The Reserve, Reserves, and Reservists of the IN
- Thread starter RainOfSteel
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mike wightman
SOC-14 10K
That's why he says please 
Some other thoughts.
All of the squadrons within a subsector - or Duchy to use a better term within the Imperium - are effectively under the control of the sector Duke and could, therefore, be considered to be a Ducal Navy, until such a time as the sector level administration - sector Admiral acting under the authority of the sector Duke - redeploys the regular Navy squadrons to other Naval bases.
Reserve fleet/Colonial squadrons would still remain, until a sector wide emergency has them Imperialized.
Some other thoughts.
All of the squadrons within a subsector - or Duchy to use a better term within the Imperium - are effectively under the control of the sector Duke and could, therefore, be considered to be a Ducal Navy, until such a time as the sector level administration - sector Admiral acting under the authority of the sector Duke - redeploys the regular Navy squadrons to other Naval bases.
Reserve fleet/Colonial squadrons would still remain, until a sector wide emergency has them Imperialized.
BetterThanLife
SOC-14 1K
Actually if the Marquis has a Piracy problem he would be better served if he went through channels as opposed to tasking the Task Force directly. Now if it was more like;
"Help Stop that Corsair before it Jumps, my son is a hostage on board!" Now for that he goes directly to the Task Force Commander.
Of course if it is a Colonial unit belonging to that planet then the going through channels is a different matter and it depends on the Planetary government type as to how much control the Imperial Nobility have in Local Politics.
I have been thinking about this topic a bit now. ( BTW: Thanks for getting my mind working all.
)
Rereading some of the stuff I have on Traveller Nobility, I am more convinced that Traveller Nobility has actually little to do with the Imperial Navy. Matter of fact, except for the power associated with wealth, they don't appear to have all that much power in the first place.
They are sort of the go betweens between the Imperial Government and the local Government. Not even close to Colonial Govoners, Captain-Generals, etc. They are associated with planets, subsectors, sectors and domains but they don't rule those. The Planets are self governing, (for the most part) and the Imperium controls Trade (usually by makeing sure it freely flows) and general defense of the realm. The Nobility, since they don't really rule anything and since this isn't a truly feudal society, would have no reason to be able to just whistle up a task force or a requirement to be able to do so. Though a request by a local noble to the Sector Naval Command would certainly get him a task force (with sufficeint reason and if one is available) but normal day to day affairs and running of the Imperium doesn't require the Nobility to have that kind of pull.
"Help Stop that Corsair before it Jumps, my son is a hostage on board!" Now for that he goes directly to the Task Force Commander.
Of course if it is a Colonial unit belonging to that planet then the going through channels is a different matter and it depends on the Planetary government type as to how much control the Imperial Nobility have in Local Politics.
I have been thinking about this topic a bit now. ( BTW: Thanks for getting my mind working all.
Rereading some of the stuff I have on Traveller Nobility, I am more convinced that Traveller Nobility has actually little to do with the Imperial Navy. Matter of fact, except for the power associated with wealth, they don't appear to have all that much power in the first place.
They are sort of the go betweens between the Imperial Government and the local Government. Not even close to Colonial Govoners, Captain-Generals, etc. They are associated with planets, subsectors, sectors and domains but they don't rule those. The Planets are self governing, (for the most part) and the Imperium controls Trade (usually by makeing sure it freely flows) and general defense of the realm. The Nobility, since they don't really rule anything and since this isn't a truly feudal society, would have no reason to be able to just whistle up a task force or a requirement to be able to do so. Though a request by a local noble to the Sector Naval Command would certainly get him a task force (with sufficeint reason and if one is available) but normal day to day affairs and running of the Imperium doesn't require the Nobility to have that kind of pull.
That presupposes that the two invariably would pull in different directions. But if a noble who exercises his Imperial Mandate runs a grave risk of getting clobbered for it, very few will do it, and those who do will have good reason to make sure they're doing the right thing. In which case the whole problem becomes moot.
I'd expect the dukes to refrain from interfering in combat doctrine, and if they do decide to interfere the odds are that they'll both want their navies to follow IN doctrine, but if one of them thinks his way is better, you have a problem, sure. But these things happen when allied navies cooperate. It really has nothing to do with a divided chain of command.
You'd get the exact same problem if two different fleet admirals insisted on two different doctrines.
