Imperial Marines vs Zhodani Consular Guard

[McPerth]

now the Guard do include Proles among their numbers (almost all Enlisted), but they are Cooks, Drivers, (junior) Pilots, Gunners, Comms Specialists, Armorers, Robotics Techs and such, basically any job where it would be a waste to give to a Psionic Officer/Commissioned Specialist, and they pick the best applicants to do these jobs. the Guard keeps a small "Tail" normally borrowing personnel from other services to work their "Tail" jobs, but they do have their own for the stuff outsiders aren't qualified on or in case their are no warm bodies on hand to borrow.

See that in CT:AM4 Basic CharGen the roll to enter the Guards is 14+, with DMs being +1 for Str 7+, +2 for PSI 9+ and +3 for SOC A+.

That means that a prole, as he wil not have PSI 9+ nor SOC A+ will have to roll a 13+ (if his STR is 7+) in 2d6 to join it, and a low PSI noble with a 10+ (assuming again STR is 7+), while any carácter with PSI 9+, as his SOC will automatically be A+ will join on a 9+ (8+ if his STR is 7+).

So, according AM4 Basic CharGen no prole may join the Guards.

In AM4 Mercenary CharGen, proles may join the Guards, as roll is 10+, with DM +1 is PSI 9+ and +2 if STR is 7+. SO, a prole (or low level noble) with STR 7+ may join it on a 8+.

It seems we have quite contradictory information here...

 

[Meteoric Assault]

See that in CT:AM4 Basic CharGen the roll to enter the Guards is 14+, with DMs being +1 for Str 7+, +2 for PSI 9+ and +3 for SOC A+.

That means that a prole, as he wil not have PSI 9+ nor SOC A+ will have to roll a 13+ (if his STR is 7+) in 2d6 to join it, and a low PSI noble with a 10+ (assuming again STR is 7+), while any carácter with STR 9+, as his SOC will automatically be A+ will join on a 9+ (8+ if his STR is 7+).

So, according AM4 Basic CharGen no prole may join the Guards.

In AM4 Mercenary CharGen, proles may join the Guards, as roll is 10+, with DM +1 is PSI 9+ and +2 if STR is 7+. SO, a prole (or low level noble) with STR 7+ may join it on a 8+.

It seem we have quite contradictory information here...

There is also the reality and it was mentioned in JTAS #11 page 27. Zhodani Military Organization, "Of course, the technicians, drivers, gunners, non-commissioned officers (NCOs) and so on are proles". while contradictory as you have pointed out, it does make a lot of sense.

I would say that Prole members of the Zhodani Army are selected on the basis of motivation, technical proficiency , and professionalism and serve tours in the Consular Guard. eventually they return to the regular army and saw they are entitled to wear a guards badge (something like the Soviet Guards Badge) on their uniform to denote service in the guard.

 

[McPerth]

Se also that his same article in JTAS 11, unlike other sources that tells us all Guards are nobles, says (page 26) that most of the personnel in a commando groupment are psi talents, so hinting that some non psionic personnel is also on them. Again contradictory information...

I like your idea about most of the tail in the Guards being detached Army personnel, but would they be seen as Guards in their term or as detached army personnel?

 

[Meteoric Assault]

Se also that his same article in JTAS 11, unlike other sources taht tells us all Guards are nobles, says (page 26) that most of the personnel in a commando groupment are psi talents, so hinting that some non psionic personnel is also on them. Again contradictory information...

I like your idea about most of the tail in the Guards being detached Army personnel, but would they be seen as Guards in their term or as detached army personnel?

Well if we agree on the term with the guards as being something of a great honor, something earned, they are considered "honorary guardsman", but are not titled as Guards. I was venture they would stay on the Army tables for Char Gen.

 

[Murph]

I can see that the Consular Guard would be more risk adverse since they have a far shallower pool of replacements to draw from.

 

[aramis]

Se also that his same article in JTAS 11, unlike other sources taht tells us all Guards are nobles, says (page 26) that most of the personnel in a commando groupment are psi talents, so hinting that some non psionic personnel is also on them. Again contradictory information...

I like your idea about most of the tail in the Guards being detached Army personnel, but would they be seen as Guards in their term or as detached army personnel?

Nope, just reflecting the rules mechanics. It's possible to generate a Zho Noble who has no ability to use his PSR, because he failed every test for talent. Rolled up a PSR 12 guy that way once. Lots of power, nothing to do with it.

 

[mike wightman]

It is also possible to roll a 12 for social and thus be a noble and roll a 2 for psi...

 

[aramis]

It is also possible to roll a 12 for social and thus be a noble and roll a 2 for psi...

Yup... but even with a PSR 2, it's possible to wind up with all the powers (and be unable to use most of them without drugs).

Telepathy: Shield (1), Life Detection (1 to close, 2 to short), Telempathy (2 to close).
Clairavoyance: Sense (1 to close)(2 to medium)
Telekinesis: up to 10g (at close), 1g (2 to medium)
Awareness: Suspended animation (requires psi drug to use)

Teleport requires PSR 5+

Special isn't formalized in GDW CT sources... but could include a variety of useful but low power talents.

 

[mike wightman]

You can pick up talent training during prior service too...

 

[mike wightman]

See that in CT:AM4 Basic CharGen the roll to enter the Guards is 14+, with DMs being +1 for Str 7+, +2 for PSI 9+ and +3 for SOC A+.

That means that a prole, as he wil not have PSI 9+ nor SOC A+ will have to roll a 13+ (if his STR is 7+) in 2d6 to join it, and a low PSI noble with a 10+ (assuming again STR is 7+), while any carácter with STR 9+, as his SOC will automatically be A+ will join on a 9+ (8+ if his STR is 7+).

So, according AM4 Basic CharGen no prole may join the Guards.

In AM4 Mercenary CharGen, proles may join the Guards, as roll is 10+, with DM +1 is PSI 9+ and +2 if STR is 7+. SO, a prole (or low level noble) with STR 7+ may join it on a 8+.

It seem we have quite contradictory information here...

I wonder if the mercenary version has a lower entry roll to represent the proles that are drafted into the Guards?

In basic generation a prole can roll to enter the Guards, fail (automatically), and then submit to the draft hoping to roll a 2.

 

[aramis]

You can pick up talent training during prior service too...

Note that, per DonM, Talent training simply allows you to roll again (with the continued modifier for the 7th roll, etc.) for a new power.

Which I think is totally bogus, because it makes talent training practically worthless.

(Yes, this was a major discussion point behind the scenes for the last two years.)

 

[mike wightman]

Interesting rules variant, but I agree with you.

The rules as written state you gain the talent with no roll required, and that is in both the Zhodani and Droyne AMs.

 

[McPerth]

Yup... but even with a PSR 2, it's possible to wind up with all the powers (and be unable to use most of them without drugs).

And don't forget the Zhodani can raise their PSR by training it (in Guards noble/intendent traiing table in basic Chargen, 1 roll in 6 is +1 PSR, and 1 in 6 is +2 PSR).

So, this PSR 2 noble may well end with a decent PSR after his career...