost per SQUARE FOOT based on the occupancy use (Assembly, Business, Factory, Hazardous, Residential, Etc) and building type (non-combustible/protected steel; unprotected non-combustible; ordinary (concrete/masonry); heavy timber; wood frame) - this is extremely simplified... I know nothing about ship construction (or how to relate the IBC to it), but this is an okay place to start.
I suggest the following:
1) Upgrade to square meters (let's be simple, so multiply by 10 and call it even)
2) Use Type I, H4 (the ship carries hazardous cargo in a hazardous environment.... ) - but you could use any of the sets for something (R3 for repair/modification of a stateroom, Assembly type for the bar/crew lounge etc... whatever fits logically into what you are doing (consider the ship a multi-use occupancy... but for ease of use H4 is what I use).
3) Add the standard Naval Architect Fees to draw up the plans, apply for the permit, have the plans reviewed and approved, and any necessary inspections before completion/final approval of the project... anywhere from 1 - 10%
REMEMBER: the shipfitters union at the shipyard won't work on your vessel without approved, permitted plans... shipboard (starport/military) inspectors will also examine any and all work done to maintain space worthiness, etc - and of course your remodelling plans and permit become a permanent part of the ship (for future spot inspections) - what do you think the military looks at when doing a board and inspect op?
Oh, and don't forget... your next stop in port to repair battle damage? Any concealed spaces (DM to find?), field repairs, installations, or modifications can be inspected and evaluated for code compliance (and perhaps a correction notice and fine to require upgrades?)
You don't need to use the bureaucracy part of this suggestion, but it can be used for additional flavor/realism/adventure/etc.
What do you think?
Darley51
SOC-9
Oh, and as a matter of clarification... it is never as simple as just moving a wall... there are pipes, circuits, sensors, and other pieces of essential ship function that have to be re-routed (and the cost of new materials and disposal fees for the old, hazmat processing fees - we're GREEN in the future, don't you know >wink<
So if your players object to the exorbitant cost of construction... you get credit for being realistic!
So if your players object to the exorbitant cost of construction... you get credit for being realistic!
Hi
Hi,
That's useful stuff, and I think its important to point out that post construction changes are likely to be much more expensive than the cost of initial construction, since there are the costs of ripping stuff out, clean up (as you note), rerouting (as you also note), and the costs of any new materials probably won't be as cheap as when originally purchase since you won't be getting any large quantity discounts or anything, as well as the fact that its probably harder to fit everything together (and hence more expensive) when putting a new piece in an existing structure.
Somewhere I have some info on modern ocean going ship construction and it notes that fitting up stuff in a construction shed early in assembly is much less expensive than fitting stuff together once the ship is at the waterfront, with most of its structure and other equipment in place. I'd expect that refitting a spaceship might be in some ways similar.
Regards
PF
Hi,
That's useful stuff, and I think its important to point out that post construction changes are likely to be much more expensive than the cost of initial construction, since there are the costs of ripping stuff out, clean up (as you note), rerouting (as you also note), and the costs of any new materials probably won't be as cheap as when originally purchase since you won't be getting any large quantity discounts or anything, as well as the fact that its probably harder to fit everything together (and hence more expensive) when putting a new piece in an existing structure.
Somewhere I have some info on modern ocean going ship construction and it notes that fitting up stuff in a construction shed early in assembly is much less expensive than fitting stuff together once the ship is at the waterfront, with most of its structure and other equipment in place. I'd expect that refitting a spaceship might be in some ways similar.
Regards
PF
By the way, did I mention that there is a conduit grid at 0.5 meter IMTU?
Off grid walls cost extra. And I don't allow bulkhead moves without a rebuild. Rebuilds cost about 10% of the hull's (not the total ship's) cost but allow moving the bulkheads around.
Off grid walls cost extra. And I don't allow bulkhead moves without a rebuild. Rebuilds cost about 10% of the hull's (not the total ship's) cost but allow moving the bulkheads around.