Hans
I disagree. IMO the duke controls the duchy navy, but not the IN fleets stationed in his duchy, nor the planetary navies. Unless he exercises his Imperial Mandate, that is. But he should only do that when he is sure that a situation has arisen of which the sector admiral is not aware and he is convinced that the local IN Fleet Admiral is mismanaging the situation. The Imperial Mandate is, IMO, over and above day-to-day authority.
Hans
I think most of the confusion stems from which prism the Imperial military is viewed. If you look at it as a feudal structure, it makes perfect sense and there are no difficulties. Looking at the thing from a modern military bent is where we run into problems. Since the Imperium is nominally feudal, maybe we need to alter how we perceive the structure as opposed to tryingto shoehorn the structure to fit our perceptions.
BetterThanLife
SOC-14 1K
Looking at the Imperium as a Great Feudal Empire has its drawback as well. Unlike a Feudal system the "commoners" don't owe fealty to the Nobles. The Planets are virtually all self governed, (to the point of establishing their own colonies on other worlds even.) They conduct wars, both on their own planet and interstellar wars against their neighbors. (As long as they don't disrupt trade much or violate the Imperial Rules of War.)
While the Nobles owe Fealty to the Emperor the rest of the system doesn't follow. Perhaps we are putting too much Feudal thought into Modern Military operations.
I agree completely. The Imperium is not a Feudal system. It is a political system constructed 2,000+ years from now by someone with knowledge of all sorts of different political systems and grafted onto an oligarchy masquerading as a democracy, then aged for 1,100 years. It has som feudal aspects, but it is not really feudal.
Hans
BetterThanLife
SOC-14 1K
I disagree. IMO the duke controls the duchy navy, but not the IN fleets stationed in his duchy, nor the planetary navies. Unless he exercises his Imperial Mandate, that is. But he should only do that when he is sure that a situation has arisen of which the sector admiral is not aware and he is convinced that the local IN Fleet Admiral is mismanaging the situation. The Imperial Mandate is, IMO, over and above day-to-day authority.
Hans </font>[/QUOTE]Hans,
A couple of questions.
1. In your opinion what exactly is the Duchy Navy? (As there is no such thing in canon.)
Is it:
A. The numbered Active Duty Fleet assigned, in general 1 per Subsector.
B. The Numbered Reserve Fleet, comprised of old obsolecent, yet still useful cast offs from the Imperial Navy.
C. Locally Raised by the Subsector as a whole, Colonial Fleet.
D. Locally Raised by the planet that happens to be the Ducal Seat.
E. The Dukes Huscarles.
F. A combination of some of the above.
G. Something completely Different. (Please explain.)
2. In your opinion what would the composition of the Duchy Fleet be?
A. A real battle fleet built around the core of a BatRon or two, with a half dozen or so CruRons, Escorts and Auxiliaries.
B. A less capable battle fleet with an old BatRon at the core, with a CruRon or two of New build Cruisers and a couple of Old Crurons, and a bunch of Destroyers and Destroyer Escorts.
C. A fleet designed for anti-piracy, safety patrols, customs etc. Perhaps with a CruRon as the core for serious cases, 2-6 Destroyer Flotillas, and a whole slew of squadrons based around ships in the Corvette to Destroyer Escort range. (300-2000 tons.)
D. Something different.
Anyone else is welcome to give their answers to this question. My Answers will be posted later.
It is another (and more correct) name for the subsector navies mentioned in High Guard as constituting the middle tier of the Imperial naval structure. It is an Imperial organization, but one distinct from the Imperial Navy. The system navies are likewise separate organizations. They are no more part of the duchy navy than the duchy navy is part of the IN.
That much is canon. (Except for calling them duchy navies instead of subsector navies, that is).
It is not the IN reserve fleet, MT material to the contrary notwithstanding. That is, I acknowledge that MT changed the subsector navies to reserve fleets (in the Character Generation system they changed it through 'search-and-replace', so it would be hard to deny that the MT authors meant them to change into the reserve fleets). I merely propose retconning this bit in an attempt to preserve the subsector navies AND keep the reserve fleets too.
That much is contrary to (MT) canon.
It is an organization raised and maintained by the duchy. The Imperial military taxes are collected by the duke who passes on a set percentage to the sector duke for the maintenance of sector-wide Imperial forces (chiefly the regular Imperial fleets). The duke uses the remainder to fund a duchy navy, a duchy army, and whatever other military organizations he feels his duchy needs.
The duchy navy gets most or all of its ships from the most advanced shipyards in the duchy. If this happens to be TL 15, then it buys few or no IN castoffs. If the duchy's top TL is less than 15, the duchy navy will buy IN castoffs if they feel they get value for their money. Of course, with the IN putting many of its obsolescent ships into the reserve fleets or mothballing them, there aren't that many IN castoffs to buy.
