CT Only: Mentioned in Broadsword?

[Spinward Scout]

It was mentioned in CT Broadsword that their Gauss Rifles are 'fitted to fire 4cm RAM shoot-through Grenades.'

Does anyone know:

• where the stats are for these?
• if these just go in the Gauss barrel, a magazine, or an add-on part of the rifle?
• and/or if there is something similar in another book?

Because these would be fun.

 

[mike wightman]

Stats are in CT LBB:4 Mercenary and Striker.

It's a grenade you fit over the muzzle of the rifle and then launch by firing a round. Like the WWII rifle grenades.

The idea of picatinny rails and m-lock mounted weapon accessories is way beyond TL15 in the OTU

 

[Spinward Scout]

Awesome!

Thanks!

 

[Condottiere]

I'm told it's not that great for the barrel.

However, since barrel wear isn't an issue for Traveller.

Also, warhead size can increase.

 

[BackworldTraveller]

Those work by using the propellant gasses from the rifle cartridge...How the heck does the Gauss launched one work? As it is noted as a RAM grenade, is it just the rocket bit?

 

[Condottiere]

A spigot mortar consists mainly of a solid rod or spigot, onto which a hollow tube in the projectile fits—inverting the normal tube-mortar arrangement.

 

[mike wightman]

LBB4 says:

Rocket Assisted Multi-purpose (RAM) Grenade Launcher: Incorporating rocket assistance
to give the round superior range and flat trajectory capability, the RAM grenade is fired both
from special launchers and as rifle grenades from the ACR and Gauss rifle. The RAM grenade
launcher fires 40 mm RAM grenades at Initial velocities of 150 to 200 meters per second, the
grenade's booster charge accelerating it to velocities of 500 to 600 meters per second.

 

[McPerth]

if these just go in the Gauss barrel, a magazine, or an add-on part of the rifle?

I always assumed it was like the M203 attached to the M16, not as the picture Mike showed us. This way, you can fire both, the greande or the gauss rifle usual ammo...



In any case, unless using flechete (one of the options for the RAM grenades, according also LBB4) I see quite dangerous to use it in a ship, as I understand the combats in Broadsword are...

 

[mike wightman]

Hence my quote from LBB4 to avoid confusion and my slightly tongue in cheek post about modular small arms being above Imperial TL.
The Traveller RAM grenade is a shoot through rifle grenade - it says so - not an M203 or similar attachment.

 

[McPerth]

The Traveller RAM grenade is a shoot through rifle grenade - it says so - not an M203 or similar attachment.

Yes, it says it, but I jsut said what I have assume3d to now...

As I have no real military experience (just my conscript term, but not in combat unit), and less so in grenades, what's the advantage of shoot through rifle grenades versus the attached grenade launcher as the M203?

As I said, I see the hindrance of not being able to use the reguloar ammo while the grenade is attached, but if they are used it must have some advantages too...

 

[mike wightman]

More payload.

A TL8 RAM grenade is likely to be the equivalent to the rpg-7 or later warheads.

 

[Grav_Moped]

what's the advantage of shoot through rifle grenades versus the attached grenade launcher as the M203?

Logistics. All you need to supply are the rods (not requiring terribly precise machining) and blank cartriges (already in the supply chain), and any standard rifle can be used as a small, short-range mortar.

If you're using them on an advance on fixed defenses, your troops don't need to carry the GL adapter hardware around after the initial grenade salvo. Once in contact or in the enemy's trenches, tossed grenades should suffice.

 

[Grav_Moped]

I'm pretty sure shoot-through grenades would not work well with gauss weaponry. I can see how someone might look at the system and think they would, though.

 

[McPerth]

More payload.

Logistics. All you need to supply are the rods (not requiring terribly precise machining) and blank cartriges (already in the supply chain), and any standard rifle can be used as a small, short-range mortar.

If you're using them on an advance on fixed defenses, your troops don't need to carry the GL adapter hardware around after the initial grenade salvo. Once in contact or in the enemy's trenches, tossed grenades should suffice.

OK, makes sense

I'm pretty sure shoot-through grenades would not work well with gauss weaponry. I can see how someone might look at the system and think they would, though.

Having been just reading about them now (as I said, I had little to no idea), I agree. If they base there propulsion in the same gases that propell the bullet, they won't as the Gauss Rifle does not produce any...

 

[kilemall]

Rifle grenades of the affix to barrel type were used in WWI and quite extensively in WWII. You can see them in background use in Saving Private Ryan.

This is a really good overview. There were also French, German and Soviet versions.

I’m guessing the model for the standalone version is the M79. The Soviet autoGL would cover that.

M79 grenade launcher - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

AGS-17 - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

 

[Grav_Moped]

OK, makes sense



Having been just reading about them now (as I said, I had little to no idea), I agree. If they base there propulsion in the same gases that propell the bullet, they won't as the Gauss Rifle does not produce any...

Depends on the implementation -- not the gas, of course, there isn't any -- but how the acceleration mechanism would interact with a rod interface* and a high-mass payload instead of the shorter and much lighter projectiles for which it is designed. Coil and rail guns are useful mostly due to maximizing muzzle velocity; it seems to me that they're "geared too high" to effectively lob heavy grenades. And the earliest conceptions of gauss guns used fixed permanent magnets, suitably spaced...

This analysis probably requires math, physics, and engineering skills that I lack.

‐-------------
* either a homogeneous ferrous rod, or one with alternating ferrous and non-ferrous segments for optimal interaction with the weapon.

 

[Diveguy]

Hence my quote from LBB4 to avoid confusion and my slightly tongue in cheek post about modular small arms being above Imperial TL.
The Traveller RAM grenade is a shoot through rifle grenade - it says so - not an M203 or similar attachment.

I always put this one down as another example of the late 70's/early 80's "not really incorporating current military tech" aspect of certain weapons. Rifle grenades had been out of play for over a decade in any modern units by this point, and even the Soviets were developing their own version of the 203 (with a smaller grenade). So, I'm in the "Attachment to Gauss rifle" camp on this one, not the "somehow uses the needle round to drive things forward" side.

 

[Spinward Scout]

This analysis probably requires math, physics, and engineering skills that I lack.

That's what your character sheet is for. Roll EDU 8+

 

[Grav_Moped]

That's what your character sheet is for. Roll EDU 8+

Nice try, and I appreciate the implied compliment but I don't get +DMs for EDU -- it's only about 8.

 

[Condottiere]

Experiences vary, and may depend on those specific to specific militaries, their experiences and their perceived needs.

The all in one sidearm seems more recommended to long term, (fairly) high trained professionals.

For militia and draftees, you want to keep it as simple as possible.