That part is all extrapolation/speculation. None of it is canon, but I would claim that it fits fairly neatly into what scanty canon we have (as long as we ignore a few bits of MT canon).
Other matters:
I suggest that 'Colonial' be defined as a term that refers to units that do not belong to the IN. Thus a duchy navy is composed of colonial units. So are system navies. The reserve fleets, however, are not.
The Dukes Huscarles are not part of the duchy's military forces, although the difference is very hard to spot. Basically the duke pays for his huscarles while the duchy pays for the duchy forces. If the duke were to be moved to another duchy, his Huscarles would go with him while the duchy forces would stay.
Duchy Navy, not Duchy Fleet (Very important distinction, that
). And it would depend very much on which duchy. It's composition would be whatever its duke (or more likely, his admiralty) believed the duchy needed to fulfill its duties to the duchy's systems and to the Emperor. It would also, of course, depend on the budget.Hans
mike wightman
SOC-14 10K
Going through channels takes too long, that's the whole point of the noble system.Originally posted by Bhoins:
Actually if the Marquis has a Piracy problem he would be better served if he went through channels as opposed to tasking the Task Force directly. Now if it was more like;
"Help Stop that Corsair before it Jumps, my son is a hostage on board!" Now for that he goes directly to the Task Force Commander.
Of course if it is a Colonial unit belonging to that planet then the going through channels is a different matter and it depends on the Planetary governemtn type as to how much control the Imperial Nobility have in Local Politics.
A high noble Marquis is associated with a system, he is that system's representative to the Imperium and also the Imperium's ambassador to that system - he doesn't rule the system. If the system has a piracy problem and an Imperial squadron jumps insystem the noble "politely requests" the squadron to act in the name of the Emperor in order to defend the system from the piracy threst - that is, after all, what the Imperial Navy is supposed to do. The Imperium controls the space between planets and all that
Unless the squadron is acting under more pressing orders then the squadron has to comply.
This is one of the most fun topics to debate I've been in on these boards. It's always good to bounce ideas around in order to help sort through the mess.I have been thinking about this topic a bit now. ( BTW: Thanks for getting my mind working all.)
There probably is no one true model of how things work, everyone has MTU variations, but the noble system of Traveller has always confused me. Thanks to this discussion I now have a much better idea of how I'll do things IMTU.
For most nobles I would agree with you, but for the high nobility I think they have all the power they need, and they can definitely command Imperial forces, their Imperial Mandate says so.
MT IE says of high nobles on page 13:
How else is Duchess Delphine responsible for the appointment of Sector Admiral Santanocheev?
I agree.
Again, it is because of the distances involved and the communication delay it causes, that a high noble can mobilise Imperial forces. Waiting ten weeks for the message to reach the sector capital from Regina to inform the sector Duke that piracy is rife around Efate, can you please send help, is absolutely ridiculous. Worse still is what a Zhodani fleet could do while authorization is sought from the sector Duke to mobilize the fleet. I don't believe that the Imperial Navy is allowed to declare a state of war, that's a job for the local high noble - usually the subsector Duke.
The Imperium controls trade and protects memeber worlds. How, if not by the authority of the local high nobles to direct Imperial forces to the benefit of the member worlds?
The local high noble is the local Emperor, how much influence does the Emperor have over the Navy?
And most don't. The vast majority of the Imperial nobility are part of the bureaucracy and don't have the Imperial Mandate - they are functionaries with posh titles.
(Note: That is not AFAIK canon (unless it is mentioned somewhere in GT:Nobles. It's actually an idea that I came up with to explain how Santanocheev could go from being a rear admiral in charge of Navy Intelligence for a single subsector to sector admiral in charge of a whole sector in two short years. I felt there had to be patronage involved and I felt that Delphine was a likelier source of patronage than a distant Emperor.)
I would suggest that this appointment is an example of a noble exercising the Imperial Mandate. Normally a sector admiral would be appointed by the Admiralty at Capital. However, through some unfortunate concatenation of events, all the sector admirals in the Spinward Marches sector died, retired, or were invalided out in a very short span of time (I don't know just how many sector admirals a sector has, but it probably isn't more than four or five, if that many). Instead of letting the senior fleet admiral take over, Delphine exercised the Imperial Mandate and appointed Santy over the head of scores of fleet admirals.
Of course, Santy's appointment would have to be confirmed by Capital, but in the meantime he was running the show (Until some of the sector admirals from Deneb and Corridor showed up, that is). And Delphine was running the risk of an Imperial chewing out (She propably got one too).
Hans
mike wightman
SOC-14 10K
It is indeed mentioned in GT Nobles, a book I had only briefly skimmed until this thread. It's fast becoming one of mu favourites.
Page 107:
Page 107:
The same passage implies that Delphine would have taken personal command of the Fifth Frontier War, but her age and frailty prevented this. Hence the promotion.
BetterThanLife
SOC-14 1K
It is another (and more correct) name for the subsector navies mentioned in High Guard as constituting the middle tier of the Imperial naval structure. It is an Imperial organization, but one distinct from the Imperial Navy. The system navies are likewise separate organizations. They are no more part of the duchy navy than the duchy navy is part of the IN.</font>[/QUOTE]So another equivalent name (though longer winded so Duchy would probably work better) would be Subsector Colonial Navy?
So you also believe that there should be an Imperial Level Reserve Fleet in addition to the Duchy Navies?
If you allow the Reserve Fleets, in addition to the ships transferred to the Imperial Navy Reserve, to include the Colonial Navies when called up, then the Reserve Fleets would be peace time, smaller than the Regular Navy Fleets, but war time bigger than the Regular Fleets, and there would be enough transferred ships for both purposes.
Funny it appears to be similar to the extrapolation that I did.
It also doesn't truly violate MT canon. MT Canon didn't mention Colonial Fleets, but it doesn't say they don't exist either. (At least as far as I have found researching this topic so far.)
Duchy Navy, not Duchy Fleet (Very important distinction, that
). And it would depend very much on which duchy. It's composition would be whatever its duke (or more likely, his admiralty) believed the duchy needed to fulfill its duties to the duchy's systems and to the Emperor. It would also, of course, depend on the budget.Hans </font>[/QUOTE]THe difference between Fleet and Navy is largely a matter of perspective. From the Duchy it is a Navy but from the point of view of the Imperial Navy it is at most a Fleet, more likely an outsized Squadron or Task Force.
I agree that the composition would likely be dictated by the view on what the Duchy needs. However given the typical scale of Pirates and Merchants, (there are extremely few non-military ships in canon that exceed 1000tons and most are under 6000tons. The only canon mention of nonmilitary ships I have seen that exceed 5000 tons are the civilian version of the AHL and the Tug in Sup-9 that can haul 5000 tons of cargo making it a total of 10,000 tons, ships belonging to the K'kree, and the Aslan Ihatei Transport. (Is the Comon Imperial Transport Military or civilian?) There is the occasional passing mention of large bulk ore carriers, but never any specs or actual sizes. I am sure there are probably a few out there, possibly even in a canon source that I missed, however the vast bulk of non-military traffic appears to be smaller than a destroyer.
So for common everyday use, in a Duchy that isn't expecting an invasion by a major interstellar power, the Duchy would hardly need more than a handful of cruisers and the bulk of the Duchy Navy would be in the Corvette to Destroyer Escort range with the normal big guns coming as a Destroyer. (And only in extremely unusual circumstances would something with the firepower of a Cruiser be required.) Even in the EA material in T20 the majority of the Solomani Commerce Raiders are less than 5000 Tons. (Mostly being Corvettes to Destroyer Escorts) The Flagship for the Commerce Raiding Squadron is an obsolete Light Cruiser. The typical Zhodani Commerce Raider is in the 600 Ton range. The Typical Vargr Corsair is 400 Tons. I am not saying there won't be the occasional Capital Ship, nor am I saying that Capital Ship Firepower wouldn't be occasionally neccessary, but the majority of the time a couple of Gazelles, Lucifers, Ramadas, Fireys or lowly Type-Ts would handle the majority of the missions that a Duchy Navy would have.
BetterThanLife
SOC-14 1K
Going through channels takes too long, that's the whole point of the noble system.</font>[/QUOTE]But time is relative. If he goes through channels, and most couriers are J5-J6, and Fleet HQ is reasonably located, (Spinward Marches, Mora or Rhylanor vs. Regina, Trin or Glisten. Ley Sector, Depot or Dukh, as opposed to Anapabar.) as long as you aren't on the back of beyond, your turn around time is relatively quick. (4-6 weeks tops.) When a Jump takes a week, most military operations, that aren't within a single system, are dealing with time frames of months anyway. D-Day took months to plan and organize and that was less than 100 miles. They left at night and got there at dawn.Originally posted by Sigg Oddra:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Bhoins:
Actually if the Marquis has a Piracy problem he would be better served if he went through channels as opposed to tasking the Task Force directly. Now if it was more like;
"Help Stop that Corsair before it Jumps, my son is a hostage on board!" Now for that he goes directly to the Task Force Commander.
Of course if it is a Colonial unit belonging to that planet then the going through channels is a different matter and it depends on the Planetary governemtn type as to how much control the Imperial Nobility have in Local Politics.
Without that communication with channels how does the Marquis know if the Squadron has a more pressing mission or not? (Matter of fact how does the Squadron Commander know if he has a more pressing mission or not?) Keeping with the Marquis Mille Falcs. The Squadron Commander's orders may read "Move to STROUDEN. Best speed. There join up with Battlegroup 71 and assist their operations."
Battlegroup 71 may be doing nothing more than gunnery drills and a slight delay may have no impact. Battlegroup may be moving to conduct a preemptive deep raid against Zhodani Naval bases in Querion Subsector and stop the Fifth Frontier war before it starts.
You don't send more couriers around with your battle plans than absolutely neccessary.
mike wightman
SOC-14 10K
Neither CT nor MT mention Colonial fleets. They both mention Colonial squadrons; CT says they are part of planetary navies; MY says they are included in the Reserve fleet.
mike wightman
SOC-14 10K
Sector Fleet HQ is on Mora in the Spinward Marches, isn't it? Alongside the sector Duke who appoints the sector Admiral
I chose the example deliberately to show how it would be Norris, during peace time, who would direct the use of Imperial forces in the Duchy of Regina rather than wait ten weeks to hear from sector HQ.
It had to be Norris who ordered the Imperialization of Colonial forces and the mobilization of the regular military at the start of the Fifth Frontier War, because otherwise there would be a ten week delay minimum before the Imperial military could respond.
In the real world, not according to the Traveller univers. One week at a time is all you need to plan, you may have to plan up to five weeks ahead if you're not very good at itWhen a Jump takes a week, most military operations, that aren't within a single system, are dealing with time frames of months anyway. D-Day took months to plan and organize and that was less than 100 miles. They left at night and got there at dawn.
The squadron commander has his orders. He knows how to interpret them. He can tell the Marquis to get lost, but he'd better have the authority to back it up when the Marquis does go through channels.
You have to go back to the Age of Sail paradigm where a Ship's Captain, or feet Admiral, had broad orders and could then use his judgement for unforeseen circumstance - and face a court martial if he got it wrong.
The beauty of the noble system is that a squadron or fleet is never more than a couple of jumps away from someone with the authority to change the operational orders - the high noble - but it is the noble who will carry the can if it all goes horribly wrong.
The commander of the squadron would have to also be ordered to ignore the Imperial Mandate of anyone lower than the sector Duke, or possibly the subsector Duke instead, otherwise the Marquis could override those movement orders.
Basically, regular Navy ships would be moved strategically under sector orders, which can't be interfered with, but once in a subsector would then be available to Marquis-to-Duke high nobility if there is a need.
He _might_ rule the system, though. Planetary/system rulers are prime candidates for being given noble titles.
Even if the Marquis (or Baron, or whoever) doesn't rule the system, he/she/it is likely to be very close to the people that do.
Kind of like a constitutional monarch or a figurehead President, in many cases, I suspect.
Or the Pope.
A request from a planetary Marquis (or Baron, or whoever else is the senior local noble - not all worlds have a Marquis) would almost invariably be a request from the planetary/system government, whatever the actual relationship of that noble to the government.
I don't believe, incidentally, that these nobles can actually give orders to regular fleet elements. If this is implied in GT: Nobles, I feel that it is a mistake. On-world civilian bureaucrats, maybe. Imperial fleets, nope. But polite requests are another matter...
I don't accept that High Nobles are powerless bureaucrats. Rather, they become high nobles because they are already powerful. Of course, in most cases their titles don't actually make them more powerful...
Rank and honour nobles are different, of course.
BetterThanLife
SOC-14 1K
Neither CT nor MT mention Colonial fleets. They both mention Colonial squadrons; CT says they are part of planetary navies; MY says they are included in the Reserve fleet. </font>[/QUOTE]Again a matter of perspective. (Squadron, Fleet, Navy.) If a Planet raises more than one squadron, is it a Colonial Squadron or a Colonial Fleet or a Colonial Navy? Unless they are serving in Active Imperial Service, in times of war or other need, then they will be owned and maintained by the locality that raised them and be called either a Fleet or Squadron. Now the act of Imperializing them may assign them to different fleets, or assign them to the same fleet, but they would be assigned as squadrons of that fleet as opposed to being a Reserve Fleet of their own. (Or not depending if you only allow one Reserve Fleet per Subsector, I personally am inclined toward this view that there is one Reserve Fleet per Subsector.)
Colonial Squadrons are part of the Reserve Fleet, I never said they weren't. But it doesn't say they are the only component of the Reserve Fleet.
According to the various canon resources, Colonial elements can be organized at the Planetary Level (LBB5, TA7, MT Players Manual and Rebellion Source Book.), the Subsector Level, (LBB5).
Reserve Fleets are equipped with obsolsecent - but still useful - starships which have been retired from front line Imperial Service; they are staffed by personnel serving in the reserves (technically in the service of the Imperium, but without the status of strict Imperial Navy Duty.) (MT Rebellion Sourcebook, similarily in TA-7 but this time with the term Reservist).
Yet we have already discussed that Colonial Squadrons raised by places like Mora, Rhylanor, Trin or Glisten wouldn't want or require old, obsolecens ships when they can build the latest standards. So it seems that Colonial Squadrons aren't the only component of a Reserve Fleet. THB and TA7 also mention Naval Reservists. While the term Reserve may have several meanings, Reservists virtually universally implies part time, or no longer serving but subject to recall, individuals. Coincidentally implied in the quoted statement from MT Rebellion Sourcebook. Colonial Squadrons, must by their nature and mission, be full time manned. So it implies that both make up the "Reserve Fleets." None of the material says one exists without the other.
BetterThanLife
SOC-14 1K
Sector Fleet HQ is on Mora in the Spinward Marches, isn't it? Alongside the sector Duke who appoints the sector Admiral
I chose the example deliberately to show how it would be Norris, during peace time, who would direct the use of Imperial forces in the Duchy of Regina rather than wait ten weeks to hear from sector HQ.
It had to be Norris who ordered the Imperialization of Colonial forces and the mobilization of the regular military at the start of the Fifth Frontier War, because otherwise there would be a ten week delay minimum before the Imperial military could respond. </font>[/QUOTE]How do you figure 10 weeks? Naval Courier, or TJ is a 6 week turn around. Further, because of the nature of communication in Traveller, once actual war starts Forward Command Posts would be set up, either for Fleet Commanders or deputies. The primary axis would be for the actual commander, secondary situations would be for Deputies. Further reducing communication lag.
In the real world, not according to the Traveller univers. One week at a time is all you need to plan, you may have to plan up to five weeks ahead if you're not very good at it</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />When a Jump takes a week, most military operations, that aren't within a single system, are dealing with time frames of months anyway. D-Day took months to plan and organize and that was less than 100 miles. They left at night and got there at dawn.
</font>[/QUOTE]What makes you think that large scale military operations would take less time in the future than they do now? The planning stage generally takes longer than the actual operational stage.The squadron commander has his orders. He knows how to interpret them. He can tell the Marquis to get lost, but he'd better have the authority to back it up when the Marquis does go through channels.
You have to go back to the Age of Sail paradigm where a Ship's Captain, or feet Admiral, had broad orders and could then use his judgement for unforeseen circumstance - and face a court martial if he got it wrong.
The beauty of the noble system is that a squadron or fleet is never more than a couple of jumps away from someone with the authority to change the operational orders - the high noble - but it is the noble who will carry the can if it all goes horribly wrong.</font>[/QUOTE]However that assumes that the operational commanders and the local nobility are kept in the loop on the broad, overall strategic planning cycle. To include knowing what are deception plans, all the Intel, what the estimates on the enemy intentions are, etc. Military and Intelligence operational realities say that is not likely or possible. Just because, in your own infinite wisdom and long experience as a Squadron Commander, you feel you have time to listen to the local Marquis that you need to take out a Pirate base that will only delay your deployment by 3-4 weeks. But you don't know what the top level plans actually are. The Marquis believes he has all the answers. Yet his planet might be set up to be bait.
Ever hear of a place called Coventry. The City was sacrificed without warning, though how much the British could have actually done to protect the city and population is debatable, to keep the Germans from finding out that the British had cracked their codes.
Some lowly squadron command isn't going to have that much information. And if the orders can exclude Imperial Mandate then all orders would have that boilerplated into them, if for no other reason than to disguise the ones that really need them. (Though more likely to keep the local nobility from fragging up the High Commands plans.)
